Increasing N&P in a newish tank?

[i_declare_bankruptcy]

Ever since my tank has cycled I've had near zero values for N&P. It's about two months old now and at one point I did have detectable levels (like, the test kits changed color ever so slightly but really weren't even on the scale) but those two values really stick close to zero. My bio load is medium I think? Here's the stock:

140 total gallons
Adult Tomini Tang
Juvenile Lemonpeel Tang
Juvenile Oscellaris
3 Ignitus Anthias
Cleaner Wrasse
3 Conchs
5 Snails
Live sand and rock

And my water:
pH 8.4
N 0
P 0
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
Salinity 1.0255
Temp 79-80
Cal 450
Mag 1300
kh 8

I do have some algae on the glass by the end of the day and my rocks are somewhat covered with some kind of minor algae but I'm just attempting to let the tank correct itself as many suggest on here. Corals look great but I think they could look and grow even better if there were actual nutrients in the water. I feed once a day one sheet of nori and a cube of mysis. I just dump it all in at once and I'd say the fish only eat like 5% of the cube lol.

I'd love to just stock the tank with more fish but I'm cautious about that as the tank is still young. Unfortunately I don't really have time to feed multiple times a day and I don't trust auto feeders.

What should I do to increase those nutrient levels?

 

[1WildBill]

What test kits are you using? Check the expiration dates?

 

[i_declare_bankruptcy]

They're all new and 2 different LFS confirm the results

 

[1WildBill]

Do you have any macro in the Sump or tank?

 

[Subsea]

Feed your tank. When algae grows, get janitors.

The two tangs that you have are herbivores and would enjoy some macro to eat. Why not grow some ornamental macro to compete with film algae and feeds tangs at same time?

 

[PDR]

I am dealing with a similar situation with my new tank. I only have 50~ gallons twv and I have 2 wrasses, 2 clowns and a small tang and for 4 months now I am getting no detectable no3 or p04. I feed very heavy 2x a day and used to feed the coral heavy as well. I have no skimmer and no macro algae.

Ive been told to dose nutrients, but at this point in the game I tend to think the tank is still a nutrient sink. Once it matures a bit I think things will balance out.

Do you have a sandbed? If so, are you cleaning it? IIRC you don't do water changes, is that right?

 

[i_declare_bankruptcy]

I am dealing with a similar situation with my new tank. I only have 50~ gallons twv and I have 2 wrasses, 2 clowns and a small tang and for 4 months now I am getting no detectable no3 or p04. I feed very heavy 2x a day and used to feed the coral heavy as well. I have no skimmer and no macro algae.

Ive been told to dose nutrients, but at this point in the game I tend to think the tank is still a nutrient sink. Once it matures a bit I think things will balance out.

Do you have a sandbed? If so, are you cleaning it? IIRC you don't do water changes, is that right?

Good memory! No water changes. My sand bed is quite thin, thin enough that my CUC is able to stir it up nightly. Since there isn't nuisance algae growing on it I don't see the need to clean it -- am I doing something wrong there?

I just unplugged my skimmer -- going to let it sit for a couple days and see if that makes a difference.

I too was told to dose nutrients; I'm going to give acro power a shot and see what it does for my corals.

So your take is that since our tanks are so young they're contiously absorbing N&P so they're undetectable and eventually we will hit a threshold where it starts showing up? Seems valid to me; I wonder if that means our nutrients will slingshot out of control when that threshold is hit :0

 

[i_declare_bankruptcy]

Do you have any macro in the Sump or tank?

I have an area to grow chaeto but haven't put any in yet since it has nothing to consume

 

[jda]

If you are growing film algae then you have enough N and P. Once you have enough, then you have enough... more will not help anything.

Throughput and availability are important - residual numbers on a test kit are not. ZEOVit explains it well where you will test near zero on a test kit, but there are massive amount of input and export. You do not need to use ZEOVit to do this and many methods can work with the goal of low residual values and lots of throughput.

BRS explains this well at about 1:15 to about 3:00 where the import and export is what is important:
https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/vide...the-zeovit-system-52-weeks-of-reefing-brs160/

Look for the signs that you have enough N and P - film algae is one of them.

 

[i_declare_bankruptcy]

...Throughput and availability are important - residual numbers on a test kit are not. ZEOVit explains it well where you will test near zero on a test kit, but there are massive amount of input and export. You do not need to use ZEOVit to do this and many methods can work with the goal of low residual values and lots of throughput...

I do have some film algae -- I have to clean the glass every 1.5-2 days. Some algae on the rocks too.

Why do people typically recommend certain elevated values for N&P (like 5ppm and 0.01-2ppm respectively)? I don't understand where my input and export comes from in my tank. I had my skimmer running pretty slowly/dry so only cleaning the cup once a week or two. Aside from cleaning filter socks there isn't anything else helping the live rock -- of which there's only like 90lbs in the tank (adding more now). Is the algae really consuming that much? The only input from me is feeding once a day and the waste from my fish.

I'm partially trying to increase those levels so I can increase the intensity if my LED's so my tank doesn't look so dark/drab. I've read that increasing the lighting intensity with too low levels of N&P can result in color loss and damaged health to the corals. Has this been true in your/anyone's experience?

 

[jda]

In a new tank, the aragonite is likely binding up most of the phospate. This will continue to happen, but as the aragonite fills up a bit, the level in the water will rise too. Any good bio filter with anoxic bacteria will lower nitrate - usually this happens better in more established tanks. Socks can also export quite a bit.

You need to have some N and P. These building blocks are necessary to grow and heal. However, once you have enough and are not growth limiting (on the low side), then more do not do you any good. People think that having more is good and that the corals can use more, but this is not true - just have some, but not too many - I think that they think of them as fuel instead of building blocks.

I have no idea about LEDs. Sorry. I use MH and I can put as many of them over a tank as I want with .1N and .01P and nothing gets hurt. Sunlight is about 2200 PAR for lots of acropora and low depth corals also with VERY low N and P levels in the ocean. This is likely a quality thing more than a quantity thing.

 

[i_declare_bankruptcy]

In a new tank, the aragonite is likely binding up most of the phospate. This will continue to happen, but as the aragonite fills up a bit, the level in the water will rise too. Any good bio filter with anoxic bacteria will lower nitrate - usually this happens better in more established tanks. Socks can also export quite a bit.

You need to have some N and P. These building blocks are necessary to grow and heal. However, once you have enough and are not growth limiting (on the low side), then more do not do you any good. People think that having more is good and that the corals can use more, but this is not true - just have some, but not too many - I think that they think of them as fuel instead of building blocks.

I have no idea about LEDs. Sorry. I use MH and I can put as many of them over a tank as I want with .1N and .01P and nothing gets hurt. Sunlight is about 2200 PAR for lots of acropora and low depth corals also with VERY low N and P levels in the ocean. This is likely a quality thing more than a quantity thing.

Thanks for all the info. Sounds like my tank is on the right path and not doomed as my LFS has led me to believe haha