ICP OES testing

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jason.kennedy.98478 said:
So has anyone sent in their tap water and DI water to Triton or ATI for analysis?
Click to expand...

We've certainly reviewed some in the chemistry forum. Is there an issue you are trying to figure out?

If you get it done, the interpretation can be nontrivial, so don't just assume there is some problem with your DI because a sensitive technique like ICP detects something, and also don't assume it is from the RO/DI (for example, a recent issue was a float switch in the RO/DI barrel with a rusting wing nut).
 
My DI resin exhausts after about 100 gallons. Part of this is my tap water TDS is in the 350 to 400 range and I have a line pressure of only 35 psi. Yes I know I need to get a booster pump, RO efficiency is 95% or so. But I was also wondering what is in my tap water (beyond the sad and uninformative CCR) and what's making it through the system to see if I need some special selective media to make the DI bed last longer.

ATI does advertise that they test RO water and haven't seen where Triton advertises that . And while both of these tests can be run on the same machine the methods are different. Also neither of those places list their ISO status and what methods they are validated on, that I have been able to find.

When sending out for testing like this at work both of those labs would not be considered legit labs due to the apparent lack of ISO accreditation.

So if I don't know what methods they're using and their methods aren't verified why would I trust any numbers I get from them as anything other than something generated by a random number generator
 
BRS
jason.kennedy.98478 said:
My DI resin exhausts after about 100 gallons. Part of this is my tap water TDS is in the 350 to 400 range and I have a line pressure of only 35 psi. Yes I know I need to get a booster pump, RO efficiency is 95% or so. But I was also wondering what is in my tap water (beyond the sad and uninformative CCR) and what's making it through the system to see if I need some special selective media to make the DI bed last longer.

ATI does advertise that they test RO water and haven't seen where Triton advertises that . And while both of these tests can be run on the same machine the methods are different. Also neither of those places list their ISO status and what methods they are validated on, that I have been able to find.

When sending out for testing like this at work both of those labs would not be considered legit labs due to the apparent lack of ISO accreditation.

So if I don't know what methods they're using and their methods aren't verified why would I trust any numbers I get from them as anything other than something generated by a random number generator
Click to expand...

What typically depletes DI resin is carbon dioxide since it easily gets through an RO membrane.

I wouldn't send a DI sample to Triton since they have optimized the method for seawater. Since ATI runs both intentionally, I'd use them if you really want to run the purified water.
 
Do you know the TDS after the RO?

I can't see it being especially informative to get an analysis of the effluent (since I do not know of any result that would give you any specific action to take), but if you go that route, I'd get the RO only effluent done, not the RO/DI. When a DI is depleted, the ions that are released are those that are held most weakly (e.g., ammonia/ammonium and silicate/silicic acid) rather than those that are incoming to it in the highest quantity, and presumably you want to know what is hitting the start of the DI and depleting it.
 
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I'm certainly no expert compared to the man above! But here is what I experienced. My well water tap is in the low 400's. I run from my water softener because I was told the water softener won't lower the TDS, but it will replace some of the contamination with easier to remove sodium....) and the RO gets it down to 15 or 20 which I think is great. I do run a booster pump to get this performance. I was running through mixed bed DI resin like crazy, added 2 more mixed bed DI resin chambers so I could at least be able to make a hundred gallons of zero TDS water without changing resin (500 gallon plus system.) I just started the ATI Essentials system and I did send my RODI vial in with my initial test and it showed 1117ug/l of silicon. My reef tank was high in this category also. I am preparing to try the BRS separate anion and cation resins before a mixed bed resin to see if I can focus on these silicates as per the BRS video on the subject, along with ATI's recomendation that I lower them. I will get that in place and do a 20% water change before my next test to see if they are going in the right direction. I hope all of that story is of some use.
 
Muttley000 said:
I'm certainly no expert compared to the man above! But here is what I experienced. My well water tap is in the low 400's. I run from my water softener because I was told the water softener won't lower the TDS, but it will replace some of the contamination with easier to remove sodium....) and the RO gets it down to 15 or 20 which I think is great. I do run a booster pump to get this performance. I was running through mixed bed DI resin like crazy, added 2 more mixed bed DI resin chambers so I could at least be able to make a hundred gallons of zero TDS water without changing resin (500 gallon plus system.) I just started the ATI Essentials system and I did send my RODI vial in with my initial test and it showed 1117ug/l of silicon. My reef tank was high in this category also. I am preparing to try the BRS separate anion and cation resins before a mixed bed resin to see if I can focus on these silicates as per the BRS video on the subject, along with ATI's recomendation that I lower them. I will get that in place and do a 20% water change before my next test to see if they are going in the right direction. I hope all of that story is of some use.
Click to expand...

Did you have elevated silicate in the aquarium? Was it causing a diatom problem?

Actually, while the effect is very small, sodium is harder to remove than calcium, but it doesn't precipitate on the membrane, so many people recommend it, despite it being a tiny bit harder to remove.
http://www.watertreatmentguide.com/membrane_rejection.htm
Calcium 93-99 rejection
Sodium 92-98 rejection
 
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Randy Holmes-Farley said:
Did you have elevated silicate in the aquarium? Was it causing a diatom problem?

Actually, while the effect is very small, sodium is harder to remove than calcium, but it doesn't precipitate on the membrane, so many people recommend it, despite it being a tiny bit harder to remove.
http://www.watertreatmentguide.com/membrane_rejection.htm
Calcium 93-99 rejection
Sodium 92-98 rejection
Click to expand...

Only slightly elevated in tank at 120 ug/l, but I have fought diatoms several times. I have a hundred gallon Rubbermaid with about a hundred pounds of rock sealed from light. My sponges don't grow leading me to believe the diatoms outcompete, and strip the silicates before the sponges can use them.

I will report my next testing back.
 
Muttley000 said:
Only slightly elevated in tank at 120 ug/l, but I have fought diatoms several times. I have a hundred gallon Rubbermaid with about a hundred pounds of rock sealed from light. My sponges don't grow leading me to believe the diatoms outcompete, and strip the silicates before the sponges can use them.

I will report my next testing back.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure that I'd overly worry about the silicate in the RO/DI then.

You said you had a reported 1117ug/l of silicon.

If you evaporate 1% of the tank volume daily, that is adding 11 ug/L per day.

That is less than I routinely dosed, of 200 ug/L about once a week (~29 ug/l per day).
 
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IF YOU HAD TO TAKE A REEFING EXAM, WOULD YOU PASS?

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