KH/Alk vs calcium usage.

[1979fishgeek]

Im going to be measuring KH/Alk and calcium daily to chart its daily usage over the next few weeks.

What should the ratio drop be? For instance testing in last 24 hours...

Calcium 490 dropped to 420
KH/Alk 13.4/4.79 dropped to 12.1/4.33

The Alk drop looks about right but does that calcium drop seem excessive by comparison?

Thanks

 

[GoVols]

Im going to be measuring KH/Alk and calcium daily to chart its daily usage over the next few weeks.

What should the ratio drop be? For instance testing in last 24 hours...

Calcium 490 dropped to 420
KH/Alk 13.4/4.79 dropped to 12.1/4.33

The Alk drop looks about right but does that calcium drop seem excessive by comparison?

Thanks

I don't know what the ratio is but if you going over the recommended daily dose of a product your your #'s can drop from precipitation.

When I was mapping my reef. It was in-taking about 20ppm of cal and about .6 dkh of alk.

(lol)
Don't know if that's mathematically right but it was, what I was testing to ;Wacky

 

[Alfrareef]

I had a reef with a steady Ca consumption and an upwards KH consumption. The sps were growing like mad taking all the Alk.

 

[1979fishgeek]

I don't know what the ratio is but if you going over the recommended daily dose of a product your your #'s can drop from precipitation.

When I was mapping my reef. It was in-taking about 20ppm of cal and about .6 dkh of alk.

(lol)
Don't know if that's mathematically right but it was, what I was testing to ;Wacky

Thanks, I use a calcium reactor. But I went too high with my Alk and I’m letting it fall off on its own but it’s interesting how quickly it falls.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

The ratio is 18-20 ppm calcium for each 1 meq/L (2.8 dKH) of alkalinity.

The calcium drop is probably mostly testing error.

 

[1979fishgeek]

The ratio is 18-20 ppm calcium for each 1 meq/L (2.8 dKH) of alkalinity.

The calcium drop is probably mostly testing error.

You were right, testing last 48 hours and calcium dropping more than half as fast.
I still don’t now though what’s causing my Monti to bubble up. But I fear I’m about to loose two years of Monti sps. Can’t get the bubbling to stop and it’s only the Monti, no other sps including delicate Acro are effected. Quite literally in tears watching my favourite corals that are the main feature in the tank getting worse.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I'd post in the SPS forum. I don't know enough about montis to know about these bubbles and how normal they are.

 

[1979fishgeek]

I'd post in the SPS forum. I don't know enough about montis to know about these bubbles and how normal they are.

I’ve posted all over the place and on other forums, people are reading but not responding. I’m researching online and finding its happened in other tanks and no one seems to no why.

It’s like the surface of the corals are full of bubbles, skeleton underneath looks a little fuzzy/transparent. Read everything from micro algae infections, to coral cancer, to build up of O2in coral tissue. Im literally staring at my tank wondering if I about to loose the lot. Soul destroying.

Thanks for you help.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I've never seen it before. Might be normal for that particular coral, might be a bacterial infection, could be all sorts of other things.

Sorry I can't help more.

If folks in the SPS forum have not seen it before, and are not posting, it is probably pretty unusual and not likely from nutrient or main parameter issues.

 

[1979fishgeek]

I've never seen it before. Might be normal for that particular coral, might be a bacterial infection, could be all sorts of other things.

Sorry I can't help more.

If folks in the SPS forum have not seen it before, and are not posting, it is probably pretty unusual and not likely from nutrient or main parameter issues.

Thanks Randy.
I’ve noticed the bubbles disappear at night, so I’m reducing my lights as a experiment. I removed some messy Clownfish not long ago and the water clarity is now crystal clear. Wondering if that’s the cause, more light getting to corals and photosynthesis is in overdrive too much o2 being created and not releasing from tissue....it’s just a guess.

 

[Alfrareef]

When you touch the “bubbles” are hard or soft? Can you scratch them off.

 

[1979fishgeek]

When you touch the “bubbles” are hard or soft? Can you scratch them off.

Soft, fluid filled sacks, that bob about in the current. Im avoiding touching them as they easily burst and reveal skeleton underneath.

 

[Alfrareef]

Woh. Never seen something like that. I shall go thru my literature to see if I can find similar case.
On the other side maybe they are teens and it’s acne... ;-)

 

[1979fishgeek]

Woh. Never seen something like that. I shall go thru my literature to see if I can find similar case.
On the other side maybe they are teens and it’s acne... ;-)

Thank you, here’s a update:
UPDATE
Still only effecting Montipora, all are effected to various extents, some are way worse than others.
Photos below, red highlights bubbles. As you can see from the photos underneath nothing else is bubbling.

Monti red cap, tiny bubbles in patches across surface between polyps.


Digi swollen at tips and growing encrusting base. Skeleton looks pitted.




Monti Capitata worse effected whole coral covered so no point highlighting you can see bubbles from space.


Another very badly effected Monti, similar to the Capitata


Monti green cap, least effected but edge is still bubbled.


The rest of the species are uneffected.







Porites


Acro


Various



So whatever this is it’s montipora specific....at the moment.

I’m literally pulling my hair out, so far the Monti are not stripping but I’m scared they can’t survive this.

I’ve been doing daily water changes, to replace trace ellements and dilute anything that could of gotten in that I can’t test for.

Replaced all GFO and Carbon.

Bought new test kits and readings are actually different from my old ones.

Current parameters
Calcium 445
KH/Alk 10.2/3.65
Mag 1260
Phosphate 0.01
Nitrate 2
Ph 8.2
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
SG 1.025

I’m increasing magnesium as the new test salifert kit is now reading my magnesium low instead of high.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

The pics don't show up

I'm certain that magnesium at 1260 ppm is not the cause. That almost exactly matches the ocean at 35 ppt (1280 ppm).

 

[1979fishgeek]

The pics don't show up

I'm certain that magnesium at 1260 ppm is not the cause. That almost exactly matches the ocean at 35 ppt (1280 ppm).

Photo Bucket is useless! Or I am! Lol

I’m just trying everything I can think of, mags not crazy low but was something. Crazy thing was the different readings I got using brand new test kits! Note to self replace every year.

Calcium = old kit 370. New kit 445!!!!
KH/Alk = old kit 10.5/3.76. New kit 10.2/3.65
Mag = Used 13ml solution OMG! New kit 1260

I’ve just removed some kind of Sinularia that been difficult to ID. Its got very large and any chemical warfare it could be producing might be upsetting the Monti. Replaced carbon again as it was huge, because it slimed me. Fingers crossed that’s what it is?

 

[Alfrareef]

Maybe a bacterial infection. It happens all over the tank or at single place?

 

[1979fishgeek]

Maybe a bacterial infection. It happens all over the tank or at single place?

I’ve got to the bottom of it now and everything is returning to normal. The problem was as suggested what Reefers refer to a Sps Bubble Diease. The condition is unusual and while no one knows for sure what causes it, chemistry being out of balance causing stress is the common denominator.

Basically when I mucked about with my calcium reactor increasing the Alk and Calc the Monti being the aggressive growers took advantage and grew like crazy, but the effluent from the reactor caused my pH to drop which then massively stressed them out creating the odd reaction. I believe they were like the canary in the coal mine showing the stress response first because they were reacting so quickly to my changes.

I had been using salifert test kits which were close to best before dates. My readings at first were not alarming but after replacing them all because I felt something was not right found the calcium, magnesium were out by a far amont but most importantly my pH which was actually 7.4, not the 8.2!!

Now it’s corrected everything is returning to normally. Some of the blisters have popped but I am confident they will heal.

Lesson learnt....don’t mess with something that’s not broken (Alk/cal/mag) and replace test kits more regularly!

So Randy Holmes-Farley had it right from the start. Testing error!

A huge gigantic testing error!

 

[Alfrareef]

I’ve got to the bottom of it now and everything is returning to normal. The problem was as suggested what Reefers refer to a Sps Bubble Diease. The condition is unusual and while no one knows for sure what causes it, chemistry being out of balance causing stress is the common denominator.

Basically when I mucked about with my calcium reactor increasing the Alk and Calc the Monti being the aggressive growers took advantage and grew like crazy, but the effluent from the reactor caused my pH to drop which then massively stressed them out creating the odd reaction. I believe they were like the canary in the coal mine showing the stress response first because they were reacting so quickly to my changes.

I had been using salifert test kits which were close to best before dates. My readings at first were not alarming but after replacing them all because I felt something was not right found the calcium, magnesium were out by a far amont but most importantly my pH which was actually 7.4, not the 8.2!!

Now it’s corrected everything is returning to normally. Some of the blisters have popped but I am confident they will heal.

Lesson learnt....don’t mess with something that’s not broken (Alk/cal/mag) and replace test kits more regularly!

So Randy Holmes-Farley had it right from the start. Testing error!

A huge gigantic testing error!

Great you solved it.
Hormonal perturbation causing the pimples. They for sure are teens. ;-)

 

[1979fishgeek]

Great you solved it.
Hormonal perturbation causing the pimples. They for sure are teens. ;-)

Certainly given me the grief of a teenager! Lol