Is Nitribiotic a bacteria source for Reef Actif and NP Bacto Pellets?

[Muffin87]

@Hans-Werner, @Lou Ekus - does Nitribiotic contain the bacteria strain necessary for Reef Active / NP Bacto Pellets to work? Alternatively, is there another source containing that bacteria, if not that?

I finished cycling a dry rock barebottom tank, and I need to get the good bacteria spreading for when I start carbon dosing.

Thanks a lot!

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

@Hans-Werner, @Lou Ekus - does Nitribiotic contain the bacteria strain necessary for Reef Active / NP Bacto Pellets to work? Alternatively, is there another source containing that bacteria, if not that?

I finished cycling a dry rock barebottom tank, and I need to get the good bacteria spreading for when I start carbon dosing.

Thanks a lot!

Nitribiotic is a pretty cool product (I use it) but the bacterial strains are primarily probiotic and I don't think they're "typical" heterotrophic bacteria that you'd find in a product like AF Pro Bio F or Pro Bio S...I can tell you the bacterial strains in Nitribiotic if you want...they actually list them which is cool

 

[Muffin87]

Nitribiotic is a pretty cool product (I use it) but the bacterial strains are primarily probiotic and I don't think they're "typical" heterotrophic bacteria that you'd find in a product like AF Pro Bio F or Pro Bio S...I can tell you the bacterial strains in Nitribiotic if you want...they actually list them which is cool

Well I still have some NP Bacto Pellets and a small jar of Reef Actif around from a previous build, and I need to seed them somehow if I want to keep on using them on my new build.

I looked at the website but I couldn't find the actual names of the strains.

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

Well I still have some NP Bacto Pellets and a small jar of Reef Actif around from a previous build, and I need to seed them somehow if I want to keep on using them on my new build.

I looked at the website but I couldn't find the actual names of the strains.

I actually have the bottle right in front of me...the bacterial strains are Bacillus subtilis, Nitrobacteria, Saccharomyces (yeast fungi), Lactobacillus, and Purple Bacteria

 

[Hans-Werner]

Thanks for calling us to this discussion!
We know that Reef Actif also feeds the probiotic bacteria in Nitribiotic. We know it from growing bacterial counts in trials with subsequent microbiological analysis. However I think the Bacillus and Lactobacillus are not the only bacterial strains Reef Actif feeds. My assumption is that also other probiotic strains that are a normal part of the microflora on and in corals, on and in the intestines of fish, crustaceans etc. are nourished by Reef Actif. The similarities of the substances in Reef Actif and the substances that are fermented by the symbiotic microflora in the intestines of fish and crustaceans and the reactions of corals makes this likely. Also there seems an improvement in behavior and condition of fish and many other animals.

In NP-Bacto-Pellets we saw similar improvements but microbiological tests are difficult.

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

Thanks for calling us to this discussion!
We know that Reef Actif also feeds the probiotic bacteria in Nitribiotic. We know it from growing bacterial counts in trials with subsequent microbiological analysis. However I think the Bacillus and Lactobacillus are not the only bacterial strains Reef Actif feeds. My assumption is that also other probiotic strains that are a normal part of the microflora on and in corals, on and in the intestines of fish, crustaceans etc. are nourished by Reef Actif. The similarities of the substances in Reef Actif and the substances that are fermented by the symbiotic microflora in the intestines of fish and crustaceans and the reactions of corals makes this likely. Also there seems an improvement in behavior and condition of fish and many other animals.

I saw a different thread OP posted yesterday and I think what he's trying to figure out is what would be the best bacterial supplement to seed his tank with specifically in order to make use of his NP Bacto Pellets since he started his tank with all dry rock...btw, I use Nitribiotic and was just wondering if the probiotic bacteria are proven to be very effective just dosed into the water because I thought probiotic bacterial strains like LAB and Bacillus subtilis had to reach the digestive system in order to significantly benefit the organism

 

[Hans-Werner]

The water habitats are quite different from land habitats regarding uptake of microorganisms and probiotics. Fish are meant to be quite open to the environment and to uptake of microorganisms from their environment. They are said to be in a process of continuous uptake and excretion of microorganisms from and into the environment.

Many fish in our tanks feed on "upgrowth" or on small organisms in the tank that for their part have taken up and are colonised by microorganisms. And finally marine fish drink the water they are swimming in. This ensures a much more intense exchange between external and internal microbiology than in land habitats.

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

The water habitats are quite different from land habitats regarding uptake of microorganisms and probiotics. Fish are meant to be quite open to the environment and to uptake of microorganisms from their environment. They are said to be in a process of continuous uptake and excretion of microorganisms from and into the environment.

Many fish in our tanks feed on "upgrowth" or on small organisms in the tank that for their part have taken up and are colonised by microorganisms. And finally marine fish drink the water they are swimming in. This ensures a much more intense exchange between external and internal microbiology than in land habitats.

What you're saying makes sense but do the published studies actually reflect that probiotics such as LAB and Saccharomyces significantly benefit fish and shrimp if not directly ingested by being mixed with food? There are very few studies I could find involving aquarium fish but as for aquacultured fish the primary method of administration seems to be through direct feeding of food containing the probiotics which is linked to the positive effects (a large number of bacteria must survive to reach the digestive tract). Does Tropic Marin conduct their own independent studies?

 

[Hans-Werner]

Although most studies about the use of probiotics describe the application with food some also describe water/pond application like Moriarty, Jamal et al., Gomez-Gil et al., Olafsen and some others.

We usually do not conduct own studies other than our own tank experiments in 9 tanks, but we are also cooperating with universities in several rearing experiments. At the moment I am not sure whether the probiotic was included in a rearing experiment for "Maifisch" (Alosa alosa) in the Justus-Liebig-University in Gießen, I am sure Lipovit was used in this rearing experiments.

 

[Hans-Werner]

I just wanted to complement that I recalled that we supplied Nitribiotic for the breeding and rearing project for Alosa alosa in a more concentrated version. It was used with good succes. The main improvement in this rearig project for the re-introduction of the species in the river Rhine was the food enrichment with Lipovit which improved the survival of larvae during a necessary transfer from a total loss to 60 %, if I recall this number right. The larvae of this species are extremely sensitiv to distress.

 

[livinlifeinBKK]

@Hans-Werner btw, what species of bacteria is the "Purple Bacteria" in Nitribiotic? Just saying Purple Bacteria is a little vague given the differing characteristics between PNS bacteria and PSB for example.

 

[Hans-Werner]

I am sorry, I was not able to get this information from our supplier yet but we will find out.

Since some PNS like Rhodopseudomonas palustris are quite ubiquitous I am optimistic it is included but we will find out.

 

[Kenneth Wingerter]

@Hans-Werner btw, what species of bacteria is the "Purple Bacteria" in Nitribiotic? Just saying Purple Bacteria is a little vague given the differing characteristics between PNS bacteria and PSB for example.

Exactly, PSB (purple sulfur bacteria) and PNSB (purple nonsulfur bacteria) are in totally different classes (Gammaproteobacteria and Alphaproteobacteria, respectively). We're literally talking about the same degree of phylogenetic relatedness as between a bullfrog and a bull moose. Despite the similarities in name, these two microbial groups exhibit completely different metabolisms, and so would serve entirely different functions in a captive system. "Purple bacteria" is yet more vague, as it could describe organisms as distantly related as butterflyfish and butterflies (i.e., exclusive only at the level of Phylum). Looking forward to his reply.