Keeping CuC Alive in Quarantine.

[Hugh Mann]

So it’s coming time for me to restock the crew. While the exact composition and numbers are TBA, thinking it will be around 15 blue leg hermits, 5 nassarius, 1 mexican turbo and a skunk shrimp. Ultimately they’re going in my 260gal, which currently has a tuxedo urchin, 1 hermit crab, 1 nassarius and several hundred asterina stars and cerith snails, or something that looks a lot like cerith snails.

The first (and last) time I QT’d inverts, I had an abysmally high mortality rate I’d rather avoid. I’m wondering if anyone has any advice on keeping them alive in an isolated system for 45 days. I have plenty of algae caked live rock I can take from the DT sump and either a 20 long or 20 tall to use. Or both, if I get another heater and folks think that may help. Any advice on anything else a guy can do to keep them alive while I wait out the fallow? Thanks.

 

[dangles]

What are you wanting to protect against?

I believe there are a few threads about that subject floating around here. I was wondering the same thing a few months ago. The consensus I got was that the risk from inverts is lower, and the difficulty is much higher, so most people just don’t qt them. I’m sure there are exceptions. I personally decided the cost/benefit just wasn’t there so I don’t.

 

[Hugh Mann]

What are you wanting to protect against?

I believe there are a few threads about that subject floating around here. I was wondering the same thing a few months ago. The consensus I got was that the risk from inverts is lower, and the difficulty is much higher, so most people just don’t qt them. I’m sure there are exceptions. I personally decided the cost/benefit just wasn’t there so I don’t.

What are you wanting to protect against?

I believe there are a few threads about that subject floating around here. I was wondering the same thing a few months ago. The consensus I got was that the risk from inverts is lower, and the difficulty is much higher, so most people just don’t qt them. I’m sure there are exceptions. I personally decided the cost/benefit just wasn’t there so I don’t.

Velvet, primarily.

I know the risks are a lot lower, but as I learned the hard way, not zero. Lost 85% of my livestock from $20 in snails. So it’s definitely worth it to me.

 

[Stomatopods17]

You're more likely to get velvet free swimming from other tanks' water than from inverts themselves.

You can actually just toothbrush and rinse the shells of the snails. Velvet doesn't have a protomont stage like Ich does, and in general inverts aren't infected by it. Shrimp shouldn't be able to harbor it and a molt alone would remove any, snails and hermits are a maybe just because shells can be covered with all sorts of things.

I personally never bothered with QTing inverts, just purchase from a reputable source that doesn't sell a lot of fish (like reefcleaners which doesn't even sell fish only inverts) and be mindful of whose tank water sneaks in the system (like an LFS).

If you're still dedicated to it, I'd focus on the mortality rate, has anything in the QT you're using been dosed previously? anything thats in the silicone, sand, rock, filtration, etc from previous dosing can still kill inverts.

 

[Hugh Mann]

You're more likely to get velvet free swimming from other tanks' water than from inverts themselves.

Velvet only attaches to fish, then spores are free swimming. Inverts could only carry it if the water they're in is transported into your tank.

Snails its possible but very rare, mainly just because water gets trapped in their shell, and I would only worry about the large ones anyways.

Incorrect. You’re missing part of their lifecycle, the tomont stage, which forms a cyst on any hard surface, which can include exoskeletons and shells. It is rare, yes. However, as mentioned in a previous comment, it has happened to me once before. A risk I won’t take again.

“Tomonts: This is the “egg” stage, which encysts upon hard surfaces. It cannot be washed away like free swimmers, and scrubbing tomonts off is likely to be very hit or miss. In addition, it is unlikely that coral dips have any impact on tomonts, since not even copper can eradicate them (copper only kills free swimmers). So, the only way of dealing with this threat is to wait out any tomonts by isolating newly purchased corals/inverts to a fishless environment. As previously mentioned, a frag tank is ideal to use as a coral/invert QT so long as no fish are being housed in it.”

Source- https://humble.fish/community/index.php?threads/coral-invert-quarantine-time-frames.487/

 

[Stomatopods17]

Incorrect. You’re missing part of their lifecycle, the tomont stage, which forms a cyst on any hard surface, which can include exoskeletons and shells. It is rare, yes. However, as mentioned in a previous comment, it has happened to me once before. A risk I won’t take again.

“Tomonts: This is the “egg” stage, which encysts upon hard surfaces. It cannot be washed away like free swimmers, and scrubbing tomonts off is likely to be very hit or miss. In addition, it is unlikely that coral dips have any impact on tomonts, since not even copper can eradicate them (copper only kills free swimmers). So, the only way of dealing with this threat is to wait out any tomonts by isolating newly purchased corals/inverts to a fishless environment. As previously mentioned, a frag tank is ideal to use as a coral/invert QT so long as no fish are being housed in it.”

Source- https://humble.fish/community/index.php?threads/coral-invert-quarantine-time-frames.487/

That is ich, not velvet. Even the source is about ich.

Velvet doesn't have that egg stage on hard surfaces it has it in the fish. Ich does. I've had ich outbreaks before and they're not fun so I fully understand QTing hard shelled inverts, rock, etc.

The same OP of that thread in post #10 even says they just rinse echinoderms and put them in DT for velvet because if its rare for ich to do it its even rarer for velvet to be able to since it can't encrust just basically debris through the water on them like dust.

Now for snails/hermits its very unlikely but still possible so if you want to take that precaution it won't hurt, especially if the store you purchase does have host fish so the chance of an infection is more likely. I'd personally just leave a rock in there with algae growing, and feed mysis or similar. As long as its not a QT that's been dosed with anything in the past they should be fine in there.

 

[Squidward]

I qurantined inverts for a minimum 30 days. So far so good. But I rarely buy inverts anymore. My trochus makes babies and have lasted a long time now. I would just feed the inverts with plenty of food, pellets, etc so they don't go around killing each other.

 

[Hugh Mann]

That is ich, not velvet. Even the source is about ich.

Velvet doesn't have that egg stage on hard surfaces it has it in the fish. Ich does. I've had ich outbreaks before and they're not fun so I fully understand QTing hard shelled inverts, rock, etc.

The same OP of that thread in post #10 even says they just rinse echinoderms and put them in DT for velvet because if its rare for ich to do it its even rarer for velvet to be able to since it can't encrust just basically debris through the water on them like dust.

Now for snails/hermits its very unlikely but still possible so if you want to take that precaution it won't hurt, especially if the store you purchase does have host fish so the chance of an infection is more likely. I'd personally just leave a rock in there with algae growing, and feed mysis or similar. As long as its not a QT that's been dosed with anything in the past they should be fine in there.

Velvet absolutely has a tomont stage, exactly like ich does. Pretty much anything you look up in regards to marine velvet mentions this as part of the lifecycle.
“Humblefish said:
Just remember that ich/velvet tomonts CAN encyst to the exoskeleton of any crustacean (including shrimp).”

As for the invert QT itself and the mortality rate. When I first did ran it, it was a brand new 20 gallon. New filter, heater, airstone, substrate and rock, all thoroughly rinsed. Only thing that was “used” previously was the filter sponge so I didn’t have to cycle it. Ammonia badge showed nothing, nor did water tests show any ammonia or nitrite. Water was clean, regular water changes. Fed them. So I couldn’t tell you what was killing them. About the only thing I can do differently for sure is I have a boatload of algae covered rock to use, which I didn’t in my first tank as it was all cemented together and no sump.

I should also add I don’t have the option to buy from dealers that don’t also sell fish. I live in Canada, which cuts off a lot of the market, and the nearest airport that would take shipments of live animals is a 2.5 hour drive, which is somewhat coincidentally, the same place that is the nearest location that sells anything saltwater related.

 

[ISpeakForTheSeas]

As mentioned, the algae is good (and you'll want to give them plenty of algae to eat), but make sure you get them some meaty foods too (like pellets).