Indonesia coral export halted?

becks · May 4, 2018

It would not bother me if wild corals were completely banned and the only exports are from maricultured companies, who were allowed to collect frags from wild colonies to culture into their own colonies for exporting.

JaimeAdams · May 4, 2018

This does not affect fish. Fish are still fair game and the amount of fish that this industry collects isn't even a blip on the radar of what is taken for food source.

There are people and companies working on captive breeding many marine fish species and there has been head way made for sure, but it is still a young industry with much to learn

This ban is all coral, not just wild coral, same thing with Fiji. I too would be fine with only Mariculture coral, but that is currently banned as well.

The thing that I think is going to hurt us long term is that the price to grow coral in the ocean compared to in a tank in someones basement is much different. I see threads every day about people complaining about the price and size of Aquacultured coral. If all we have is Aquacultured and Australian (until that gets banned too) it will chase people away from starting in the hobby.

@Floyd R Turbo Thanks for the update.

JaimeAdams · May 4, 2018

So, I was going to comment on all this is mute if the "Rumor" is not true.... However I just talked to our Transshipping company owner and he confirmed that the ban is indeed is TRUE!!!

VR28man · May 4, 2018

anit77 said:
I'm not trying to be sarcastic here.
But how big a tank and how many fish would a company need to get Tangs to spawn? Is this something that can even be done in large public aquariums, like the Tennessee or Georgia Aquariums?

If it takes something that sized it's not going to be economically feasible for a company to do.

Yellow tangs have been tried. Mainly because so many of them are sold (i.e. they have the biggest market), and because of the controversy over the fishery.

It’s been done, to a lot of difficulty. It’s not economical, and may not even be environmentally friendly when you consider all the water and electricity involves compared to getting very small juveniles in the wild (which has literally no environmental footprint to raise).

I think the problem is that they spend like 30 days in zooplankton form, compared to the days that something like a clown fish soends, and so is exponentially more difficult to keep alive.

Turbo's Aquatics · May 4, 2018

JaimeAdams said:
mute

*moot

(sorry...OCD)

shred5 · May 4, 2018

A little more:

https://www.reef2rainforest.com/2018/05/04/breaking-news-indonesia-halts-coral-exports/

and some good news today:

https://www.reef2rainforest.com/201...ologies-announces-aquacultured-convict-tangs/

EMeyer · May 4, 2018

I get a kick out of the "it wouldnt bother me if all wild collections were banned, I dont mind paying extra".

1. Must be nice to have limitless money. Many of us are on a budget and the hobby was already on the verge of being too expensive.
2. When the majority of hobbyists are priced out because corals and fish become even more expensive, what do you think is going to happen to your favorite LFS or online retailer? You think they can survive and stay in business on the backs of people who "dont mind paying a little more"? I do not think so.

I'll believe these bans have something to do with environmental protection when they also apply to sport and commercial fishing, both of which have orders of magnitude greater impact on marine ecosystems than the comparatively tiny number of animals collected for aquaria.

These bans are driven by people who "feel like" its a bad thing to take corals or fish off the reef. It is nothing less than a direct attack on the hobby and the industries that support it. This should be opposed by everyone attached to the hobby, regardless of your bank account and personal tolerance for overpriced coral frags.

Centerline · May 4, 2018

revhtree said:
Just read this as well.

Yikes

Turbo's Aquatics · May 4, 2018

EMeyer said:
These bans are driven by people who "feel like" its a bad thing to take corals or fish off the reef.

This is precisely correct. "feel" outweighing logic, reason, science, and fact. Try to hold a rational conversation with someone who just refuses to believe that people touching corals in their natural wild habitat could ever be a good thing - there's no winning that discussion. Now take that to a worldwide level with people with political connections and boatloads of cash behind them.

shred5 · May 4, 2018

Floyd R Turbo said:
This is precisely correct. "feel" outweighing logic, reason, science, and fact. Try to hold a rational conversation with someone who just refuses to believe that people touching corals in their natural wild habitat could ever be a good thing - there's no winning that discussion. Now take that to a worldwide level with people with political connections and boatloads of cash behind them.

Sometimes it just comes down to who can grease the pot more.

It makes no sense the hobby can not get together. This affects collectors, importers, wholesalers, distributors, Local fish stores, reef clubs, Aquaculture, Manufacturers, forums and us. All the money spent on high end corals...

This is random banning when cultured rock and corals are banned too..

tripdad · May 4, 2018

Has anyone from the industry, aquarium specific, begun to create any type of trade group to lobby on it's own behalf. Please excuse me if I'm missing an obvious fact. I'm in the auto aftermarket industry and years ago we had to band together to fight "crusher" laws that would have meant the end of most of the aftermarket. Sometimes it's not that lawmakers are hateful to our cause but uninformed of the real impact of the law they are voting on. They have thousands of pages of legislation to look at and cannot possibly read it all, hence interns. Yes, some college kid is telling your leaders what a bill means and how to vote. I'm sure the situation is the same in most of the world except I think corruption may be more of a factor. Only after we scream louder than the other side will we be heard. Empathy does not win battles, organized effort does. Where do i send my support? I know of PIJAC, but is there anyone more specific to the aquarium trade?

EMeyer · May 4, 2018

shred5 said:
It makes no sense the hobby can not get together. This affects collectors, importers, wholesalers, distributors, Local fish stores, reef clubs, Aquaculture, Manufacturers, forums and us.

I agree completely. Even unified we'd still be a small voice. But we cant even unify.

I think part of it comes from divisions within the hobby -- theres no shortage of reefing forum posters who say "wild collected corals don't survive anyway". There are people selling frags for several hundred dollars, daydreaming about how much theyll get to raise prices. There are people who don't have tangs so they arent worried about bans on tangs. etc.

Its short sighted. As you correctly note, *everyone* in the hobby will be harmed by the continuing closures.

First they came for the tangs, but I didnt have tangs so I didnt speak up...

At the very least, our hobby and associated industries should speak with a unified voice, small as that voice would be.

samnaz · May 4, 2018

cgdcinc said:
I hate to hear about people losing their jobs and business.
We aquaculture corals to seed reefs in Florida. Why not just go to aqua-cultured corals for the hobby? It may cost more for corals and you may not get everything you would like but I think it would make people more conscious about caring for the live stock. Same with fish. Just go to aqua cultured. It’s not easy but not impossible. It will cost more but not impossible.
Is it just cost that makes a lot of people want harvested livestock? Won’t people still be able to work at cultured facilities? It would be a transition for sure. Just thinking out loud.

I’m with you. It’s my dream to have my own invertebrate aquaculture farm some day.... yeah, it requires tons of money time and effort, but I’m going for it anyway.