Leftover Trident reagent

[Gtinnel]

I'm relatively new to using a trident and when I change reagents I have been throwing away the leftover reagent that is in the bottles. I'd guess there is probably 10% left each time. I had another thread yesterday where another user said that they just dump the leftover into the new bottle. I know that the directions to say throw it away but I'm wanting to know how many people add it to the new bottle? For those that do, have you seen any negative results from doing it that way?
I don't want to possibly effect my results to save what is basically $4 every 2 months, but I also don't want to just throw it away if not necessary.

 

[PeterC99]

Great question - I have been throwing away the last remnants of each container - follow the directions. But is this really necessary?

On thing I do notice is that the Trident readings start to drop when I get to the very end of the reagents.

 

[Gtinnel]

On thing I do notice is that the Trident readings start to drop when I get to the very end of the reagents.

I've heard others say this as well but I haven't noticed it with my trident.

 

[MERKEY]

There's a member here who makes "cones" for the reagent bottles that gets you more life out of the bottle....it's not a ton more but every drop helps. I think some were getting an average of 10 extra tests. I get around that amount extra as well.

If you do add the old reagent back which trident suggests not to, I would only add left over reagent to same batch numbers.

That way they are using the same calibrating juice.

Unfortunately reagent A is the only one that is able to be used like this.

I have never used left over B or C reagent.

When I used the left over A reagent into the same batch number A reagent I noticed no difference in testing. I just got a few more tests.

I test alk quite often so this is helpful. I never run out of B and C before a is out.

 

[MnFish1]

I'm relatively new to using a trident and when I change reagents I have been throwing away the leftover reagent that is in the bottles. I'd guess there is probably 10% left each time. I had another thread yesterday where another user said that they just dump the leftover into the new bottle. I know that the directions to say throw it away but I'm wanting to know how many people add it to the new bottle? For those that do, have you seen any negative results from doing it that way?
I don't want to possibly effect my results to save what is basically $4 every 2 months, but I also don't want to just throw it away if not necessary.

Though it makes sense to try to save it, I would toss it. 1) its what the directions say and 2) chemicals have expiration dates. The reason you have 'extra' is because you're not using as much as you could be so essentially by saving it - you would be using the chemical more than recommended by the company.

Now - of course - its also possible that they want you to toss it - because you will buy more, but I believe there is extra added to each bottle in case people use more than others within the set time.

 

[Gtinnel]

There's a member here who makes "cones" for the reagent bottles that gets you more life out of the bottle....it's not a ton more but every drop helps. I think some were getting an average of 10 extra tests. I get around that amount extra as well.

If you do add the old reagent back which trident suggests not to, I would only add left over reagent to same batch numbers.

That way they are using the same calibrating juice.

Unfortunately reagent A is the only one that is able to be used like this.

I have never used left over B or C reagent.

When I used the left over A reagent into the same batch number A reagent I noticed no difference in testing. I just got a few more tests.

I test alk quite often so this is helpful. I never run out of B and C before a is out.

Ironically it's the cone needle guides that my thread yesterday was about. It doesn't seem to effect the trident getting more reagent out of the bottle IME.

I replaced my reagent bottles 2 days ago and I have stopped using their calibration solution. I now just test my tanks water multiple times with other trusted test kits and calibrate my trident to my tanks water. When I test the calibration solution with 3 seperate tests from different brands and get the same result (within reason) and it doesn't match the bottle, I'm done trusting the values printed on the bottle. Besides as we all know stability is more important than the actual values anyway.

I never paid attention to batch numbers, if you buy the 3 pack do they all have the same batch number? You'd assume those reagents likely were made at the same time.

 

[MERKEY]

Ironically it's the cone needle guides that my thread yesterday was about. It doesn't seem to effect the trident getting more reagent out of the bottle IME.

I replaced my reagent bottles 2 days ago and I have stopped using their calibration solution. I now just test my tanks water multiple times with other trusted test kits and calibrate my trident to my tanks water. When I test the calibration solution with 3 seperate tests from different brands and get the same result (within reason) and it doesn't match the bottle, I'm done trusting the values printed on the bottle. Besides as we all know stability is more important than the actual values anyway.

I never paid attention to batch numbers, if you buy the 3 pack do they all have the same batch number? You'd assume those reagents likely were made at the same time.

No they do not have the same calibration fluid.

Each 2 month pack has its own.

I understand what your saying about stability over value....and if that is truly what you believe than just dump what ever left over reagent you want into the new bottles.

You are not using their calibration fluid so it doesn't mater if you mix reagents.

According to your logic as long as your tests stay stable it doesn't matter what test kit your using.

So technically it should not matter if you use left over reagent or not.

As long as your number stays stable.

And the only way to find that out is to become the scientist and preform tests with old reagent fluid mixed with new and match those results with your results from just a fresh bottle.

If you see a huge difference than you have your answer.

Your answer could be as simple as...

Old reagent mixed with new reagent gives mixed readings and unreliable results.

When using only new reagent results are reliable and consistent.

Obviously apex says don't do it so I'm guessing they belive it can affect testing results.

 

[Nburg's Reef]

I just toss it. It costs about $17 per month (if it last the 2 months it says per pack) so I just toss it to avoid the headache of messing things up if I forget to check it. whats another couple bucks saved when this hobby is already so expensive, lol.

 

[Gtinnel]

I understand what your saying about stability over value....and if that is truly what you believe than just dump what ever left over reagent you want into the new bottles

I don't necessarily have a belief either way. I was just curious if others keep the leftover reagent. So far I have been throwing it away per the instructions and the comment yesterday made me question how many people go against the rules and keep it. It ultimately is only a few dollars worth of reagent that gets thrown away every 2 months, so if I suspect that it will effect the consistency of my tests I will continue to follow directions.

Obviously apex says don't do it so I'm guessing they belive it can affect testing results.

Neptune's directions likely are to keep test results as reliable as possible, but since it causes you to buy reagent packs more often I can't just ignore that fact that the directions directly cause everyone to spend more money with them, although admittedly it's not a lot of money per person.

 

[Gtinnel]

I just toss it. It costs about $17 per month (if it last the 2 months it says per pack) so I just toss it to avoid the headache of messing things up if I forget to check it. whats another couple bucks saved when this hobby is already so expensive, lol.

I agree that the cost of the wasted reagent is insignificant, and since this thread didn't get a response from everyone that they keep it, I probably will continue to follow directions.

 

[MnFish1]

Ironically it's the cone needle guides that my thread yesterday was about. It doesn't seem to effect the trident getting more reagent out of the bottle IME.

I replaced my reagent bottles 2 days ago and I have stopped using their calibration solution. I now just test my tanks water multiple times with other trusted test kits and calibrate my trident to my tanks water. When I test the calibration solution with 3 seperate tests from different brands and get the same result (within reason) and it doesn't match the bottle, I'm done trusting the values printed on the bottle. Besides as we all know stability is more important than the actual values anyway.

I never paid attention to batch numbers, if you buy the 3 pack do they all have the same batch number? You'd assume those reagents likely were made at the same time.

1. It says (my understanding that the 3 pack has the same batch numbers)
2. Trident actually has instructions on how to do this calibration with tank water and tests - I'm sure you've seen this but just in case others have not: "
While not recommended, yes, that is possible.

If you believe your test kit numbers to be closer to the actual parameters of your water than what the Trident is reporting, then it is possible to use your tank water as your calibration standard instead of the calibration standard sold by Neptune Systems.

To do this, simply follow the calibration procedure and instead of the calibration standard use your water and use the values you believe your water to be.

We will say that a great amount of effort has been put into making the Trident both accurate and precise. While we understand the faith you might have in your test kit, careful consideration should be made before dismissing an appropriately calibrated Trident measurement."

3. To the OP: The official Neptune answer: "Mixing old, left-over reagents that are left in the empty bottle with a new, fresh bottle will cause the reagents in the new bottle to become contaminated. Neptune Systems packages all the reagents in a 2-month supply so they all come from the same manufacturing batch. Mixing batches can affect the accuracy and precision of your Trident measurements."

My guess is the reason that people don't have problems not following the 'official' rules - is that as you said - the stability is the most important part - and IMHO - its nice to have the 'data' - but there is no difference to the tank with an alkalinity of 8.3 or 8.7. The problem would be (I guess) - if for some reason the way you were testing/calibrating made the actual alkalinity rise/fall consistently over months such that your trident is reading 8 but your actual alkalinity has climbed to 10.

 

[((FORDTECH))]

Ironically it's the cone needle guides that my thread yesterday was about. It doesn't seem to effect the trident getting more reagent out of the bottle IME.

I replaced my reagent bottles 2 days ago and I have stopped using their calibration solution. I now just test my tanks water multiple times with other trusted test kits and calibrate my trident to my tanks water. When I test the calibration solution with 3 seperate tests from different brands and get the same result (within reason) and it doesn't match the bottle, I'm done trusting the values printed on the bottle. Besides as we all know stability is more important than the actual values anyway.

I never paid attention to batch numbers, if you buy the 3 pack do they all have the same batch number? You'd assume those reagents likely were made at the same time.

Even when using the cones you still need to cut side off of a old regent bottle and use it as a looking glass to adjust the needle to get closest to bottom of bottle as you can without touching it. This will ensure you use all regents from bottles.obviously you do this for all 3 needles. I keep this cut open regent bottle for future checked in depth of needles every few months.

 

[Gtinnel]

Even when using the cones you still need to cut side off of a old regent bottle and use it as a looking glass to adjust the needle to get closest to bottom of bottle as you can without touching it. This will ensure you use all regents from bottles.obviously you do this for all 3 needles. I keep this cut open regent bottle for future checked in depth of needles every few months.

That is the first I had heard that.

I'm still not exactly sure how the trident knows how much reagent it has left? If it just knows how much is in the full bottle and then meters how much it has used, how will having the needle closer to the bottom make a difference on it using more of the reagent? I doubt it has the ability to determine when it starts pulling in a small out of air, and that is the only way I can think of that having the needle near the bottom of the bottle will help.

ETA- I just realized it could be checking for a test that requires significantly more reagent which could indicate that it is pulling in air and that's how it knows the bottle is empty. Maybe the answer to this whole thread for me isn't to consider saving the reagent but just adjust the needles to where they use nearly all of the reagent. I honestly wasn't even aware that the needles could be adjusted to where they are lower in the bottle.

 

[((FORDTECH))]

That is the first I had heard that.

I'm still not exactly sure how the trident knows how much reagent it has left? If it just knows how much is in the full bottle and then meters how much it has used, how will having the needle closer to the bottom make a difference on it using more of the reagent? I doubt it has the ability to determine when it starts pulling in a small out of air, and that is the only way I can think of that having the needle near the bottom of the bottle will help.

ETA- I just realized it could be checking for a test that requires significantly more reagent which could indicate that it is pulling in air and that's how it knows the bottle is empty. Maybe the answer to this whole thread for me isn't to consider saving the reagent but just adjust the needles to where they use nearly all of the reagent. I honestly wasn't even aware that the needles could be adjusted to where they are lower in the bottle.

Yes they can be adjusted it’s just a metal tube inside of a rubber hose and if it does need adjustment it will be very little. I believe Trident only knows the regents going low from how many tests it does on the bottle and knowing how much fluid should be in there I have reset the values of B and c and use them for a few more days before when Trident said they were empty there is usually a little bit left at the bottom. And if your needle is not to the bottom you will pick up air air