Is a proper canister filter really more work?

[Sleepingtiger]

I heard that the tube that goes over the edge can accumulate air that can cause the siphon to stop, flooding the tank and floors. Some people say that air builds up causing gurgling noises. I also don't like having something hanging on a clean rimless display. (yes, the other route has glass lily pipes hanging which look good when clean).

Back in the day i used hob overflows. What causes them to build up air is the lack of flow for the U-tube. If you increase the flow, you will see the air enter the U-tube and pass right through and not accumulate.

Certain models can accumulate air more than others. I found the clear round U-tube never accumulated air. The have a low flow rate so air goes in and out. Its the larger capacity U-tube is where you have trouble.

 

[simplicity]

Back in the day i used hob overflows. What causes them to build up air is the lack of flow for the U-tube. If you increase the flow, you will see the air enter the U-tube and pass right through and not accumulate.

Certain models can accumulate air more than others. I found the clear round U-tube never accumulated air. The have a low flow rate so air goes in and out. Its the larger capacity U-tube is where you have trouble.

Ahh. ok. So the diameter of the U tube should increase with the increased flow on a bigger tank, but you wouldn't want a the big diameter on a medium/small tank since the pump cant ensure adequate flow to keep out the air. That makes sense. I was wondering why the guy at saltwateraquarium.com suggested the PF-800 instead of the 1200 that has 2 U tubes... cause if I were to go this route I would think having that second tube as an emergency exhaust for the water could help in case the first one gets clogged.

 

[Spare time]

Arguable a hob overflow box will make the tank cleaner. Otherwise you will have the canister, the heater, the thermometer, and any other equipment dangling from the back. Eshopps overflow boxes really aren't bad looking, and its so rare for bubbles to form to stop them from flowing at least from my experience.

 

[KQuillan]

I run a canister on my 38g. It truly is a PITA taking it out, apart, putting it all back together, etc. I hate doing it so I can see myself avoiding it. Not good. However, I will do it to make sure my tank does not pay the consequences of my actions. I want to run a skimmer also, I just don't know enough about them to understand how they work or how to set them up.

 

[Kupo]

I'm currently using a canister filter for my 17g tank. Switched from planted to reef. Reusing everything except for the light. I never had issue with high nitrate or phosphate. Parameter has been stable after 6 months except for ALK, it's slowly dropping. No skimmer or powerhead. NO3 avg around 5-10ppm and PO4 under 0.1. I'm using Eheim canister rated up to 90g (freshwater?) with a prefilter on the intake. Never had to clean the canister filter, only change the prefilter every waterchange.

However, if I were to start from scratch. I would get a system with a sump or AIO. I hate seeing all equipment in the display tank.

 

[Spare time]

I'm currently using a canister filter for my 17g tank. Switched from planted to reef. Reusing everything except for the light. I never had issue with high nitrate or phosphate. Parameter has been stable after 6 months except for ALK, it's slowly dropping. No skimmer or powerhead. NO3 avg around 5-10ppm and PO4 under 0.1. I'm using Eheim canister rated up to 90g (freshwater?) with a prefilter on the intake. Never had to clean the canister filter, only change the prefilter every waterchange.

However, if I was to start from scratch. I would get a system with a sump or AIO. I hate seeing all equipment in the display tank.

So if you never clean it, what's the point of having it?

 

[Sleeping Giant]

The Biomaster 850 I'm looking at has a prefilter section that is very easy to remove and clean which collects most of the gunk in the tank before it enters the main filter area, which I would only fill with biomedia.

Now, people keep saying you have to clean them often, but don't you have to clean filter socks and the protein skimmer every few days? A guy I'm watching on youtube has a very successful tank using just a Biomaster 600 (with the high PPI pre filter foam and biomedia in the main chamber), and an inline algae reactor (Tunze). He says all he does is take out the prefilter and squeeze the gunk out and put the foam back on (every 3-4 days).

The system I'm planning out includes the stronger Biomaster 850, a chaeto reactor on its own pump, and a UV sterilizer on the output on of the Biomaster that can be turned on/off as needed. The lily inlet I'm getting provides both surface skimming and pulls in water from the middle column.

If the prefilters are cleaned regularly why is this not a viable system? At least you don't have to worry about cleaning the filter socks and protein skimmer every few days...

It's very viable

 

[Spare time]

The Biomaster 850 I'm looking at has a prefilter section that is very easy to remove and clean which collects most of the gunk in the tank before it enters the main filter area, which I would only fill with biomedia.

Now, people keep saying you have to clean them often, but don't you have to clean filter socks and the protein skimmer every few days? A guy I'm watching on youtube has a very successful tank using just a Biomaster 600 (with the high PPI pre filter foam and biomedia in the main chamber), and an inline algae reactor (Tunze). He says all he does is take out the prefilter and squeeze the gunk out and put the foam back on (every 3-4 days).

The system I'm planning out includes the stronger Biomaster 850, a chaeto reactor on its own pump, and a UV sterilizer on the output on of the Biomaster that can be turned on/off as needed. The lily inlet I'm getting provides both surface skimming and pulls in water from the middle column.

If the prefilters are cleaned regularly why is this not a viable system? At least you don't have to worry about cleaning the filter socks and protein skimmer every few days...

You WANT to clean filters often. The key is, which is easiest to clean? Canisters are the worst for this. And if you are just cleaning prefilters, they why have a filter at all? Just get a powerhead with a prefilter

 

[Sleeping Giant]

Yes, for a typical canister filter I would not want to clean the whole thing out every weekend... but I'm talking about a Biomaster 850. Watch the video I posted, the guy has an incredible reef tank and he's running only a Biomaster 600 with an inline algae reactor. The ease of removing the pre filter is what makes this unit different than other canisters.

I'm not sure if I'll be dosing much , I don't want my tank full of corals, I like fish more. So I probably won't need a sump for that. I can always run the little clear acrylic lines up into the tank, if I need to dose.

Anyways, the reason I'm pushing the canister idea is because this will be my first saltwater tank. I just got my Waterbox 4820 clear, which is the freshwater version. It has clear silicone, so I want to keep that clear look (no background). And since there is no plumbing, it cannot be drilled, and I don't want ugly stuff hanging off of it. I am going to use glass lily pipes so you will barely notice the tubes/pipes.

From what I understand, Canister filters are very quiet and if you clean them regularly (again biomaster is easy to clean the prefilter, which is what gets the dirtiest), then they shouldn't be a problem. Again, if I'm not as diligent as I should be, the algae reactor I'm installing should be able to handle some of those nitrates, I would think. And adding carbon/GFO will clean out the water. The UV sterilizer will kill single cell organisms/algae on a per needed basis.

The thing is that if I hypothetically get a sump, I will either need to return my aquarium and get a different one with predrilled holes, install an HOB overflow (which I don't want to do, since this is a clear tank with no background, I don't want to paint it, and HOBs have a bad reputation... well ehm), buy a skimmer, buy a return pump, get all the plumbing. Then I have a big mess, when I could have had everything nice and neat with 3 simple devices: canister filter (w/ easy clean pre filter), chaeto reactor, and UV sterilizer.

I'll be installing a sliding drawer inside the aquarium cabinet that the canister will sit on so that I can easily slide it in and out. Like I said, the pre filter cleaning looks super easy. It took the guy I was watching less than a minute to accomplish. I could do that at least once a week. From the guys I've been watching, they say the main filter doesn't need to be opened except every month and a half to three months. Some have gone longer than 6 months without touching the canister and have a successful reef (this one was a comment so I couldn't verify what his tank looked like).

You will need a hob skimmer, I use an fx4 canister with an aquamaxx 1.5 skimmer. I love it, and my tank is super quiet.

 

[Sleeping Giant]

You WANT to clean filters often. The key is, which is easiest to clean? Canisters are the worst for this. And if you are just cleaning prefilters, they why have a filter at all? Just get a powerhead with a prefilter

You obviously don't have a clue about canister filters that are available today.

 

[Bucs20fan]

You obviously don't have a clue about canister filters that are available today.

I agree, I love my fx6 and skimmer. Cleaning the larger fluval canisters is not a difficult task so im not sure why everyone says it is. I have to clean my tidal filters in the same way, just a smaller filter. It has never steered me wrong, and maintenance is part of having a reef or fowlr.

 

[Kupo]

So if you never clean it, what's the point of having it?

Mechanical (prefilter) and bio filtration (canister) and flow. I want to reuse what I already have instead of spending more on equipment.

 

[Sleeping Giant]

I agree, I love my fx6 and skimmer. Cleaning the larger fluval canisters is not a difficult task so im not sure why everyone says it is. I have to clean my tidal filters in the same way, just a smaller filter. It has never steered me wrong, and maintenance is part of having a reef or fowlr.

Takes about 10 minutes to open and clean, not sure why people say it's soooooooooo hard

 

[Spare time]

Mechanical (prefilter) and bio filtration (canister) and flow. I want to reuse what I already have instead of spending more on equipment.

But they are inefficient for flow and surface area doesn't matter since you have rocks (and assuming sand). So in that case, I would think a powerhead with a prefilter to still be the far better option in most cases over a canister

 

[Spare time]

Takes about 10 minutes to open and clean, not sure why people say it's soooooooooo hard

10 mins vs 10 seconds (or less) with literally any other filter.

 

[Sink_or_Swim]

Crazy, I've been wanting to do the same thing with that frosted glass/LED kit... I noticed it because a lot of freshwater guys seem to use it, but it's not very common for saltwater. I've heard it's great from multiple reef people, including the saltwateraquarium.com expert, Brian. There is one guy on Youtube who has the setup with 12 hour long live streams of his tank where you see the change in coloration from day to night with constantly changing background colors. I think it looks best at night.. It's hard to find videos on what it looks like during the day when ambient light around. I guess it would look sort of gray in the daytime or without the LED on. Or maybe it would just reflect whatever color the tank lights made.

Yeah I couldn't find any saltwater examples online other than a picture. Do you remember the name of the Youtube guy? I'd like to see that. I can post an update on my experience with it after I get it all set up though! The fact that I have this is a lot of the reason I don't want a bunch of cords and equipment at the back of the tank - it'd probably show through the frosted film and ruin the aesthetic. After reading the comments here about keeping the glass lily pipes clean, I think I've reconsidered those for the time being. I also know I'll have to keep up on cleaning the back glass if I want to keep it looking good as algae will stand out much more on that than on a black background. I really don't have to scrape my glass much at all the past year though, only really on the sides once a week or so, so that doesn't bother me. I agree - I think the lighting will look the coolest at night. I'm not home during the day anyway, and my husband never pays attention to the tank. I really hope it turns out nice, but if not, it wasn't too expensive and I can always see if someone in the freshwater community would want it. The main reason I wanted it was to keep it on a blue/aqua color so with the frosted film, it'd look like the ocean.

 

[Tamberav]

If you don't like the overflow box visual and want some frosted back then you can just do a peninsula. It will still be cleaner then a canister + whatever equiptment you end up needing.

grabbed the first pic off google but you get the idea.. you can put it against a wall and frost the back and add lighting if that is your thing.

I think a cannister is the complete opposite of a clean set up. The idea of it seems good but not for anything outside of the most basic set up... once you start dosing 2 part for the corals or anything then you have wires going up the tank and over the lip. I just can not wrap my head around how a cannister is supposed to be the clean looking option.

 

[simplicity]

10 mins vs 10 seconds (or less) with literally any other filter.

He shows how to clean it... takes a minute.


So I just saw that they make inline skimmers that don't have to be in the tank or in a sump. So, really, if I wanted to, I could have a skimmer on its own pump, or on the algae reactor pump since they would require similar flow rates...hmm. Of course, it doesn't solve the issue of dosing and having all these tubes going in and out of the tank.

 

[simplicity]

Yeah I couldn't find any saltwater examples online other than a picture. Do you remember the name of the Youtube guy? I'd like to see that. I can post an update on my experience with it after I get it all set up though! The fact that I have this is a lot of the reason I don't want a bunch of cords and equipment at the back of the tank - it'd probably show through the frosted film and ruin the aesthetic. After reading the comments here about keeping the glass lily pipes clean, I think I've reconsidered those for the time being. I also know I'll have to keep up on cleaning the back glass if I want to keep it looking good as algae will stand out much more on that than on a black background. I really don't have to scrape my glass much at all the past year though, only really on the sides once a week or so, so that doesn't bother me. I agree - I think the lighting will look the coolest at night. I'm not home during the day anyway, and my husband never pays attention to the tank. I really hope it turns out nice, but if not, it wasn't too expensive and I can always see if someone in the freshwater community would want it. The main reason I wanted it was to keep it on a blue/aqua color so with the frosted film, it'd look like the ocean.

Yeah, that blue aqua color is stunning. I have that permanently on in the kitchen under bar... so there's always that hue and I think it will match the aquarium, especially with the LED in the back. I've also heard that the marine lights can overpower the LED, but I don't know. They are pretty cheap, but I'm not sure how much of a pain in the butt it would be to remove the film once installed.

Here's the video (I skipped ahead to the middle but you can see what it looks like all hours of the day since it's a 12 hour long video):

 

[Kupo]

But they are inefficient for flow and surface area doesn't matter since you have rocks (and assuming sand). So in that case, I would think a powerhead with a prefilter to still be the far better option in most cases over a canister

I agree, canisters are inefficient compared to sumps, AIOs, or HOB filters. I used what I have, it works, and for me, it doesn't really take a lot of work to maintain. I did say that I rather get a tank with a sump or an AIO instead of using a canister if I were to invest in a proper reef tank.