Introducing Fish (No Quarantine)

[Eva Rose]

I started my 1st reef tank 2 years ago. R2R is a fantastic resource!! R2R is unparalleled, in my opinion, for being a fair, friendly and supportive forum. The experts on R2R are knowledgeable, interesting and want you to succeed.
Read articles/posts by @melypr1985 and @Humblefish for great information.
Example:
Fish and Treatment Guidelines (with chart)

 

[potatocouch]

The life stage of ich or velvet that forms a cyst, does so on any hard surface including grabs, snail shell, shrimp exoskeleton... Only way to deal with this is leave them in a fishless environment for 76 days.

No dumb questions, by the way

My peppermint shrimp is still alive though .. does ich (velvet) affect them?

The bristle starfish seems to be alive too; just the fish.

 

[Paul B]

How do one make a fish mutant from all of these diseases? Boost their well-being?

No, he's not kidding. My fish are immune and have been for almost 40 years. Even my 25 year olds.

 

[cmcoker]

My peppermint shrimp is still alive though .. does ich (velvet) affect them?

The bristle starfish seems to be alive too; just the fish.

No it doesn't. It could only form a cyst on it's exoskeleton which would not harm it. Ich and velvet only affect fish

 

[jsker]

I don't know who PaulB is but it seems I need to read some of his tank journo if he has one.

Let me introduce you to PaulB link

Also read this article link

Things have changed since I started reefing in the mid 80's and I along with other have changed to newer methods of reef keep. Saying that, I still go back to some of the old reefing tricks and practice too. Have I ever QT? No.

 

[Sistawolf]

It really upsets me that anyone would jump on someone's thread (like I'm doing lol) and bash or even remotely compare this forum with any other.. I honestly don't know what I would do if it were not for this forum.. now I have asked questions and had my feelings hurt before but hey.. I asked and honestly I needed to hear it the way it was put.. its hard to read anyone's real reaction anyway.. I don't think anyone on this thread is "flaming" the OG at all. And I'm sorry if anyone on here feels that they or someone else is being "flamed"
If someone doesn't have room or time or whatever their reasoning is for no qt.. that's on them.. one wipe out because they couldn't or wouldn't qt will change that perception quickly.. trust me.. anyone can do what they want.. take the risk or qt.. but it won't take long for them to realize that $40 invested in a 10 gallon tank and set up doesn't sound so bad after all.. speaking from experience.. even @melypr1985 owns, works, operates a lfs suggests that you only trust your own qt..
to the original og.. you can obviously do what you want or what you have means of doing but if you can find a way.. qt is the ONLY way to insure the safety of your main display.. good luck with whatever you decide..

 

[ngoodermuth]

Couldn't it be possible for quarantine to only suppress and not kill a parasite only to have the fish develop symptoms after being added to the display?

Yes, but only if it's not done correctly. Examples: Incorrect dosing, ending treatment early, not using sterile equipment, adding new fish without restarting the QT clock, not treating prophylactically, etc.

 

[ciscomania]

No, he's not kidding. My fish are immune and have been for almost 40 years. Even my 25 year olds.

If you don't mind, can you share your secret to fish immunity? thanks in advance.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

Yes, but only if it's not done correctly. Examples: Incorrect dosing, ending treatment early, not using sterile equipment, adding new fish without restarting the QT clock, not treating prophylactically, etc.

+1


One of the difficulties many detractors mention and newb mistakes with qt is is the size of the tank and set up. Pre profilactic chemical treatment in qt the theory was also to condition the fish. It is wild caught and now it's in a two foot box at your house.

So going slow and doing it right is worth it and they rush the treatments.
Many are eating people food for the first time. So as we know that stress makes them susceptible to illness and bugs. So a qt has or should be suitable to the species.
I can't imagine any tang in a ten gallon.
An adult should have a big long tank

Having mandarins and pipes , qt mostly is to condition them. Lionfish are the same. So by doing that you also increase thier immunity.

My friend Paul gets heat for non qt talk. But in fact he will say , "you are a newb qt your fish. In ten years maybe you won't be a newb and treat your fish like I'd do and pests and disease won't be a worry".

So it's really treating the animal more like a pet and taking care of their overall well being long term. And that can start in qt.

 

[Sistawolf]

+1


One of the difficulties many detractors mention and newb mistakes with qt is is the size of the tank and set up. Pre profilactic chemical treatment in qt the theory was also to condition the fish. It is wild caught and now it's in a two foot box at your house.

So going slow and doing it right is worth it and they rush the treatments.
Many are eating people food for the first time. So as we know that stress makes them susceptible to illness and bugs. So a qt has or should be suitable to the species.
I can't imagine any tang in a ten gallon.
An adult should have a big long tank

Having mandarins and pipes , qt mostly is to condition them. Lionfish are the same. So by doing that you also increase thier immunity.

My friend Paul gets heat for non qt talk. But in fact he will say , "you are a newb qt your fish. In ten years maybe you won't be a newb and treat your fish like I'd do and pests and disease won't be a worry".

So it's really treating the animal more like a pet and taking care of their overall well being long term. And that can start in qt.

+1 by the way.. I was giving an example.. you can even use a Rubbermaid container.. obviously one would use common sense on tank size for their own amount and or size of fish needing QT

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

+1 by the way.. I was giving an example.. you can even use a Rubbermaid container.. obviously one would use common sense on tank size for their own amount and or size of fish needing QT

Oh yea duh! A big rubber maid! I forget that. I have a typical small so cal house it wouldn't fit even empty.

 

[Paul B]

If you don't mind, can you share your secret to fish immunity? thanks in advance.

It is no secret. I have been writing about it for many years. I even wrote a book but the vast majority of hobbiests for some reason can't or don't want to get their fish immune which is why we have all these parasite threads.
There is a thread about it here. https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/a-discussion-on-immunity.209701/

Or this one. https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/two-methodoligies-to-keep-a-reef-tank.226995/

I can't comment much on this thread because I don't do any of these things. It is an entirely different procedure to get your fish immune so to me, parasites and other diseases are a non issue.
But good luck whatever you do.

 

[evolved]

and some folks just dump and get away with it for many years

And some of those will lead you to believe it works just fine for them, yet many also seem to have "mysterious" losses from time to time that they don't really dwell on.

But sure, people have losses in QTs as well. I certainly have, but I would much rather have that than an empty DT.

 

[Empress]

You're kidding me, right?

How do one make a fish mutant from all of these diseases? Boost their well-being?

You obviously don't know PaulB. Go ahead ask him some questions about immunity. I dare ya! You'll love this guy! LOL [emoji23]

 

[Paul B]

Empress, Don't get me involved in these quarantine threads. I didn't quarantine myself and I won't quarantine my fish. But I have been at this for about 60 years so I know a "different" way.
All Noobs should "not" use my methods or comb their hair like me. It takes a while to learn this, about my hair I mean.
If you succeed in getting your fish immune for 35 or 40 years, you will get all sorts of hate mail saying how lucky you are and how you are playing Russian Roulette even if you don't know how to speak Russian.
I always thought I was lucky so I keep standing near my front door waiting for a fish geek Supermodel to ring my bell wanting to borrow a cup of Instant Ocean. But so far I don't hear anything so I guess I am not that lucky.
The last big snowfall we had I was out in front of my house using my snow blower. A Lady came by carrying a snow shovel and she told me I was very "lucky" to have a snow blower. I told her there are five Home Depot's and two Lowes with in four miles from here. Luck didn't have much to do with it. It was my credit card that provided the luck and in my fish tank it is common sense that lets your fish keep the immunity they were born with.
Common sense is like when you buy some electronic thing and you open the box and take out that little plastic bag that says "Don't eat this" and you have to take a minute to think about if you are hungry enough to eat that.
It doesn't taste that good by the way

 

[laga77]

With 6 tanks and 54 fish, the longest I qt a fish is a week. The only meds is a dose of Prazi. Once the fish starts eating live food, into the DT it goes. I stopped feeding flake and pellet food 6 years ago. The last time I lost a fish to disease. Fresh, live, and frozen foods only. This and good WC and selection of specimens and not over crowding and you too can have healthy fish with good immune systems

 

[klp]

Empress, Don't get me involved in these quarantine threads. I didn't quarantine myself and I won't quarantine my fish. But I have been at this for about 60 years so I know a "different" way.
All Noobs should "not" use my methods or comb their hair like me. It takes a while to learn this, about my hair I mean.
If you succeed in getting your fish immune for 35 or 40 years, you will get all sorts of hate mail saying how lucky you are and how you are playing Russian Roulette even if you don't know how to speak Russian.
I always thought I was lucky so I keep standing near my front door waiting for a fish geek Supermodel to ring my bell wanting to borrow a cup of Instant Ocean. But so far I don't hear anything so I guess I am not that lucky.
The last big snowfall we had I was out in front of my house using my snow blower. A Lady came by carrying a snow shovel and she told me I was very "lucky" to have a snow blower. I told her there are five Home Depot's and two Lowes with in four miles from here. Luck didn't have much to do with it. It was my credit card that provided the luck and in my fish tank it is common sense that lets your fish keep the immunity they were born with.
Common sense is like when you buy some electronic thing and you open the box and take out that little plastic bag that says "Don't eat this" and you have to take a minute to think about if you are hungry enough to eat that.
It doesn't taste that good by the way

Since you use a reverse undergravel filter, do you use copepods/amphipods as part of your immune system using live food? If so I would think anything live would get trapped under the gravel unless you use a prefilter or do you avoid any reproducing live food in salt water. As far as the super model goes take a tip from Hansel & Gretel and leave a trail of $100 bill "bread crumbs" to your front door. I haven't tried it but the theory seems sound. Unless your wife answers the door...

 

[Paul B]

Actually the amphipods absolutely love the reverse UG filter and populate the thing al the way through it even hanging out under it. Oxygen penetrates all parts of it so they are very happy and can dance for quite a while before they get out of breath. I use amphipods and live blackworms for food. Live food or at least food with living bacteria is essential to keep up the immune system of fish. I also want a healthy population of parasites in my tank although I can't see them. But in 46 years of not quarantining I am sure there are plenty of them in there someplace.
As for my wife answering the door, I am lucky that I also married a Supermodel.

 

[Swoody]

I will not say that Qt is a bad thing or a good thing. Obviously if you stop the the introduction of a disease into your DT it's a great thing. That being said the only fish I've ever lost were in Qt tank ( 2 Majestic angels from Ny Aquatic, neither made it more than a few days and a Sunburst Anthia which obviously had a intestinal bug I did not treat quick enough) my latest addition a Blotchy Anthias was also obviously in failing health after a month in Qt and Prazipro treatment as well as antibiotics for cloudy eye... I moved him to DT without copper treatment and he is doing great.... eats like a horse and in perfect form. Will this come back to bite me in the butt in the weeks to come...? only time will tell but I couldn't stand seeing him in the QT any longer. I know this is not most people's experiences but I have not had good luck with QT ing my fish.

 

[BantyRooster97]

So if you do choose to QT, do you automatically freshwater dip or treat with chemicals?

I have a large 40g breeder for QT, I also have a 10 and 20 if I have to treat fish. Right now I have a butterfly & a juv tang in the 40. I didn't freshwtaer dip or treat them & they seem to be doing fine. I was planning on leaving them in for 2 weeks and if no noticeable issues arrise, into DT they go. I didn't want to stress them out any more than the shipment did, unless I saw an issue.