Is There Any Possibility I Have Too Much Light?

[Birddog]

I have struggled for some time, my SPSs and even some LPS just don't have the color I've seen them have in the past. I've battled dino's and won, I am currently battling what I believe to be high nitrates and slowly gaining ground. I have tried to look at all inputs as well as maintenance practices with little improvement in my colors. For a few fleeting moments I see color starting to improve only to be lost in a day or two.

I was in Charleston SC this past weekend and made my first visit to JKR's ... cool place and even better customer care. I looked at Joey's relatively new display and was surprised to see (if I remember correctly) four XR30's over a roughly 300G tank. The lights were approximately 15-20" awl and running at a pretty high kelvin value. Joey was not there, but his associate said they run a lot of blue. The colors in the tank of both SPS and LPS were as you would expect... lovely!

• My reef is 65 G and I have two XR30's mounted 9" awl.
• I run a slightly modified AB+ program with peak at 65%
• NO3 - 18 ppm
• PO4 - .04 ppm
• Ca - 490 ppm
• dKH - 8.2
• Mg - 1400 ppm

I test NO3, Ca and dKH no less than every other day and they're very stable with the exception of NO3 which is slow in dropping from a high of 40 ppm . To reduce nitrates I have a fuge and grow chaeto very fast and harvest every 5 days. Carbon dosing just beats my SPS and BTA's up at a dosing rate of 3 ml per day in a total water volume of 55 G. I've lost several SPS lately (RTN / expulsion) as my nitrates have dropped and I'm starting to think maybe I have too much light. Some SPS are brown, while others are pale. I cannot produce any green color in my RR aussie gold, BC spainbow or in my milli's. In fact several of my millis are extremely pale in color. Could it be possible I'm hitting my reef with too much light?

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

Yes. It’s posible.

 

[mcarroll]

I run a slightly modified AB+ program with peak at 65%

Sounds like a lot, especially if your nutrients have been unstable.

But what #lux or PAR reading do you get for a maximum?

I would let your nutrients stabilize around where they are. If they fall lower naturally, great, but don't force it except if you can reduce your inputs to the system. Let algae use it up and let snails keep your algae grazed.

Carbon dosing just beats my SPS and BTA's up

I would stop carbon dosing right now if you're seeing any signs of coral stress in the tank. What exactly do you mean though by "beats up" your corals and anemones?

Some SPS are brown, while others are pale. I cannot produce any green color in my RR aussie gold, BC spainbow or in my milli's. In fact several of my millis are extremely pale in color. Could it be possible I'm hitting my reef with too much light?

Maybe too much light. Definitely too much filtration.

Also makes me question flow.

Your nutrient levels "ought" to be able to support pretty intense light levels...BUT...too little flow or too soft flow can be a real problem even in a situation with good lighting and good nutrients.

 

[Birddog]

But what #lux or PAR reading do you get for a maximum?

Thank you for your reply and sorry for my slow response... work! I do not have access to a PAR meter so this is a bust for me. I just don't know.

I would stop carbon dosing right now if you're seeing any signs of coral stress in the tank. What exactly do you mean though by "beats up" your corals and anemones?

I stopped, did so about 3 weeks ago. My Anemones color changed from red with a little green to mostly brown and they got pretty small, deflated. Several of my SPS lost just about all color and became a light tan and even white in areas. They're still alive, but beat up with zero PE day or night.

Maybe too much light. Definitely too much filtration.

Also makes me question flow.

Your nutrient levels "ought" to be able to support pretty intense light levels...BUT...too little flow or too soft flow can be a real problem even in a situation with good lighting and good nutrients.

whoa, definitely too much filtration?! Interesting, please perhaps you can share your thoughts why? with respect to flow I have just two MP 10's on the tank (again it's a 65 G) and run mostly Reef Crest and some Pulse 80-100% through my wXM.

 

[mcarroll]

whoa, definitely too much filtration?! Interesting please perhaps you can share your thoughts why?

Mostly the stuff you mentioned here:

I've battled dino's and won

Carbon dosing just beats my SPS and BTA's up at a dosing rate of 3 ml per day

I've lost several SPS lately (RTN / expulsion) as my nitrates have dropped

If you had dino's then you know for a fact that your tank was weak and is still recovering....and it will take a while longer even after things have visibly settled down. This is not a tank that you want to carbon dose at all....or do anything at all to artificially limit nutrients. Not until it's been so long that you forgot you had dino's. The only thing to do with nutrients is to make sure neither N or P reaches zero again. Let good algae and herbivores take care of the rest.

with respect to flow I have just two MP 10's on the tank (again it's a 65 G) and run mostly Reef Crest and some Pulse 80-100% through my wXM.

An mp10 will flow about 12" well and is weak past that. If' it's running a programmed mode, then it can be substantially less since the pump is running at low-speed some of the time. I would consider this definitely to be part of your problem.

If you want to stay with mp's as your solution, then I'd add a third unit to the back wall in the middle. (Maybe put all three back there so no more motors hanging off the tank in-view?)

Two or three pumps with more kick (= water velocity) would be better, IMO.

Tunze 6045's are not controllable, but are some of my favorite reef pumps. The 6055 would be the controllable equivalent – also a great candidate for your tank. The 6095 and 6040 would be the other controllable options you might consider. The 6040 is quite a bit different so use your imagination to place it somewhere you wouldn't be able to fit a pump normally.

2¢

 

[Birddog]

If you had dino's then you know for a fact that your tank was weak and is still recovering....and it will take a while longer even after things have visibly settled down. This is not a tank that you want to carbon dose at all....or do anything at all to artificially limit nutrients. Not until it's been so long that you forgot you had dino's. The only thing to do with nutrients is to make sure neither N or P reaches zero again. Let good algae and herbivores take care of the rest.

That's a fact, no doubt! I had no bio diversity, no micro fauna, no nutrients.

An mp10 will flow about 12" well and is weak past that. If' it's running a programmed mode, then it can be substantially less since the pump is running at low-speed some of the time. I would consider this definitely to be part of your problem.

If you want to stay with mp's as your solution, then I'd add a third unit to the back wall in the middle. (Maybe put all three back there so no more motors hanging off the tank in-view?)

Two or three pumps with more kick (= water velocity) would be better, IMO.

Tunze 6045's are not controllable, but are some of my favorite reef pumps. The 6055 would be the controllable equivalent – also a great candidate for your tank. The 6095 and 6040 would be the other controllable options you might consider. The 6040 is quite a bit different so use your imagination to place it somewhere you wouldn't be able to fit a pump normally.

Mcarroll thank you! Thank you for your thoughts, thank you for making me think, thank you for taking the time, and thank you for confirming a few thoughts I had in the back of my head. I'm going to do some research now... talk soon!

 

[Sagecritter4life]

Not completely off the subject but may be to much light. I tried the AB+ version for Hydra 26s turned down to 50% for LPS in my e260 and corals immediately went South didn't like it at all did more damage than good LOL had this discussion under "is par really par if wattage the same" on another thread after noticing wattage being lower than program I was previously running so thought I would be safe but the AB+ runs much higher UV and purple and lower Blues which turned out to be really harsh versus Dan's reef respiration lps file that was low uv high blues. Lesson learned the hard way thanks to Dana riddle and others on Par versus Pur and Spectrum..chuckle.

 

[Woodneers]

Hey Sagecritter, nice meeting you today. Now you have my username. I'll be following along for sure.

 

[Sagecritter4life]

Hey Sagecritter, nice meeting you today. Now you have my username. I'll be following along for sure.

Ten four Woodneers [emoji106] was good talking to you also and happy reefing [emoji6]

 

[Dana Riddle]

Acropora specimens almost always contain a type (clade) of zooxanthella that is not very tolerant of high light (as opposed to say, 'Clade A' zoox.) But there are other issues other than just PAR, such as total dosage of light (Daily Light Integral), spectral quality, acclimation time allowed for the zoox to adjust to a new light field. I agree with mcarroll that flow could be an issue, but lightening of the coral and loss of coloration makes me think it's related to too much light.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

The R2r go to.
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/h...d-i-dont-know-what-to-do.210035/#post-2401666

Acropora specimens almost always contain a type (clade) of zooxanthella that is not very tolerant of high light (as opposed to say, 'Clade A' zoox.) But there are other issues other than just PAR, such as total dosage of light (Daily Light Integral), spectral quality, acclimation time allowed for the zoox to adjust to a new light field. I agree with mcarroll that flow could be an issue, but lightening of the coral and loss of coloration makes me think it's related to too much light.

Dana, I’d like your thoughts on this if you have a moment.

 

[Birddog]

Acropora specimens almost always contain a type (clade) of zooxanthella that is not very tolerant of high light (as opposed to say, 'Clade A' zoox.) But there are other issues other than just PAR, such as total dosage of light (Daily Light Integral), spectral quality, acclimation time allowed for the zoox to adjust to a new light field. I agree with mcarroll that flow could be an issue, but lightening of the coral and loss of coloration makes me think it's related to too much light.

Thank you for your thoughts as well Dana. Total dosage of light is about 6.5 hours, in addition to an hour ramp up and an hour ramp down at low percentage (20%). All of the SPS have been acclimated to the lighting scheme for more than a year with the exception of a piece or two. Spectrum is a modified AB+ ... I've lowered the percentage of white, red and green.

I'm currently looking at additional power heads to supplement flow, but have already adjusted my MP10's, which I had programmed to run mostly Reef Crest and Pulse through the day at 100% and relax at night to 50%, to 80-100% at night.

Additionally, I'm in the process of lowering my intensity of light slowly over the next week or so by 5-8 % and evaluate for a response. I'll let you know the outcome!

Thank you Dana!

 

[Birddog]

Over the past several weeks I have lowered my peak intensity from 65% down to 60% and have lowered my white, red and green channels by 2-3%. It's had an impact and I'm beginning to see colors again. It's been a slow process, but without a doubt in my mind I was bombarding my reef with too much light and I believe a little of the wrong spectrum as well. I've added a Tunze 6055 as recommended by @mcarroll and although it's hard to determine its impact, my fish seem to be happier being thrown around in the random current. Thank you all.... maybe someday I'll have something colorful enough to take a few photos!

 

[mcarroll]

Thank you all.... maybe someday I'll have something colorful enough to take a few photos!

You're welcome, but don't wait to post photos!

You'll never impress the folks with the big cameras and named corals they plant "by the dozen".

IMO, do your best to forget about them and their concerns*.

Post your progress!! Start today! Lot of folks will appreciate it!

2¢


* These articles might help: Internet Reefer's Decoder Ring

 

[madweazl]

Over the past several weeks I have lowered my peak intensity from 65% down to 60% and have lowered my white, red and green channels by 2-3%. It's had an impact and I'm beginning to see colors again. It's been a slow process, but without a doubt in my mind I was bombarding my reef with too much light and I believe a little of the wrong spectrum as well. I've added a Tunze 6055 as recommended by @mcarroll and although it's hard to determine its impact, my fish seem to be happier being thrown around in the random current. Thank you all.... maybe someday I'll have something colorful enough to take a few photos!

It is highly unlikely that the spectrum changes you made had anything to do with the positive response of the coralsj; that is likely completely related to the intensity adjustments and I'd probably drop it by another 10-15% and bring your whites, greens, and reds back up a bit to a look you enjoy (unless you like it how it is). The AB+ profile (18.5k) was way to blue for me, I cant imagine having it even bluer.