Issues With keeping SPS

[Baboon7]

I've had my system running for about 3 years now and I just can't keep any monti, acros, euphyllia, or any variation of sps. As you can see from my pictures below I have had some success with other corals but I don't understand why all the sps end up dying. What happens is after about a week or 2 the coral will end up turning white and dying. I will list my parameter below maybe someone can see something I don't within the parameters. The Mg is a little low right now I was waiting for BRS to come back in stock.
Tank- 110 gal total volume system 48x24x18
Lights- 2 Radion XR15 Blues schedule is in a screenshot below
Powerheads- 2 MP40s set to 85% on anti-sync reef crest mode on opposite sides of the glass
Mechanical filtration- Aquaamax fleece roller and reef octopus 110 regal protein skimmer
Return pump- Jaebo dcp8000
Refugium with chaeto and apex grow light set on opposite schedule of my display lights
Alk- Controlled by Apex 8.8 with a range of .5 dKH
Calcium- Controlled by Apex 450 with a range of 50 ppm
Magnesium- I usually run around 1500
Salinity- 1.026 tested with a refractometer
Salt mix- Tropic Marin
2 part- I use BRS 2 part pouches
Water changes- 25 gallons every 2 weeks
RO- 0 tds water I make myself using BRS 7 stage RO system

Below I have attached a photo of a Jedi Mind Trick monti that is on its way out just for an example. It has lost all its color and has fine green algae on it but there is some slight polyp extension still. I know this is a lot of information but I just don't get it I've been beating my head against the wall trying to figure it out. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

 

[thatmanMIKEson]

Sounds like a nutrient issue, whats n03 p04#s.. and even a mag flux can mess with some sps but the Jedi mind trick may be getting to much light? I'm not sure, but maybe a water test is in order, but I'd check nutrient #s. When those are in check along with alk its hard to kill montipora..

 

[Pistondog]

Have you done an icp test?
Nutrients?

 

[brmreefer]

Just a few things for consideration to hopefully assist:

• My SPS love high flow
• Checked my refractometer against a Tropic Marin High Precision Floating Hydrometer. I've been running high at 1.027-ish without knowing.
• Check the PAR with a rented/borrowed meter
• Send in an ICP to validate parameters. It is a useful tool
• Best to make informed adjustments versus guessing, and not too many at once

I was able to save a colony of Forest Fire Digi from STN with increased flow and adjusted salinity recently. Tried dipping and fragging with no luck before applying the previous adjustments.

 

[Baboon7]

Sounds like a nutrient issue, whats n03 p04#s.. and even a mag flux can mess with some sps but the Jedi mind trick may be getting to much light? I'm not sure, but maybe a water test is in order, but I'd check nutrient #s. When those are in check along with alk its hard to kill montipora..

The mag flux is a recent development just because I'm out of the additive but this was happening even at stable Mag. I was thinking maybe too much light but I have zoas higher in the tank than I've ever put sps and they are fine. Maybe Ill retest my nutrients now and see if I find anything

 

[Baboon7]

Have you done an icp test?
Nutrients?

I did an ICP test about a year ago and the only thing that came back was low strotnium. Im testing nutrients now

 

[Baboon7]

Just a few things for consideration to hopefully assist:

• My SPS love high flow
• Checked my refractometer against a Tropic Marin High Precision Floating Hydrometer. I've been running high at 1.027-ish without knowing.
• Check the PAR with a rented/borrowed meter
• Send in an ICP to validate parameters. It is a useful tool
• Best to make informed adjustments versus guessing, and not too many at once

I was able to save a colony of Forest Fire Digi from STN with increased flow and adjusted salinity recently. Tried dipping and fragging with no luck before applying the previous adjustments.

I rented BRS par meter to set my lights about a year back and they are running at 300 Par near the bottom and about 500 PAR near the top. Yeah Im trying to make adjustments only where I see issues just haven't found anything yet. Maybe not enough flow?? but my nems and cloves seem to be moving quite a bit so I don't know if that's the issue Im running my MP40s at 80%. Im testing nutrients now

 

[Baboon7]

So I just tested the nutrients and the Phosphate appears to be between 0 and .25 ppm by using an API test kit. The Nitrates seem to be pretty high between 8 and 12 tested with a red sea nitrate pro test kit. Could high nitrates be causing this??

 

[thatmanMIKEson]

So I just tested the nutrients and the Phosphate appears to be between 0 and .25 ppm by using an API test kit. The Nitrates seem to be pretty high between 8 and 12 tested with a red sea nitrate pro test kit. Could high nitrates be causing this??

honestly i only use the ulr hanna meters and i test n03 and p04 every 3 days or so, some times daily and add neo phos daily and nenitro a few times a week. im sure nutrients are not in ratio, which is not bad but you need to get accurate numbers, put those testers on yor list. and load up on reagent. with sps its all about nutrients and alk if your not use to checking them id start there.

8-12 nitrate isnt high but it is for 0 phosphates, but maybe your high phosphates idk

and to me it sounds like low nutrienst and allot of light which is a sps killer with high alk. 8.8 dkh isnt to high but i could swing to over 9 you say.

and flow i have a 48x24x 120g with 2 mp40s on mostly reefcrest during the day but it goes thru several patterns thruout the day. but it never goes over 75% with 4 90% 5min cycles. i first got them i had them going hard i found better p.e when i added a second mp40 and turned them way down.

 

[HomebroodExotics]

I rented BRS par meter to set my lights about a year back and they are running at 300 Par near the bottom and about 500 PAR near the top. Yeah Im trying to make adjustments only where I see issues just haven't found anything yet. Maybe not enough flow?? but my nems and cloves seem to be moving quite a bit so I don't know if that's the issue Im running my MP40s at 80%. Im testing nutrients now

That seems like a lot of par

 

[Baboon7]

honestly i only use the ulr hanna meters and i test n03 and p04 every 3 days or so, some times daily and add neo phos daily and nenitro a few times a week. im sure nutrients are not in ratio, which is not bad but you need to get accurate numbers, put those testers on yor list. and load up on reagent. with sps its all about nutrients and alk if your not use to checking them id start there.

8-12 nitrate isnt high but it is for 0 phosphates, but maybe your high phosphates idk

and to me it sounds like low nutrienst and allot of light which is a sps killer with high alk. 8.8 dkh isnt to high but i could swing to over 9 you say.

and flow i have a 48x24x 120g with 2 mp40s on mostly reefcrest during the day but it goes thru several patterns thruout the day. but it never goes over 75% with 4 90% 5min cycles. i first got them i had them going hard i found better p.e when i added a second mp40 and turned them way down.

Thanks for the advice. I'm going to turn the powerheads down a little and get a better handle on the nutrients and see if that helps

 

[HuduVudu]

So I just tested the nutrients and the Phosphate appears to be between 0 and .25 ppm by using an API test kit.

I hate API for this.

I highly recommend you get rid of this test kit. I would recommend Salifert, but it isn't that much better, but it should be more accurate than this. That range for the API is just meaningless. If you want to spend the money then get the Hanna Ultra low range, it is pricey but will give you a meaningful range.

Here is what you need to known on nutrients. You need to be really feeding the tank. The coral need it. BUT!!!!! you have to get the phosphates low but not negligable. This is true for nitrate but nitrate will export with anaerobic decomposition. This is the tough part for SPS or coral growing in general. The more sensitive SPS require VERY low phosphate, but a ton of food. How you accomplish this is up to you, but it necessary for coral growth. Also how low (or high) you allow your phosphates will determine the species that you can keep. There is a range so don't get crazy on your phosphate. You just need to get it to where the species that you have will accept it.

Also, I dose Iron. This seems to really help my tank, but please be aware I have a lot of iron consumers. What you put in will determine what you need to dose to keep things growing.

EDIT: I dose a lot of phyto and feed my LPS very regularly. Fish get live worms as much as they want. I work very hard to keep the food input high. LOL, it isn't as easy as you think.

 

[HuduVudu]

One more note on Phosphate. It can build up in your tank over time, so you need to make sure that you have a good export mechanism and you watch to make sure that your free phosphate is not drifting upward.

 

[MaxTremors]

If you’re getting 300 par on the sandbed and 500 at the top, you need to turn your lights down by 40-50%.

 

[Baboon7]

I hate API for this.

I highly recommend you get rid of this test kit. I would recommend Salifert, but it isn't that much better, but it should be more accurate than this. That range for the API is just meaningless. If you want to spend the money then get the Hanna Ultra low range, it is pricey but will give you a meaningful range.

Here is what you need to known on nutrients. You need to be really feeding the tank. The coral need it. BUT!!!!! you have to get the phosphates low but not negligable. This is true for nitrate but nitrate will export with anaerobic decomposition. This is the tough part for SPS or coral growing in general. The more sensitive SPS require VERY low phosphate, but a ton of food. How you accomplish this is up to you, but it necessary for coral growth. Also how low (or high) you allow your phosphates will determine the species that you can keep. There is a range so don't get crazy on your phosphate. You just need to get it to where the species that you have will accept it.

Also, I dose Iron. This seems to really help my tank, but please be aware I have a lot of iron consumers. What you put in will determine what you need to dose to keep things growing.

EDIT: I dose a lot of phyto and feed my LPS very regularly. Fish get live worms as much as they want. I work very hard to keep the food input high. LOL, it isn't as easy as you think.

Yeah I can only imagine. I dont feed my tank that often. About every other day. I felt the nitrates were getting too high when feeding a ton ( like in the 80s) so I cut way back. I just ordered a better phosphate and nitrate test so I'm going to try and get those under control. What ranges do you think I need to be at in order to keep montis and acros?

 

[Yazannreef]

In terms of range, I would shoot for 5ppm nitrate and 0.03 to 0.05 phosphate.

Get Hana ult phosphate ppb and Hanna nitrate high range.

 

[Yazannreef]

What are your export methods??

 

[Reef Tripp]

Check your pH calibration, I went through something similar until I discovered that my pH was 7.5 - 7.7, due to high co2 problems, ventilate the house and even if I only managed to raise the pH to 7.9 the SPS no longer die, good luck

 

[Baboon7]

Check your pH calibration, I went through something similar until I discovered that my pH was 7.5 - 7.7, due to high co2 problems, ventilate the house and even if I only managed to raise the pH to 7.9 the SPS no longer die, good luck

I recalibrated my ph probe the other day I should have added that I also use a recirculating CO2 scrubber so my PH usually stays between 8.0 and 8.3

 

[Baboon7]

What are your export methods??

I was using high capacity gfo for a while but I removed this in an effort to nail down what the issue is