jda's 240g Acropora Rebuild

[Oz_Puffy]

Some stunning pieces there. I would love to see a full tank shot and more detail on the setup given the amazing growth and colours that you have.

 

[jda]

Patience - I am going to be likely reefing for 20 more years, so this is all not going to happen overnight.

Stuff:
Tank is Oceanic 240g... it is something like 78x27x27, or something close to that. It is a weird size. It has a 24" wide glass center brace of 1/2 glass which I hate. It was made about 30 years ago. It is on the pine Oceanic Stand, which I both love and hate... love that it is low and I can look top-down and hate that it is low and I have to use short skimmers (LifeReef does not fit).

Open top.

I have a pair of Tunze 6105s and a real Wavebox that I made out of acrylic and a Tunze 6100 that is probably 15 years old. I have a 3/4 to 1" wave going all the time which moves 100% of the water in a gentle motion This wave washes in between all of the acropora branches very nicely. I love the wavebox. I totally believe that you can have too much flow and that effective flow is more important than more GPH turnover - the wavebox moves 100% of the water all the time, so hard to quantify that.

Medusa Dual Stage Temp Controller with 6x Ehiem 300w heaters - 2 in the tank and 4 in the sump. Temp probe is in the tank. I have a 10-12 inch Vornado that comes on with the lights in the summer and blows across the surface. Heating costs is my #1 expense with about 65% of the whole tank. Even in the summer, the 58-60 degree nights and low humidity cool the tank a lot.

Korallin CaRx with a 20lb tank fed with a QuietOne 1200. Hand tune. This is all that I dose other.

EuroReef 8-2 with Sedra 5000, ASM G2 with Sicce PSK and some sort of unknown old RO skimmer body that now has a Tunze Hydrofoamer pump.

Home made 90 gallon sump with Tunze 3155 with a 29g tank as reservoir. I carried buckets or used hoses until a few years ago - with a large sump, I only had to refill it every 5-7 days. The Osmolator is a newer thing for me.

I have 15g fuge where the chaeto will double every few weeks. It is lit by a cheap Chinese 4x T5 unit with GE 6500k T5 bulbs which I only change when the burn out.

Laguna Max Flo return pump of about 1300 GPH (I forget).

I have 3x 250w 14k Phoenix in a AquaMedic Ocean Light - I have had this at least a decade. There are 150w 14k Phoenix on the end since I hate the dark ends. I have real m80 and m81 ballasts. I change the bulbs between 12 and 18 months, but usually more towards the 12 month range... usually around Valentines Day every year. No T5s or LED supplements - just 9 or 10 hours of MH on this tank (it has been so long since I looked at the timer, I do not even know anymore).

No controller.

Fish get NLS pellets in a Ehiem Autofeeder along with some random flake/chips/whatever and PE Mysis.

I do not feed the corals.

I have a 40g breeder attached to the same sump with a 250w 14k Phoenix, 2x 24" T5s and a RB strip. This is a fish staging tank and a frag tank type of deal - I keep my softies and LPS in here along with acros that have not grown up yet.

I have three inches of sand, which I believe in VERY much. I also have a lot of real live rock. If I were starting a new tank today (and I did two years ago), it would have sand and live rock as well. The stuff is just too important to what I do.

Daily Routine:
I look every day to make sure that the CaRx is bubbling and dripping

Few times a week:
Test Alk

Every week or two:
Throw out half of the chaeto
Empty the skimmer cups
Siphon some water a do a change - suck out detritus in the BB fuge and also a few spots in the tank. Change is usually 2 or 3 buckets and I don't freak out about it... just do what is necessary.
Have my arms go numb scraping coralline

Few times a year:
Test Calcium
Refill the CaRx

When something is out of whack or other special request/event:
Test some building blocks
About every 3-4 years, I vacuum the sand (slowly and over the course of a year)
Drain and clean out the sump every few years - it gets tons of sponge, hard worms and detritus in there

Methodology:
I do not like to use chemicals, but I have some on hand (GAC, GFO and LC to treat live rock that I love to get from hobbyists leaving the hobby). I like to be near to NSW type of parameters with 7.0ish alk, 425 calcium, 35 ppt salinity and low, but detectable building blocks. I do not sweat if these bounce around a bit, but the natural methods of a fuge keep the P about .01 and the sandbed keep the N under 1. I feed a bunch and have lots of availability - I believe that building block availability is what is important and looking at residual levels on a test kit are a fools errand as long as they are not too high (high import and high export).

I like to let my stuff grow and do not like to sell frags. I do like to trade. I would rather give to a local in need, charity or local club auction than make money beyond what I need to keep the tank moving. I like to have local (and some national) friends have backups of some of my favorite corals.

I do not trust new equipment until it has a 3+ year track record of longevity without having lots of complaints, replacements or iterations to fix things. While I know that this is longer than most are in the hobby, that is not me. I want stuff that can last a decade, or more... mostly because I need to not worry that it will fail out of nowhere. This is why I still like Ranco/Medusa over Inkbird or Apex (the probes suck), AC or DC pumps and Tunze over most EcoTech (they are pretty good, just not Tunze good).

I am function over form. I do not care about a clean build as much as I care about healthy corals and fish. For the most part, we took these animals out of the ocean and their needs are more important than mine when you have to choose. Colored PVC and not having cords in the tank does nothing for me. I have my tanks in rooms where people are and I can tell you that nobody notices a Tunze cord with a 10" clam and some huge colonies with the fish swimming in and out of them.

I have a second system that I started 2 year ago that is soon ready to start getting corals and stuff. I will make another thread for this one.

Out of Town
When I leave, I have a friend (or daughters) who refills the ATO reservoir, looks for swimming fish and lit lights and looks for bubbling and dripping CaRx. He is not capable of doing anything if none of this is working, but I have another friend who reefs who is on-call if something is not running. I return the favor for him when he is out of town. I have never needed him, which is why I love having the reliable equipment. I have had to go to his house a few times for a faulty wet Apex sensor, a failed DC pump and a seal that blew out on a ReeFlow.

 

[Dr. Jim]

Hi Doug,

Could you elaborate a little more on your thoughts and experiences with sand vs bare-bottom?

26 yrs ago, I set up a 500 gal with a deep sand bed on a plenum (when plenums were the "in thing.") Years later, I revamped the tank and got rid of the sand (and found lots of calcified blocks of sand). I was only able to siphon about 1/3 of the sand over the years because of the rock formation. Needless to say, this sand was incredibly filthy after 5 or so years.....(not saying that this is bad or good though).

After this, all my tanks have been bare-bottom but I have been long debating what to do when I move and set up my "dream tank." I definitely like the looks of sand, but that is not the priority. I know that the surface area and substrate for bacterial and other micro-organisms is beneficial, but the thing that holds me back is wondering how long a tank can go with sand without the sand eventually becoming a problem. (I don't care about the siphoning maintenance, but know that not all the sand can be siphoned).

Any thoughts on this are appreciated! Thanks!

 

[User1]

Home made 90 gallon sump with Tunze 3155 with a 29g tank as reservoir. I carried buckets or used hoses until a few years ago - with a large sump, I only had to refill it every 5-7 days. The Osmolator is a newer thing for me.

More on the sump, pictures, how the Tunze is used, reservoir, and Osmolator?

 

[jda]

Gonzos Cooke Monster - IMO the best of the ARC Fireworks, Merlins Staff and those type of corals.


BC Blueberry Nasuta

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BC Honeycomb or RMF Gila Monster (I think) - could be BC Blue Ghost


PEA Tenuis - get red and yellow polyps when going well and glows under RB LEDs


Forgot the name WWC Millepora - maybe Ding Dang... it will come back to me when I least expect it


Heart of the Ocean Colony - probably 4" by 5" and hard to get the color in a photograph


Tyree Blue Matrix

Walt Disney that I am going to put/mount into the tank, probably
[url=https://flic.kr/p/2jvLXgi]

 

[jda]

I like the sand for many reasons.

First, I like the critters that live in it and the jobs that they perform. I like that the sandbed will keep all kinds of microfauna that will destroy ich tomonts, or at least make them fight for their lives when they drop off of the fish. I have a cucumber that will divide and grow to equilibrium with the amount of gunk in the sand. I like the looks, but this is secondary.

I like that the sand will buffer a bit if the parameters get out of whack - nearly impossible to crash a tank with sand since it will melt and provide alk if the alk gets too low.

Mostly, I like that the sandbed provides massive surface area for oxic and anoxic bacteria and that the anoxic bacteria will keep the N low, but not too low with always enough present to keep the equilibrium moving forward, but not too much to limit calcification... basically, enough nitrate to not be growth limiting, but not high enough to cause any issues... low, but not too low. I am usually about .1, but sometimes can get to .2 and you need an ICP test to even detect it.

I also like that the sand (and rock) provide a buffer for phosphate. This way, it is nearly impossible to get too low since the sand will release some if the water level goes down, and absorb a bit more when the tank level gets higher. I like to skim a lot and grow macro and my P stays pretty low, but the sand buffers it to near perfection around 1-5 ppb, but it is usually about 1-3 ppb.

To summarize, I like to import and export heavy with lots of available N and P, but with low residual levels. The sand plays a huge part in this with nitrate reduction, phosphate buffering and ich/fish-parasite management. I do not want to do any of this myself, so that is why I do not go bare bottom where more personal intervention is needed to do the jobs that the sand does.

-----

I do believe in maintaining the sandbed. I really loved Dr. Ron, but he got a few minor things wrong with his whole sandbed philosophy even though he got a WHOLE LOT right, IMO. Even though the detritus that falls to the sand is quickly consumed of any nutrients and becomes benign, I like to get it out because it can "gum up the works." I vacuum the sand in small quantities with months in between about every 4 years. You can never get under the rocks, so just what I can get to. The slowness allows the oxic, anoxic and critters to re-establish after the grey gunk is removed. I also have to replace some sand when it gets "low."

@Dr. Jim To your point, I have never had a sandbed get solid, but I have heard that this is usually a pH thing, but I do not know for sure. There is no need for a plenum, just sand on the bottom is fine.

 

[Sweet Reef Corals]

Not trying to hijack but I once let the Mg get too low (1100) on a previous setup and my aragonite sand started hardening in spots. Especially anywhere it was under pressure, like under a piece of live rock. Even after correcting the low Mg the sand clumps never went back to normal and I had to remove them. Just thought I’d share my experience with sand clumps.

 

[jda]

One more thing on sand... it is sometimes called a time bomb, phosphate leecher or other wrong things. When you understand that aragonite binds phosphate, you understand that the sand can also do the dirty work of masking poor husbandry by the tank owner that is not otherwise controlling their phosphate. The aragonite (sand and rock) cannot do this forever and once it gets too saturated, the tank levels will rise quickly and the owner blames the sand often parroting what they have heard from other informed hobbyists. This is where people get the "time bomb" and "leecher" but neither are true.

There is no time limit on a sandbed that is not asked to pick up the slack for a sloppy hobbyist, or is maintained ever half a decade.

I have found that 2 to 3 inches of sand will effectively chew up nitrate and turn it into nitrogen gas. I do not feel any need to use 6 inches. I call this a medium sandbed and I shoot for 3 inches. This three inches cannot be blown around all the time and still be expected to keep nitrate low.

 

[Nburg's Reef]

I've known you for posting a lot of good advice, but never saw your tank/corals, very impressive. I've always agreed with almost all of your advice and posts. It's nice when someone that provides advice has the proof to back up their credibility (as opposed to those who say 'things' are working for them, but their rocks are white, or have a tank full of 1' frags). I know maintaining a build thread seems like work sometime, but its very helpful for those looking for inspiration or a few bits to help their reef. I'm following along.

At what point do you see a CaRX being worth it over dosing? I just moved and restarted most of my corals, so right now 2 part is good enough, but I am feeling long term, CaRX might be better.

 

[jda]

CaRx vs dosing needs to mesh with the personality of the reefer. I do think that CaRx is better since it adds more than just carbonate and calcium (and mag if you do three part), but not enough to fight it if you are not inclined to want to figure it out and/or spend the money. I will never run a tank with stonies without a CaRx, but it fits me and I know how to tune the thing with ease. I have run a CaRx on a biocube before so I have no issues using them on smaller tanks.

The natural media melts and provides all of the things that the coral up took when they made that skeleton. If you do stick with 2 part, then change some water or dose other things to replace those other elements as well.

All of this said, natural media has been a bit of a pain to find lately, but appears to be on the comeback. Other types of aragonite like crushed coral aquarium gravel will work. Dolomite and calcite is harder to melt but still has more elements in it than just 2 part provides.

In short, it is most certainly better to succeed with 2 part than to fight a CaRx if your personality is not inclined to succeed with it, but a CaRx is better if you can do either.

 

[Dr. Jim]

One more thing on sand... it is sometimes called a time bomb, phosphate leecher or other wrong things. When you understand that aragonite binds phosphate, you understand that the sand can also do the dirty work of masking poor husbandry by the tank owner that is not otherwise controlling their phosphate. The aragonite (sand and rock) cannot do this forever and once it gets too saturated, the tank levels will rise quickly and the owner blames the sand often parroting what they have heard from other informed hobbyists. This is where people get the "time bomb" and "leecher" but neither are true.

There is no time limit on a sandbed that is not asked to pick up the slack for a sloppy hobbyist, or is maintained ever half a decade.

I have found that 2 to 3 inches of sand will effectively chew up nitrate and turn it into nitrogen gas. I do not feel any need to use 6 inches. I call this a medium sandbed and I shoot for 3 inches. This three inches cannot be blown around all the time and still be expected to keep nitrate low.

Just to finish the sand discussion (if you don't mind).....

There comes a depth where anaerobic bacteria grows, as you know. I was always under the impression that this could happen in as little as 3-4" of sand (hence the reason for the plenum in the old days). Apparently, you aren't worried about stirring up sulfates and other nasties when you siphon?

And, lastly, what sand do you use? I always have used the very fine Oolyte sand.

------------------------

Thanks, Doug, for your input on "sand." Now..... this is the second thing that you may be influencing me on! The other one, (from our PMs), would be: adding fuel to my long-time consideration of setting up a Sound Room for vinyl! (I miss those "crackles" on old Beatles and Stones records!)

 

[jda]

I have never smelled any Hydrogen Sulfide in my tank at all. I use a mixed grade reef type of sand... usually a Carib Sea. I do not like all sugar sized alone. I usually mix a few types from the 40 lb dry sacks to the 20lb wet kind. 2-3 inches works plenty fine in my tanks for nitrate reduction.

All of the junk goes down the vacuum tube and the tanks stays clean. I do turn off all of the pumps. Still no h2s smells.

For fun, this is in my office and gets used every day. I have a nicer setup in my family room that would not fit in my office. Other than the albums in the top right, each was chosen for rareness, first edition and something that I like and want to listen to. "Normal" type of stuff just gets played on a streaming service. The really rare stuff is hung on the walls in frames.

 

[jda]

More on the sump, pictures, how the Tunze is used, reservoir, and Osmolator?

I have the Osmolator pump in a 29g tank that I got at Petco dollar-per-gallon. It pumps over the rim of the tank and empties into the open air. Textbook setup... nothing special. I will likely get to some sump and frag tank pics later after I clean them up.

 

[Nburg's Reef]

CaRx vs dosing needs to mesh with the personality of the reefer. I do think that CaRx is better since it adds more than just carbonate and calcium (and mag if you do three part), but not enough to fight it if you are not inclined to want to figure it out and/or spend the money. I will never run a tank with stonies without a CaRx, but it fits me and I know how to tune the thing with ease. I have run a CaRx on a biocube before so I have no issues using them on smaller tanks.

The natural media melts and provides all of the things that the coral up took when they made that skeleton. If you do stick with 2 part, then change some water or dose other things to replace those other elements as well.

All of this said, natural media has been a bit of a pain to find lately, but appears to be on the comeback. Other types of aragonite like crushed coral aquarium gravel will work. Dolomite and calcite is harder to melt but still has more elements in it than just 2 part provides.

In short, it is most certainly better to succeed with 2 part than to fight a CaRx if your personality is not inclined to succeed with it, but a CaRx is better if you can do either.

I think my biggest reservation is the potential pH drop. I live in a LEED certified condo building, which is air tight... so unless I open my bedroom window which opens a full 5 degrees, I don't get a whole lot of fresh air in. I've installed a simple CO2 scrubber to combat it, but feel a CaRx might make my pH problem worse, lol. Its funny, I can tell from my pH log when I had company over, when I was gone for the weekend or when the windows were open.

 

[mrpizzaface]

I have never smelled any Hydrogen Sulfide in my tank at all. I use a mixed grade reef type of sand... usually a Carib Sea. I do not like all sugar sized alone. I usually mix a few types from the 40 lb dry sacks to the 20lb wet kind. 2-3 inches works plenty fine in my tanks for nitrate reduction.

All of the junk goes down the vacuum tube and the tanks stays clean. I do turn off all of the pumps. Still no h2s smells.

For fun, this is in my office and gets used every day. I have a nicer setup in my family room that would not fit in my office. Other than the albums in the top right, each was chosen for rareness, first edition and something that I like and want to listen to. "Normal" type of stuff just gets played on a streaming service. The really rare stuff is hung on the walls in frames.

which is more difficult..,
Building and maintaining a successful plus 5 year Acropora dominant reef tank?
Or
Becoming a single digit handicap?

 

[ScottB]

Thanks @jda for sharing your pictures and methods. I wish there were more tenuis keepers like you that were local to me for trading and sharing info. Keep the updates coming.

 

[Useful_Idiot]

Glad to see this build thread, appreciate all the info in it so far. That's an old tank, any plans to replace or reseal it?

 

[jda]

which is more difficult..,
Building and maintaining a successful plus 5 year Acropora dominant reef tank?
Or
Becoming a single digit handicap?

Interestingly enough, both are easier when you are young. I started both golf and reefing around 14 and we rode our bikes to the golf course, baseball, football and to the fish store near me. Golf is easier if you start earlier and you can get some flexibility in your spine and hips for a good powerful turn to keep everything aligned. Reefing is easier when young since I could not afford any super high dollar stuff and the easier stuff is just easier while you are learning. However, I don't know much about golf anymore since I play so little... went out last week and shot 44/34 in a bizarre display of never looking like I was in a bunker before and a few OBs, but always better to be two under on the second nine so that I feel better about it later. Once all of the girls are off of the payroll (meaning time needed, not so much money), my reefs and golf will get much more attention, but, alas, my baseball days are long behind me. I still have plans to play in at least one Colorado Amateur.

 

[Dr. Jim]

So, Doug.....now that you've got me thinking about going back to using sand in my next "build"....
I'm wondering about flow. You mentioned that you use something coarser than the oolyte I am most familiar with (other than our only choice of dolomite in the old days)....so maybe there would be less of a problem with sand blowing with the typically high currents used for SPS with coarser substrate?

But what I'm most curious about is your take on the Wave Box. When I had my 500, I had two Tunze Wave Boxes next to each other, in series, on one side of the tank. In that huge tank, every coral would sway back and forth, nicely, no matter where it was positioned. I definitely think that this kind of wave action is ideal BUT, is that enough? I did have a couple of power heads, but they seem to defeat the purpose of the wave box. I had return water piped through spray bars on the bottom, so water was also constantly moving upwards (although I'm reluctant to risk siphoning accidents with this design in my next build).

So, do you think the Wave Boxes are enough by themselves for SPS?

Thanks for your thoughts.

 

[jda]

I have not had issue with sand blowing around once it gets coated in bacteria and slime and stuff. If I do, then this is a sign that I have too much flow - I do believe in too much flow.

The wave box keeps everything swaying nicely and stirred up, but the Tunze 6105s are needed to move water around and to wash stuff away. I use both and need both. The 6105s do not take away from the wave action.