Is my Toadstool dead?

[ScottyD36]

I have had my Toadstool since I got my tank which is about a year and half old. It was doing fine then all the sudden it closed up and hasn't opened in about 2 weeks and started getting discoloration on it. I know they will shed and close up when they do this. But now that its almost two weeks I am concerned that it is now dieng. Attached is a picture. Any help our guidance would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

 

[Timfish]

Closed like that for two weeks is not good. What are your current water parameters? Have you done a water change? It's questionable how much brushing will actually help as it would certainly irritate an already stressed animal and can push some of the algae and bacterail film into the tissue. It may not be practical but you might try dipping in iodine or coralRX in an atemp to kill the algae and do minimum stress to the toadstool.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Do Not dip. Seeing that it is covered in algae is an indicator that there is inadequate flow which they highly require. When there is a lack of flow, they tend to get what looks like a layer of lacquer on them . It is actually a film. You can blow the leather with a turkey baster to clean it up and then direct flow towards them, not at them. Good water flow therefore is an important aspect of leather coral care. Too much current can cause these corals to retract their polyps and not grow and spread as they should. Too little current, though, can make it harder for them to shed, which they need to do to stay healthy.
Leather corals shed about once a month by developing a slimy film on their surface. When this happens, they usually retract their polyps, giving them a smooth appearance. Shedding allows them to get rid of algae and other irritants that may have begun to accumulate on their surface. This process usually takes a few days, during which time the coral may seem to be shrunken or unhealthy. This shouldn’t be a concern, though, since leather corals generally re-open even larger and healthier than before once their film is shed. Good water flow will help remove this film, so this process will go faster if your coral is placed in a moderate current.
One of the reasons leather coral care is so easy is that they don’t often require intentional feeding. Leather corals are photosynthetic, meaning they are able to derive the nutrients they need from light. They do this by using marine algae called zooxanthellae which are often contained inside their bodies. Because of this, leather corals can often thrive off good lighting alone, and several enthusiasts won’t bother feeding their corals at all.
If, however, your coral seems to be struggling or isn’t getting enough light, you can spot feed it. They are soft corals with small polyps all over their skin, and they are popular with both beginners and experienced reef tank owners.
These soft corals are easy to care for, and they can tolerate a small range of water parameters, and they are excellent choices for new reef aquarists. Some corals need very stable water parameters, but Leathers can do well in a newer tank that is not stable yet.
Newer tanks tend to have fluctuating parameters which makes Leathers a good choice because they are hardy enough to survive the swings a little bit better than some others like SPS or LPS.

 

[ScottyD36]

Do Not dip. Seeing that it is covered in algae is an indicator that there is inadequate flow which they highly require. When there is a lack of flow, they tend to get what looks like a layer of lacquer on them . It is actually a film. You can blow the leather with a turkey baster to clean it up and then direct flow towards them, not at them. Good water flow therefore is an important aspect of leather coral care. Too much current can cause these corals to retract their polyps and not grow and spread as they should. Too little current, though, can make it harder for them to shed, which they need to do to stay healthy.
Leather corals shed about once a month by developing a slimy film on their surface. When this happens, they usually retract their polyps, giving them a smooth appearance. Shedding allows them to get rid of algae and other irritants that may have begun to accumulate on their surface. This process usually takes a few days, during which time the coral may seem to be shrunken or unhealthy. This shouldn’t be a concern, though, since leather corals generally re-open even larger and healthier than before once their film is shed. Good water flow will help remove this film, so this process will go faster if your coral is placed in a moderate current.
One of the reasons leather coral care is so easy is that they don’t often require intentional feeding. Leather corals are photosynthetic, meaning they are able to derive the nutrients they need from light. They do this by using marine algae called zooxanthellae which are often contained inside their bodies. Because of this, leather corals can often thrive off good lighting alone, and several enthusiasts won’t bother feeding their corals at all.
If, however, your coral seems to be struggling or isn’t getting enough light, you can spot feed it. They are soft corals with small polyps all over their skin, and they are popular with both beginners and experienced reef tank owners.
These soft corals are easy to care for, and they can tolerate a small range of water parameters, and they are excellent choices for new reef aquarists. Some corals need very stable water parameters, but Leathers can do well in a newer tank that is not stable yet.
Newer tanks tend to have fluctuating parameters which makes Leathers a good choice because they are hardy enough to survive the swings a little bit better than some others like SPS or LPS.

Thanks for the help. I was leaning towards a flow issue at first. I am going to adjust my flow and see if this works

 

[Aqua Man]

they will shed and close up when they do this. But

Not dead. Not enough flow to help with the shedding process.

 

[PeterB113]

+1 for not enough flow

 

[Timfish]

I have had my Toadstool since I got my tank which is about a year and half old. It was doing fine then all the sudden it closed up and hasn't opened in about 2 weeks and started getting discoloration on it. I know they will shed and close up when they do this. But now that its almost two weeks I am concerned that it is now dieng. Attached is a picture. Any help our guidance would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

Do Not dip. Seeing that it is covered in algae is an indicator that there is inadequate flow which they highly require. When there is a lack of flow, they tend to get what looks like a layer of lacquer on them . It is actually a film. You can blow the leather with a turkey baster to clean it up and then direct flow towards them, not at them. Good water flow therefore is an important aspect of leather coral care. Too much current can cause these corals to retract their polyps and not grow and spread as they should. Too little current, though, can make it harder for them to shed, which they need to do to stay healthy.
Leather corals shed about once a month by developing a slimy film on their surface. When this happens, they usually retract their polyps, giving them a smooth appearance. Shedding allows them to get rid of algae and other irritants that may have begun to accumulate on their surface. This process usually takes a few days, during which time the coral may seem to be shrunken or unhealthy. This shouldn’t be a concern, though, since leather corals generally re-open even larger and healthier than before once their film is shed. Good water flow will help remove this film, so this process will go faster if your coral is placed in a moderate current.
One of the reasons leather coral care is so easy is that they don’t often require intentional feeding. Leather corals are photosynthetic, meaning they are able to derive the nutrients they need from light. They do this by using marine algae called zooxanthellae which are often contained inside their bodies. Because of this, leather corals can often thrive off good lighting alone, and several enthusiasts won’t bother feeding their corals at all.
If, however, your coral seems to be struggling or isn’t getting enough light, you can spot feed it. They are soft corals with small polyps all over their skin, and they are popular with both beginners and experienced reef tank owners.
These soft corals are easy to care for, and they can tolerate a small range of water parameters, and they are excellent choices for new reef aquarists. Some corals need very stable water parameters, but Leathers can do well in a newer tank that is not stable yet.
Newer tanks tend to have fluctuating parameters which makes Leathers a good choice because they are hardy enough to survive the swings a little bit better than some others like SPS or LPS.

All corals have mucus coatings and it's a critical part of it's immune system (1) . The mucus coating also ages and they have to shed as it ages and the microbial numbers shift (1) . Vetteguy53081 is correct godd water flow is needed. But correct me if I'm wrong your taodstool has been in that location and has grown significantly since placed there. If it's been doing well in that location for a long time water flow isn't the issue. Using a turkey baster is an excellent way to judge how serious your taodstool's problem is, if the algae film easy blows away you have nothing to worry about. If there is still algae attached it's mucus coating is in sad shape if it's even there. Hopefully you don't see any whitish "dust" blow away as that indicates actual tissue loss. If it is the case algae doens't blow off with a baster and is attached to the surface at the least I would be double checking all my water parameters and would consider running GAC. By all means increase the water flow but you need to ask yourself if it's done well there what else has changed to cause it to be doing so poorly.

 

[vetteguy53081]

All corals have mucus coatings and it's a critical part of it's immune system (1) . The mucus coating also ages and they have to shed as it ages and the microbial numbers shift (1) . Vetteguy53081 is correct godd water flow is needed. But correct me if I'm wrong your taodstool has been in that location and has grown significantly since placed there. If it's been doing well in that location for a long time water flow isn't the issue. Using a turkey baster is an excellent way to judge how serious your taodstool's problem is, if the algae film easy blows away you have nothing to worry about. If there is still algae attached it's mucus coating is in sad shape if it's even there. Hopefully you don't see any whitish "dust" blow away as that indicates actual tissue loss. If it is the case algae doens't blow off with a baster and is attached to the surface at the least I would be double checking all my water parameters and would consider running GAC. By all means increase the water flow but you need to ask yourself if it's done well there what else has changed to cause it to be doing so poorly.

Just alone, the location (against a wall of tank) is an indicator of low. Another issue, if mixed ref can be toxins as many coral both LPS and SPS release their own toxins. Adding chemipure blue to sump often helps with toxin issue

 

[Timfish]

It's a lot more complex than just "toxins" From my post in this thread on "Stability"

"Maybe our definition of "stability" is wrong or at least very inadequate :/. As I see it the typical assumptions about stability don't take into account any of the following:

From the research I've read the microbial processes in any reef ecosystem are likely in constant flux.

The different fluorescing and chromo proteins corals make are to cope with less than ideal environmental conditions (1) (2) (3) (4) (5). (colorful is not necessarily healthy.)

The different clades of simbodinium simbionts require different conditions and corals usually host more than one clade. Environmental changes (like differences between tanks) have the potential of changing the clade numbers and altering the photobiology (1)

Corals have "decadal" memory and the same two specimens of the same species/genotype or even in different parts of the same colony may react differently to the same conditions (1) (2).

Corals are influencing the bacteria in the water around them (1).

Each coral species has it's own unique microbiome (see Rohwer's "Coral Reefs in the Microbial Seas") which also includes components essential for it's immunity.

Immunity within a species varies significantly at the genotype level (1)

"Healthy" looking corals may not be. (1) (2) An excerpt from this paper -
"Critical to coral disease transmission – or resistance – is the coral's surface mucus layer,
which is produced in part by the coral's endosymbionts [12]. The mucus layer hosts a complex
microbial community, referred to hereafter as the surface microbial community (SMC). Because
the mucus environment is rich in nutrients, microbial population densities there are orders of
magnitude higher than in the surrounding water column [20]. Most established and emerging
pathogens are endemic to the ecosystem and typically present at low numbers in the SMC.
When stressed, the SMC can switch rapidly from a community associated with healthy corals to
diseased corals. In field studies during the 2005 summer bleaching event, Ritchie [28] observed
that "visitor" bacteria (bacterial groups otherwise not dominant) became the predominant
species in mucus collected from apparently healthy Acropora palmata.""

 

[Timfish]

@ScottyD36 Since this does seem to be segwaying to a discussion on microbial stuff you may find these videos informative.

Forest Rohwer "Coral Reefs in the Microbial Seas"

Changing Seas - Mysterious Microbes

Nitrogen cycling in hte coral holobiont

BActeria and Sponges

Richard Ross What's up with phosphate"