Last Thread About My Stocking Plan...

[NC122606]

I know I know, this is the 3rd post I have made about this... But I swear this should be the last, (Maybe) so here we go. 180 Gallon Reef BTW.

1x Regal Angelfish (Red Sea)
1x Majestic Angelfish (I will probably remove this because of the tangs)
1x Flame Angelfish
1x Achilles Tang
1x Blue Hippo Tang
1x Purple Tang
1x Whitetail Bristoletooth Tang
1x Yellow Tang
1x Powder Blue Tang
1x Leopard Wrasse
1x Melanarus Wrasse
1x Harlequin Tusk
1x Lineatus Wrasse (Maybe)
1x Copperband Butterflyfish
1x Marine Betta
2x Orange Blood Clownfish
1x Green Mandarin
2x Banggai Cardinalfish
1x Zebra Moray Eel
1 - 2x Blue Throat Triggerfish
1x Sunburst Fathead Anthias
1x Starry Blenny
1x Flame Hawkfish
1x Foxface
________
Opinions maybe a bit too much I am thinking about removing 1 Blue Throat Triggerfish, Majestic Angelfish, Melanarus Wrasse and maybe Lineatus Wrasse.
I know a lot of tangs but I think I have an idea with them.

 

[pcon]

You have fish that may eat other fish on the list. And that’s a lot of tang, double so for a copper band to duke it out. Lot of aggression and some sensitive expert fish. Tusks, triggers and eels generally don’t mix nicely with anthias, and dragonets. It might work but seems like asking for trouble.

On a personal note unless you are going for a specific theme or biotope, I don’t find stocking lists to be helpful. Fun intellectual play. But stocking evolves as the system evolves, what’s around you and what your interested in may change.

It might be valuable for you to step back and say what directions can I take with the stocking? Do you want difficult peaceful fish like mandarins, anthias, regal angels and copperband? Do you want aggressive big flashy, triggers, eels, tusk fish? Is your heart set on some big surgeon like an Achilles who will want space and flow? Each of these goals will push the tank in different directions. And one may easily drift towards multiple groups with say tangs and aggressive fish, or with some smaller nicer tangs and sensitive fish. But it might be more valuable instead of lists, to strip down to the 1-4 fish you really want and build a stocking plan around those.

 

[mta_morrow]

You have fish that may eat other fish on the list. And that’s a lot of tang, double so for a copper band to duke it out. Lot of aggression and some sensitive expert fish. Tusks, triggers and eels generally don’t mix nicely with anthias, and dragonets. It might work but seems like asking for trouble.

On a personal note unless you are going for a specific theme or biotope, I don’t find stocking lists to be helpful. Fun intellectual play. But stocking evolves as the system evolves, what’s around you and what your interested in may change.

It might be valuable for you to step back and say what directions can I take with the stocking? Do you want difficult peaceful fish like mandarins, anthias, regal angels and copperband? Do you want aggressive big flashy, triggers, eels, tusk fish? Is your heart set on some big surgeon like an Achilles who will want space and flow? Each of these goals will push the tank in different directions. And one may easily drift towards multiple groups with say tangs and aggressive fish, or with some smaller nicer tangs and sensitive fish. But it might be more valuable instead of lists, to strip down to the 1-4 fish you really want and build a stocking plan around those.

Excellent post! No reason for me to reply!

 

[NC122606]

You have fish that may eat other fish on the list. And that’s a lot of tang, double so for a copper band to duke it out. Lot of aggression and some sensitive expert fish. Tusks, triggers and eels generally don’t mix nicely with anthias, and dragonets. It might work but seems like asking for trouble.

On a personal note unless you are going for a specific theme or biotope, I don’t find stocking lists to be helpful. Fun intellectual play. But stocking evolves as the system evolves, what’s around you and what your interested in may change.

It might be valuable for you to step back and say what directions can I take with the stocking? Do you want difficult peaceful fish like mandarins, anthias, regal angels and copperband? Do you want aggressive big flashy, triggers, eels, tusk fish? Is your heart set on some big surgeon like an Achilles who will want space and flow? Each of these goals will push the tank in different directions. And one may easily drift towards multiple groups with say tangs and aggressive fish, or with some smaller nicer tangs and sensitive fish. But it might be more valuable instead of lists, to strip down to the 1-4 fish you really want and build a stocking plan around those.

Thank you! You have been really helpful as I have seen.
I will definitely rethink it, here are the top 3...
1. Regal Angelfish
2. Achilles Tang
3. Blue Hippo Tang
These are the three that I really had my mind on!

 

[EmdeReef]

I can’t help with wrasses but if you take that out, marine betta and the mandarin I feel like your original list could work. The tangs will duke it out, especially if all added at the same time. Zebra morays are very peaceful and good candidates for a community tank, don’t grow large either...

You’ll need a really good lid though if you plan to keep those triggers. The family isn’t called “ballistic” for nothing, in a busy tank they’ll be jumping out a lot!

 

[NC122606]

Ok so out of my stocking list what should not be kept with a Regal Angelfish?

 

[pcon]

Regal angels are difficult fish. They require quite a lot of work to get healthy and happy. I think they need well established tanks with lots of rock to swim through and graze a variety of sponges, macro and micro algae from. They do better with peaceful small tank mates that they can feel the boss of until they get established. Once established they tend to do pretty well.

Perhaps Laying it out like the following will show a more useful way of evaluating and thinking about stocking and interactions.

If a regal angelfish pair or single, was the goal of my 180 I might edit your stock to go something like this:

Establish tank and cycle:
Group 1: First 6 months
2x Banggai Cardinalfish
1x Flame Hawkfish
1x Foxface
Suggested:
Chromis, gobies, small peaceful blennies, hardy other anthias.

Group 1: Focus around peaceful hardy fish, now is the time to add other blennies as the starry will be intolerant of those added after.

Group 2: 6-10/12 months
1x Sunburst Fathead Anthias
1x Green Mandarin
1x Leopard Wrasse
1x Lineatus Wrasse (Maybe)
You could Add Clowns in group 1 or 2 if percs or ocellaris but maroon, blood orange, tomato complex, ect are too aggressive here.
Suggestions:
Fairy and flasher wrasse, moderate difficulty antias, possum wrasse, sand sifting gobies

Group 2: ratchets up the difficulty ensuring you have pod populations, and care down for the difficult angels, as rock begins to reach maturity. Again keeping aggression minimal we won't want to have any liable aggressors, for the angels to settle in.

Now the rock and tank has had 10-12 months to mature we can start adding the sensitive goal fish.
Group 3:
1-2x Regal Angelfish (Red Sea)
1x Copperband Butterflyfish
Suggestions:
Difficult Anthias, any other peaceful fish

Group 3: Show fish, May be some aggression between these two deep bodied fish, they are both difficult to establish, and need mature, peaceful tanks. After the regals are established for a few months they may become aggressive to newcomers, this period is an excellent opportunity to bring in any more peaceful or questionably peaceful fish.

Group4:
1x Melanarus Wrasse
1x Starry Blenny
Suggestions:
Other Wrasse, peaceful damsels, dragon face pipefish

Group4: These fish won't interfere with the establishment of the regals or copperband but may have given them trouble if added first. or needed extra time for the tank to mature.

Group 5: ~6+ months after Regals,
1x Whitetail Bristletooth Tang
1x Majestic Angelfish
Suggested:
Sensitive dwarf angel pair, other sensitive medium angels, Any Large wrasse like tamarin, Other butterflies

Group 5: starting to introduce potential aggressors, tangs, angels, This is where we become good at using the acclimation box, Identifying and mitigating aggression before the fish are released

Group 6:
1x Purple Tang
1x Yellow Tang
1-2x Flame Angel
Suggested
Any other small tangs, Large angels

Group 6 are the fish that are most likely to cause problems with the desired fish, or fish added after them.

I Left the fish from your list that would be reasonably expected to cohabitate long term in a 180 together, with only a normal dose of reefing luck.

Perhaps this illustrates a more effective approach than shotgunning lists. Set your fixed goals, I want, x, y & z, fish and corals. Determine what the care needs of those fish are. Determine the general slots in the progression of your tank and what types of fish can be added in those times. Often availability and interests fluctuate this provides an architecture for more effectively achieving your core goals, and adapting to changes in the fish market, yourself and your tank.

 

[NC122606]

Regal angels are difficult fish. They require quite a lot of work to get healthy and happy. I think they need well established tanks with lots of rock to swim through and graze a variety of sponges, macro and micro algae from. They do better with peaceful small tank mates that they can feel the boss of until they get established. Once established they tend to do pretty well.

Perhaps Laying it out like the following will show a more useful way of evaluating and thinking about stocking and interactions.

If a regal angelfish pair or single, was the goal of my 180 I might edit your stock to go something like this:

Establish tank and cycle:
Group 1: First 6 months
2x Banggai Cardinalfish
1x Flame Hawkfish
1x Foxface
Suggested:
Chromis, gobies, small peaceful blennies, hardy other anthias.

Group 1: Focus around peaceful hardy fish, now is the time to add other blennies as the starry will be intolerant of those added after.

Group 2: 6-10/12 months
1x Sunburst Fathead Anthias
1x Green Mandarin
1x Leopard Wrasse
1x Lineatus Wrasse (Maybe)
You could Add Clowns in group 1 or 2 if percs or ocellaris but maroon, blood orange, tomato complex, ect are too aggressive here.
Suggestions:
Fairy and flasher wrasse, moderate difficulty antias, possum wrasse, sand sifting gobies

Group 2: ratchets up the difficulty ensuring you have pod populations, and care down for the difficult angels, as rock begins to reach maturity. Again keeping aggression minimal we won't want to have any liable aggressors, for the angels to settle in.

Now the rock and tank has had 10-12 months to mature we can start adding the sensitive goal fish.
Group 3:
1-2x Regal Angelfish (Red Sea)
1x Copperband Butterflyfish
Suggestions:
Difficult Anthias, any other peaceful fish

Group 3: Show fish, May be some aggression between these two deep bodied fish, they are both difficult to establish, and need mature, peaceful tanks. After the regals are established for a few months they may become aggressive to newcomers, this period is an excellent opportunity to bring in any more peaceful or questionably peaceful fish.

Group4:
1x Melanarus Wrasse
1x Starry Blenny
Suggestions:
Other Wrasse, peaceful damsels, dragon face pipefish

Group4: These fish won't interfere with the establishment of the regals or copperband but may have given them trouble if added first. or needed extra time for the tank to mature.

Group 5: ~6+ months after Regals,
1x Whitetail Bristletooth Tang
1x Majestic Angelfish
Suggested:
Sensitive dwarf angel pair, other sensitive medium angels, Any Large wrasse like tamarin, Other butterflies

Group 5: starting to introduce potential aggressors, tangs, angels, This is where we become good at using the acclimation box, Identifying and mitigating aggression before the fish are released

Group 6:
1x Purple Tang
1x Yellow Tang
1-2x Flame Angel
Suggested
Any other small tangs, Large angels

Group 6 are the fish that are most likely to cause problems with the desired fish, or fish added after them.

I Left the fish from your list that would be reasonably expected to cohabitate long term in a 180 together, with only a normal dose of reefing luck.

Perhaps this illustrates a more effective approach than shotgunning lists. Set your fixed goals, I want, x, y & z, fish and corals. Determine what the care needs of those fish are. Determine the general slots in the progression of your tank and what types of fish can be added in those times. Often availability and interests fluctuate this provides an architecture for more effectively achieving your core goals, and adapting to changes in the fish market, yourself and your tank.

Wow! I cannot thank you enough for this! I will definitely use this info and come back here with any questions are an outcome! Just thank you!

 

[Peach02]

I know I know, this is the 3rd post I have made about this... But I swear this should be the last, (Maybe) so here we go. 180 Gallon Reef BTW.

1x Regal Angelfish (Red Sea)
1x Majestic Angelfish (I will probably remove this because of the tangs)
1x Flame Angelfish
1x Achilles Tang
1x Blue Hippo Tang
1x Purple Tang
1x Whitetail Bristoletooth Tang
1x Yellow Tang
1x Powder Blue Tang
1x Leopard Wrasse
1x Melanarus Wrasse
1x Harlequin Tusk
1x Lineatus Wrasse (Maybe)
1x Copperband Butterflyfish
1x Marine Betta
2x Orange Blood Clownfish
1x Green Mandarin
2x Banggai Cardinalfish
1x Zebra Moray Eel
1 - 2x Blue Throat Triggerfish
1x Sunburst Fathead Anthias
1x Starry Blenny
1x Flame Hawkfish
1x Foxface
________
Opinions maybe a bit too much I am thinking about removing 1 Blue Throat Triggerfish, Majestic Angelfish, Melanarus Wrasse and maybe Lineatus Wrasse.
I know a lot of tangs but I think I have an idea with them.

achilles tangs can go on bad food strikes
tusks can get very aggressive
tangs may fight
the moray eel will likely kill of the cardinals, anthias, blennies, hawkfish, wrasse, flame angel, mandarin, betta,

So if I was you I would remove the achilles, eel and tusk

 

[NC122606]

achilles tangs can go on bad food strikes
tusks can get very aggressive
tangs may fight
the moray eel will likely kill of the cardinals, anthias, blennies, hawkfish, wrasse, flame angel, mandarin, betta,

So if I was you I would remove the achilles, eel and tusk

I am only going to say things for these 2 fish. I have done some good research surrounding the fish I have selected.
Moray Eel: Unlike most Moray Eels these have rounded teeth which are used for crushing crustaceans. They are one of the most reef safe eels out there and the only way they do are not reef safe is with some crustaceans, (Unlikely) Some Inverts, and it may knock some Corals over.
Tusk: I know some people say they are all aggressive and that but they can be harassed easily by the more aggressive species like Larger Angels (Emperor, Queen, and those kinds), Tangs, Larger Wrasses, Triggers, and Etc. If I did go for it it would probably be good to add before the Tangs.
This is what I part of what I have researched so far.

 

[ReefRy]

Incredibly well said, pcon. Ive reread that post twice!

 

[NC122606]

Incredibly well said, pcon. Ive reread that post twice!

I agree!

 

[NC122606]

Also, if anyone wants to take a look here is my Researching Thread https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/researching-fish.639832/page-2 Most of the fish here are accounted for except the Anthias.

 

[Peach02]

I am only going to say things for these 2 fish. I have done some good research surrounding the fish I have selected.
Moray Eel: Unlike most Moray Eels these have rounded teeth which are used for crushing crustaceans. They are one of the most reef safe eels out there and the only way they do are not reef safe is with some crustaceans, (Unlikely) Some Inverts, and it may knock some Corals over.
Tusk: I know some people say they are all aggressive and that but they can be harassed easily by the more aggressive species like Larger Angels (Emperor, Queen, and those kinds), Tangs, Larger Wrasses, Triggers, and Etc. If I did go for it it would probably be good to add before the Tangs.
This is what I part of what I have researched so far.

true with the tusk but it will still go after the fish that can't pick on it e.g. the chromis

 

[pcon]

Wow! I cannot thank you enough for this! I will definitely use this info and come back here with any questions are an outcome! Just thank you!

Incredibly well said, pcon. Ive reread that post twice!

Thanks, I’m glad it made sense! My words can wander a bit.

 

[NC122606]

Update:
I might skip these fish, reasons below.
Whitetail Bristoletooth Tang
- I don’t really think this fish is all worth $200 maybe I’ll add it in the future if price decreases.
Reason: Overpriced
Majestic Angelfish
- I would really just like to focus on one larger Angelfish and the corals, if I have 2 of them eating corals then I am in trouble. Also not sure of aggression...
Reason: Regal Angelfish
Lineatus Wrasse
A bit over priced for a wrasses and I’m not really a fan of fairy wrasses or flashers. Also not sure of how it would compete with others.
Reason: Overpriced, Not a fan of Reef Fair / Flasher Wrasse, and competition.
(Maybe)
Sunburst Fathead Anthias
I feel like these are a bit overpriced for one fish that isn’t one of my favorites, I can easily pick squareback anthias instead which can give me the same colors.
Reason: Overpriced
Edit: I don’t mean Overpriced for me but for the fish.

 

[mattzang]

I am only going to say things for these 2 fish. I have done some good research surrounding the fish I have selected.
Moray Eel: Unlike most Moray Eels these have rounded teeth which are used for crushing crustaceans. They are one of the most reef safe eels out there and the only way they do are not reef safe is with some crustaceans, (Unlikely) Some Inverts, and it may knock some Corals over.
Tusk: I know some people say they are all aggressive and that but they can be harassed easily by the more aggressive species like Larger Angels (Emperor, Queen, and those kinds), Tangs, Larger Wrasses, Triggers, and Etc. If I did go for it it would probably be good to add before the Tangs.
This is what I part of what I have researched so far.

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/harlequin-tusk-in-a-mixed-reef.561112/page-2

seems like some tusks are good characters, but they can be quite bad too..

 

[DrunkenKraken]

Regal angels are difficult fish. They require quite a lot of work to get healthy and happy. I think they need well established tanks with lots of rock to swim through and graze a variety of sponges, macro and micro algae from. They do better with peaceful small tank mates that they can feel the boss of until they get established. Once established they tend to do pretty well.

Perhaps Laying it out like the following will show a more useful way of evaluating and thinking about stocking and interactions.

If a regal angelfish pair or single, was the goal of my 180 I might edit your stock to go something like this:

Establish tank and cycle:
Group 1: First 6 months
2x Banggai Cardinalfish
1x Flame Hawkfish
1x Foxface
Suggested:
Chromis, gobies, small peaceful blennies, hardy other anthias.

Group 1: Focus around peaceful hardy fish, now is the time to add other blennies as the starry will be intolerant of those added after.

Group 2: 6-10/12 months
1x Sunburst Fathead Anthias
1x Green Mandarin
1x Leopard Wrasse
1x Lineatus Wrasse (Maybe)
You could Add Clowns in group 1 or 2 if percs or ocellaris but maroon, blood orange, tomato complex, ect are too aggressive here.
Suggestions:
Fairy and flasher wrasse, moderate difficulty antias, possum wrasse, sand sifting gobies

Group 2: ratchets up the difficulty ensuring you have pod populations, and care down for the difficult angels, as rock begins to reach maturity. Again keeping aggression minimal we won't want to have any liable aggressors, for the angels to settle in.

Now the rock and tank has had 10-12 months to mature we can start adding the sensitive goal fish.
Group 3:
1-2x Regal Angelfish (Red Sea)
1x Copperband Butterflyfish
Suggestions:
Difficult Anthias, any other peaceful fish

Group 3: Show fish, May be some aggression between these two deep bodied fish, they are both difficult to establish, and need mature, peaceful tanks. After the regals are established for a few months they may become aggressive to newcomers, this period is an excellent opportunity to bring in any more peaceful or questionably peaceful fish.

Group4:
1x Melanarus Wrasse
1x Starry Blenny
Suggestions:
Other Wrasse, peaceful damsels, dragon face pipefish

Group4: These fish won't interfere with the establishment of the regals or copperband but may have given them trouble if added first. or needed extra time for the tank to mature.

Group 5: ~6+ months after Regals,
1x Whitetail Bristletooth Tang
1x Majestic Angelfish
Suggested:
Sensitive dwarf angel pair, other sensitive medium angels, Any Large wrasse like tamarin, Other butterflies

Group 5: starting to introduce potential aggressors, tangs, angels, This is where we become good at using the acclimation box, Identifying and mitigating aggression before the fish are released

Group 6:
1x Purple Tang
1x Yellow Tang
1-2x Flame Angel
Suggested
Any other small tangs, Large angels

Group 6 are the fish that are most likely to cause problems with the desired fish, or fish added after them.

I Left the fish from your list that would be reasonably expected to cohabitate long term in a 180 together, with only a normal dose of reefing luck.

Perhaps this illustrates a more effective approach than shotgunning lists. Set your fixed goals, I want, x, y & z, fish and corals. Determine what the care needs of those fish are. Determine the general slots in the progression of your tank and what types of fish can be added in those times. Often availability and interests fluctuate this provides an architecture for more effectively achieving your core goals, and adapting to changes in the fish market, yourself and your tank.

Reviving this old thread just to say thanks. This is some great insight and well thought out. Looking at a similar stocking list and this is quite helpful.

 

[i cant think]

I know I know, this is the 3rd post I have made about this... But I swear this should be the last, (Maybe) so here we go. 180 Gallon Reef BTW.

1x Regal Angelfish (Red Sea)
1x Majestic Angelfish (I will probably remove this because of the tangs)
1x Flame Angelfish
1x Achilles Tang
1x Blue Hippo Tang
1x Purple Tang
1x Whitetail Bristoletooth Tang
1x Yellow Tang
1x Powder Blue Tang
1x Leopard Wrasse
1x Melanarus Wrasse
1x Harlequin Tusk
1x Lineatus Wrasse (Maybe)
1x Copperband Butterflyfish
1x Marine Betta
2x Orange Blood Clownfish
1x Green Mandarin
2x Banggai Cardinalfish
1x Zebra Moray Eel
1 - 2x Blue Throat Triggerfish
1x Sunburst Fathead Anthias
1x Starry Blenny
1x Flame Hawkfish
1x Foxface
________
Opinions maybe a bit too much I am thinking about removing 1 Blue Throat Triggerfish, Majestic Angelfish, Melanarus Wrasse and maybe Lineatus Wrasse.
I know a lot of tangs but I think I have an idea with them.

Forget a lot of tang, that’s a lot of fish.

1: Achilles and Powder Brown will murder eachother. They’re part of the same complex “The Powder Tangs”.
2: The eel will most likely eat fish below 4-5 inch long at max size. I highly recommend against it.
3: The Blue Hippo Tang ideally needs an 8 foot tank. Let’s not forget this fish can hit 1 foot long, and swims a ton not just in the wild but in captivity too.
4: The Purple and Yellow will most likely eventually turn on eachother. They will also stress out a CBB indirectly. If the rang gang fight it can affect fish around them and not just themselves.
5: Leopard and Melanurus are just fine with eachother. However, the tusk will most likely kill the leopard. They’re big, boisterous and nasty when adults.
6: The flame hawk, starry blenny, green mandarin, bangaii cardinals will all be feasts for the much more aggressive fish.

So, I’d recommend either avoiding:
- Achilles and/or PBT
- either a YT, PT or CBB
- Either all other wrasse or the Harley Quinn tusk
- all of the FH, BC, GM, SB or the eel



Also just saw this is an older thread so this post may be pointless but oh well.