Kessil LEDs, Intensity and PAR

[Bradley Keck]

Oh, one more question. Is the shimmer basically taking measurements with pumps/powerheads on, and no shimmer with them off?

 

[Dana Riddle]

OK, I just studied the graph again. It's the 10in mark that is the center of the light right? Also, I would say to the OP, that Reefwiser(love that name) is right that you won't get enough light intensity down low in that tank, but you can compensate for that with your aquascape. SPS will have to be up high and more towards the center of each puck. You would need to build up your aquascape considerably in the vertical direction. That could make for a neat aquascape! Then you would want some low light corals down lower. You can make it work with what you have, but you should supplement those Kessils with 2x80w T5's on either side.

The aquarium used for testing is a 120-gallon, 48"x24"x24", with overflows at each end. The light was centered over the tank at 12" from the right side (this positioned the light squarely between the right side glass and the top's center brace.) Maybe this photo will help:

 

[oreo54]

I initially checked PPFD and saw a drop beyond 60% on the Color dial (and Intensity at 100%.) This was a quick test and I thought it was possibly an error due to positioning. A second test (using jigs to hold everything in place) confirmed the initial results. Wattage shows differences at various settings as well, so I don't think it's largely due to PAR sensor response.

Would have liked to see Kessil logic being more.. err ..efficient..but only looks like about 10W difference
add differences in diode L/w efficiency..

could have something to do w/ the spacial placement of the diodes in relation to the lens..though doesn't completely explain the 50/50 but is the most "watts"
collection of variables..

 

[Dana Riddle]

Oh, one more question. Is the shimmer basically taking measurements with pumps/powerheads on, and no shimmer with them off?

Yes, correct. Tunze pump on and off. Just to make sure you're looking at the charts correctly: The measurements were taken at a depth of 18" on a horizontal plane (the eggcrate you see on the bottom was the grid used to position the PAR sensor. I used a Magic Marker to outline a square every 4 inches on center.) It would be easy to think the measurements were taken at various depths - not so, amplitudes represent light intensities, dot septh.)

 

[Bradley Keck]

Yes, correct. Tunze pump on and off. Just to make sure you're looking at the charts correctly: The measurements were taken at a depth of 18" on a horizontal plane (the eggcrate you see on the bottom was the grid used to position the PAR sensor. I used a Magic Marker to outline a square every 4 inches on center.) It would be easy to think the measurements were taken at various depths - not so, amplitudes represent light intensities, dot septh.)

OK, got it. That makes sense. I see what your saying about the Y axis being PAR level and not depth. Knowing the placement now makes this even more interesting. The effect of reflection off the side glass, and the effect of shimmer are amazing!

 

[Dana Riddle]

OK, got it. That makes sense. I see what your saying about the Y axis being PAR level and not depth. Knowing the placement now makes this even more interesting. The effect of reflection off the side glass, and the effect of shimmer are amazing!

Yes, I was a little surprised by the effects of reflection and shimmer. Live and learn.

 

[madweazl]

Would have liked to see Kessil logic being more.. err ..efficient..but only looks like about 10W difference
add differences in diode L/w efficiency..

could have something to do w/ the spacial placement of the diodes in relation to the lens..though doesn't completely explain the 50/50 but is the most "watts"
collection of variables..

The array doesn't just dim individual diodes, it also turns certain diodes (and banks of diodes) on/off with varying colors and intensities.

 

[oreo54]

The array doesn't just dim individual diodes, it also turns certain diodes (and banks of diodes) on/off with varying colors and intensities.

Why would you believe it would be built so ridiculously complicated?
A350 but doubt if it is much different in the 360..except possibly rearranging the 2 rows a bit..
Changing the current between ch1 and 2 is enough to do what they want..

 

[madweazl]

Why would you believe it would be built so ridiculously complicated?
A350 but doubt if it is much different in the 360..except possibly rearranging the 2 rows a bit..
Changing the current between ch1 and 2 is enough to do what they want..

Because I actually tested it.


Pretty sure this is 0% color and just enough intensity to turn on (roughly 10%)

50% color 10% intensity

100% color 10% intensity

0% color 100% intensity

50% color 100% intensity

100% color 100% intensity

 

[oreo54]

Yea, I've seen your photos before..and that is what it "looks" like. And to be honest.. can't quite explain it..
Part might be photo excitation of the phosphors..Seen that before w/ close proximity blue and whites.. The white phosphors are excited to emissions by the blue chips..
They aren't exactly bright but they are "on"..Granted.. a long shot..
Anyways it actually makes little difference to the concept. To keep equal output as you go from one end of the color spectrum to the other some 'chips" dim some brighten..
If you want to go from "actinic" to say 14000k you just add and or increase white..If you don't do that your "color" is all over the board..

I assume the below is 100% 50% 0% "color".

 

[madweazl]

Not a matter of perceived "intensity" in the photos, it's different. Additionally, it flat out turns off diodes depending on the settings (intensity and color).

 

[Dana Riddle]

The 360W E-series at its 'bluest' setting:

 

[oreo54]

The 360W E-series at its 'bluest' setting:

Which is the 2 (3) "blue" wavelengths and the one true UV approx..
390,430,460,470..... guesses according to the Japanese SPECTRA 1.023 blog and of course the 350...

 

[madweazl]

I'd assume 400-410, 410-420, and 420-429.

 

[hart24601]

I like the design of the new 360x quite a bit over the older 360 since there will be removable optics to narrow the beam down for deeper tanks. IMO not enough people use the narrow angle (360NE) kessil. You of course don’t get the coverage, but the PAR near the bottom is so much stronger I feel it’s a solid trade off for deeper tanks but often overlooked.

 

[madweazl]

Somebody with an N model should send one down to @Dana Riddle. I could loan an A360WE to cover the down time if it the N model wasn't essential to the donor tank.

 

[Dana Riddle]

Which is the 2 (3) "blue" wavelengths and the one true UV approx..
390,430,460,470..... guesses according to the Japanese SPECTRA 1.023 blog and of course the 350...

If I understand the question correctly, wavelength peaks are 384, 423, and 464nm.

 

[hart24601]

I wouldn't be surprised if the peaks match Kessil's photredox lights. Makes sense to use the same diodes.

http://www.kessil.com/photoredox/Products.php

They have a 390, 427 and 467.

EDIT: I see Mr. Riddle already replied. The do seem to line up closely.

 

[oreo54]

If I understand the question correctly, wavelength peaks are 384, 423, and 464nm.

Actually it means didly BUT.. they implied actually 3 "blue" one UV
4 bandwidths all together..

as to the photoredox it would also apply....

370nm, 390nm, 427nm, 440nm, 456nm, 467nm

thing is some are in the "blue" channel some the white..

Add cool white to complete...
Point is 5 total separate "bandwidths" assuming calling white ..err.. one..
IF it's the same in the 360 as in the old 350??

 

[hart24601]

Nevermind! Miss post. But I don't think all the diodes in the photoredox series are in the older 360. Not sure about the new or AP700 and if those use the same diodes.