Its almost time! I hope...

[jramy123]

Hey all been awhile since i joined up and posted my first forum thread and wanted to do an update and ask a question or two. So first off i mentioned me and my wife were buying our first house together(fixer upper) and well we got it and are in the renovation part of it and home to be able to move in at end of the month! YAY! Second after the holidays i got most of my hardware for my soon to setup saltwater tank. I got CPR bak pak dual(need HOB skimmer and loved my CPR i had b4) which is 100g rated and my tank is a 60 so hoping to reap some extra cleaning rewards here. Also got 2 165 LED lights from valspectra, master reef and saltwater kits, and a nice refractometer. I will be posting pics of my setup just as soon as we get into the house.

Now my question is this, i want to do dead rock live sand and so want to cure the rock obviously. How do i do this or can anyone point me to a good article here? ive googled and youtubed and ive seen different ideas and i want one from a hobbyist. I cant afford to do 60-70 lbs of live rock right away so thats why i want to do dead. Is curing where it gets the bacteria we need in tank or is it just to kill stuff on rock? Thanx for any and all help and i look forward to posting more!

Jeff

 

[Ty Hamatake]

Definitely looking forward to those pictures! Curing dead rock takes time, space, and equipment. It's suggested that you fill a tub (brute trash can are relatively cheap and absolutely awesome for this hobby) with the dead rock, saltwater, a heater, and a powerhead then let it sit in the dark for weeks on end until all the organics have a chance to break down. In my opinion it is easier to just use dry rock. This way you can scape the tank and at least have something to look at while it's cycling. You could do this with dead rock, but be ready for some serious algae/smell problems. Also, curing the rock will grow your bacteria population, but if you let it sit too long without a food source the bacteria will die and you'll have to cycle the rock again in the tank.

Keep the questions and updates coming!

 

[jramy123]

Definitely looking forward to those pictures! Curing dead rock takes time, space, and equipment. It's suggested that you fill a tub (brute trash can are relatively cheap and absolutely awesome for this hobby) with the dead rock, saltwater, a heater, and a powerhead then let it sit in the dark for weeks on end until all the organics have a chance to break down. In my opinion it is easier to just use dry rock. This way you can scape the tank and at least have something to look at while it's cycling. You could do this with dead rock, but be ready for some serious algae/smell problems. Also, curing the rock will grow your bacteria population, but if you let it sit too long without a food source the bacteria will die and you'll have to cycle the rock again in the tank.

Keep the questions and updates coming!

is dry rock just live rock thats dried? see i didnt know there was a 3rd type of rock lol. i was gonna buy from marine depot or bulk reef the dried rock, is that what you mean? you have probably opened a can of worms with me lol as i wanna do it right this time.

 

[jramy123]

is dry rock just live rock thats dried? see i didnt know there was a 3rd type of rock lol. i was gonna buy from marine depot or bulk reef the dried rock, is that what you mean? you have probably opened a can of worms with me lol as i wanna do it right this time.

woops! just reread both sales pages, its called dried live rock, is that what u meant?

 

[Ty Hamatake]

woops! just reread both sales pages, its called dried live rock, is that what u meant?

So, for the most part, there is live rock, dead rock, and dry rock. Live is obviously live (bacteria, algae, sponges, etc). Dead rock was live and now all that organic matter is still on the rock and will breakdown once you put it in the water, hence the need to cure it. Generally you don't want all that happening in your tank. Now dry rock, dry rock is great because it's clean for the most part and doesn't require and curing. It still needs to cycle, but there's no organic matter in there to breakdown in the water.

I'm not sure why BRS calls their reef saver "dry live rock". Hopefully someone more knowledgeable comes along.

 

[jramy123]

so curing is not the cycle? that would be where i go and add a bottle of "reef starter" like ive read?

 

[Brew12]

so curing is not the cycle? that would be where i go and add a bottle of "reef starter" like ive read?

Curing is the process of letting all the dead matter on live rock decay off. Things like sponges generally don't do well when live rock is transported and may generate a lot of ammonia when they decay.

Cycling is the process by which bacteria convert ammonia to nitrite to nitrate. This is called the Nitrogen cycle and we call the bacteria involved nitrifying bacteria.

Curing can generate the ammonia needed to feed the bacteria already in live rock but true live rock will already have bacteria in it and not need to be cycled.

If you go with dry rock, you can get your tank to cycle faster by using a bacteria product like Biospira or Stability. This will boost your population of nitrifying bacteria fairly quickly.

 

[Ty Hamatake]

so curing is not the cycle? that would be where i go and add a bottle of "reef starter" like ive read?

Just to add on, you don't need the bacteria in a bottle. Especially if you plan on using live sand. You can start with dry rock and dry sand (both much cheaper) and cycle a tank just fine. It will take longer, but if you learn one thing from this hobby it will be patience.

 

[Ty Hamatake]

Curing is the process of letting all the dead matter on live rock decay off. Things like sponges generally don't do well when live rock is transported and may generate a lot of ammonia when they decay.

Cycling is the process by which bacteria convert ammonia to nitrite to nitrate. This is called the Nitrogen cycle and we call the bacteria involved nitrifying bacteria.

Curing can generate the ammonia needed to feed the bacteria already in live rock but true live rock will already have bacteria in it and not need to be cycled.

If you go with dry rock, you can get your tank to cycle faster by using a bacteria product like Biospira or Stability. This will boost your population of nitrifying bacteria fairly quickly.

Am I mistaken that BRS' term "dry live rock" for their reef saver rock is misleading? I haven't ever ordered any, but isn't it man made, uncured, uncycled rock that have never been wet before?

 

[ThunderGoose]

I bought dry rock from Marine Depot (AquaMaxx Eco-rock, eco for ecological not economical, so called b/c it's not farmed off a reef and then dried) and did not need to do anything to "cure" it. It's lightweight, easy to break into smaller parts and I've been quite happy so far.

Of course I'm only a few weeks into cycling my tank (and it's all going on schedule - got my algae bloom going). Of course I DID add bacteria.

 

[thrasher1472]

I see what you mean Ty, perhaps dry base rock would be less confusing. I think that is how CaribSea describes it anyways

 

[jramy123]

yeah this is rather confusing lol. obviously last time i did this and did what lfs said was wrong. well if i get the dry rock i can put with live sand(ill be buying live about 70-80 lbs) and add biospira that will start the cycle? cause i dont need to cure it since it was never alive? sorry just trying to get ready for when i start lol

 

[Brew12]

yeah this is rather confusing lol. obviously last time i did this and did what lfs said was wrong. well if i get the dry rock i can put with live sand(ill be buying live about 70-80 lbs) and add biospira that will start the cycle? cause i dont need to cure it since it was never alive? sorry just trying to get ready for when i start lol

To start your cycle, all you really need is a source of ammonia. The nitrifying bacteria will make their way into your tank even if you do nothing but use dry rock and dry sand.

This ammonia is typically added in a few ways.
Add a hardy fish. IMO this is cruel to the fish as you are basically seeing if you can get a fish to live with ammonia burns long enough to make the water safe.
Add a frozen shrimp. Not a bad idea because but it can look a bit unpleasant and you never know just how much ammonia it is adding as it decays.
Ghost feed. Feeding the tank just as if it has fish in it so the food decays into ammonia. Again, not bad, but you don't know how much ammonia is being produced.
Adding pure ammonia. This is my favorite method. You can measure and add the ammonia directly to the tank. When you can go from 2ppm ammonia to 0ppm ammonia in 24 hours you know you are done. Using Dr Tims ammonia chloride is the easiest way to do this. You can use store bought ammonia as long as you can find one that doesn't add soap. Ace hardware normally carries some safe to use. Then you just need to do the calculations for that particular product to get to 2ppm (or 4ppm) ammonia.

Compared to many other types of bacteria, the most common nitrifying bacteria are slow reproducers. This is why people may chose to go with live sand and a product like Biospira. It is a way to build the initial population of bacteria more quickly. It is not at all necessary.