Lfs mistakes

dirty_south87 · Feb 21, 2023

Have you ever bought any livestock from a lfs only for it to die over night? All parameters are where they are suppose to be and everything is happy. I ask that because of a starfish I had bought to die over night from a worker not handling it properly, I found out that those starfish shouldn’t be exposed to air without their own movement. There is also the possibility of actually touching the starfish that could kill one from the oils in your hand. The worker that packaged my starfish had lifted the starfish out of the water with his hand. At first the manager didn’t want to replace the starfish or give store credit because they thought it was my water being out of parameters. Luckily I did decide to take a sample the day I bought the star fish to double check against my home test and everything was right. What are your thoughts or experiences on this?

42Freeman · Feb 21, 2023

I have had it happen once and switched to another LFS and have had no issues since

Rick's Reviews · Feb 21, 2023

I had one delivered (star fish) it had stringy fingers like disintegrated, I asked here and all all agreed on not introduced in my aquarium
Avoid bad stock

YOYOYOReefer · Feb 21, 2023

i would have not bought it after they lifted,, same thing if your are buying sponges that need to stay submerged.

my lfs is awesome, but its rare these days.

dirty_south87 · Feb 21, 2023

42Freeman said:
I have had it happen once and switched to another LFS and have had no issues since

This is the first time this store has done something like this. They are also my second choice because my first one started to become more of a “if you ain’t buying what I’m throwing at you then leave” type place. This one worker at my lfs has only helped me this one time, I think he deals in more of freshwater than salt tho (not really sure tho)

dirty_south87 · Feb 21, 2023

Rick's Reviews said:
I had one delivered (star fish) it had stringy fingers like disintegrated, I asked here and all all agreed on not introduced in my aquarium
Avoid bad stock

Oh I completely agree with this 100% I usually keep an eye on the tanks when I go to my lfs to see if I find any bad before buying. This store has both fresh and salt and the workers generally are not well informed of both at the same time

dirty_south87 · Feb 21, 2023

YOYOYOReefer said:
i would have not bought it after they lifted,, same thing if your are buying sponges that need to stay submerged.

my lfs is awesome, but its rare these days.

Unfortunately I was not in the area when it had happened, I stepped away to grab some more materials and my wife was watching the whole time. Unfortunately she doesn’t know that much about handling of any livestock. She like to point and ask if it will go in our tank

Baldguy · Feb 22, 2023

True or False: If a starfish is exposed to air it will die

www.reef2reef.com

one of those myths that got started. I handle stars all the time out of the water. Many pull the star out, cut off a leg for the harlequin shrimp and put the remaining star back in the water. No problem.

bushdoc · Feb 22, 2023

My approach is to visit LFS now and then and watch and ask questions. So far I found that nobody in my area is treating fish with medications ( other than Malachite green), one LFS has got a system where all tanks are connected, so all fish would get infected, but other 2 stores have separate tanks for different group of fish. One only sells frags. Two stores have more Aiptasia then real corals, so I try not to buy from there, but then I got Aptasia from "reputable": online dealer, luckily kept frag in my frag tank and discover stuff there.
It's a a low margin business and very few stores take proper care of life creatures there, they are centered more on maximizing profits.

AydenLincoln · Feb 22, 2023

This is actually completely false/a myth. Starfish can in fact be exposed to air and handled for brief periods outside of water. Think about in the ocean when tides go in and out some stars are exposed for hours/days at a time and can be seen sticking one arm out of the water. Mine does and I have held mine before although under water. What kind of starfish was it? Was it a linckia which are super sensitive? How long did you acclimate it for? What was the difference in salinity? Starfish should be slowly drip acclimated over about an hour as they don’t handle changes well and simply moving it from the lfs to your tank can be stressful on them and cause them to go into shock/die if not acclimated properly. I would say acclimation shock and a difference in parameters/salinity are to blame especially in the first few days most people have them especially species like linckia. Once livestock leaves a store I’m sorry to say if it dies it is not on the owner of the store regardless of why it happened. It’s a liability we as fish keepers come to accept.

Matty Ice · Feb 22, 2023

Yea. I try not to buy anything expensive from my LFS. I know they have a zero return policy so it's always a gamble and I'm not much of a gambler.

dirty_south87 · Feb 22, 2023

Baldguy said:
True or False: If a starfish is exposed to air it will die

True or False: If a starfish is exposed to air it will die

www.reef2reef.com

one of those myths that got started. I handle stars all the time out of the water. Many pull the star out, cut off a leg for the harlequin shrimp and put the remaining star back in the water. No problem.

I’m not very knowledgeable on it all, that being said I do try to research things as I go. I did find some articles on this specific starfish that being exposed to air stresses them out more and bare handed handling may cause issues such as death. I’ve had a couple other starfish that being out of the water for a few seconds did not bother them or much less handling them bare handed.

dirty_south87 · Feb 22, 2023

bushdoc said:
My approach is to visit LFS now and then and watch and ask questions. So far I found that nobody in my area is treating fish with medications ( other than Malachite green), one LFS has got a system where all tanks are connected, so all fish would get infected, but other 2 stores have separate tanks for different group of fish. One only sells frags. Two stores have more Aiptasia then real corals, so I try not to buy from there, but then I got Aptasia from "reputable": online dealer, luckily kept frag in my frag tank and discover stuff there.
It's a a low margin business and very few stores take proper care of life creatures there, they are centered more on maximizing profits.

A lot of them has become more like a corporate chain. Do less and sell more, no care to the system between how they are connected. Luckily my lfs (despite the starfish incident with one worker) they do take good care of their fishes and corals. I do believe that they do have a set of tanks connected but not the whole store. I have noticed that If one tank is quarantine then that whole section is and they will not sell no matter how experienced you are or how much money you try to drop. While they do have smaller tanks that have aptasia they leave them there on purpose to show how to get rid of them.

dirty_south87 · Feb 22, 2023

AydenLincoln said:
This is actually completely false/a myth. Starfish can in fact be exposed to air and handled for brief periods outside of water. Think about in the ocean when tides go in and out some stars are exposed for hours/days at a time and can be seen sticking one arm out of the water. Mine does and I have held mine before although under water. What kind of starfish was it? Was it a linckia which are super sensitive? How long did you acclimate it for? What was the difference in salinity? Starfish should be slowly drip acclimated over about an hour as they don’t handle changes well and simply moving it from the lfs to your tank can be stressful on them and cause them to go into shock/die if not acclimated properly. I would say acclimation shock and a difference in parameters/salinity are to blame especially in the first few days most people have them especially species like linckia. Once livestock leaves a store I’m sorry to say if it dies it is not on the owner of the store regardless of why it happened. It’s a liability we as fish keepers come to accept.

It was a linckia, it dripped for roughly 4 hours. The salinity was the same from the store compared to my tank. I half way agree with you to the owner of the store not being held reliable but when it comes down to you doing everything right and the parameters are good I feel like that would fall back to the store. Now I have had a couple other fishes to die within the first week or so and just accept it. This is the first time I actually went back to the store over something like this. After the owner seen in the system that they tested my water and it was good he apologized and did replace it. That don’t change how I feel about this location but just how I feel that the workers should be more aware of how to handle the sensitive livestock

dirty_south87 · Feb 22, 2023

Matty Ice said:
Yea. I try not to buy anything expensive from my LFS. I know they have a zero return policy so it's always a gamble and I'm not much of a gambler.

My lfs kinda has the same policy. If they test your water and it comes back good and after a few questions they tend to replace or give store credit. Now that’s only to low cost fishes and some invertebrates. Corals they will not because a lot of the customers did not dip them or kept them away from non reef safe livestock.

Matty Ice · Feb 23, 2023

4 hours seems long to me but I'm still fairly new to the hobby. How's the replacement doing? Pictures!

doubleshot00 · Feb 23, 2023

I've had several fish kick it over night or a day later. Happy as heck at the LFS eat and all. Then you get it home and they are a diferent fish. IDK how LFS stay in business with this practice or others just have better luck.

I only buy QT'ed fish only now. The extra cost of shipping is worth it. They come in happy and ready to eat every time. To top it off my lfs charges the same as QT'ed fish prices. I have no quarrels towards the LFS but I don't buy fish from them or any other LFS now because of it.

dirty_south87 · Feb 23, 2023

Matty Ice said:
4 hours seems long to me but I'm still fairly new to the hobby. How's the replacement doing? Pictures!

I had thought so myself but between the lfs and some research online I found it was better for a long slow drip for them. I will get some pictures hopefully this afternoon. It has been hiding behind some rocks lol

dirty_south87 · Feb 23, 2023

doubleshot00 said:
I've had several fish kick it over night or a day later. Happy as heck at the LFS eat and all. Then you get it home and they are a diferent fish. IDK how LFS stay in business with this practice or others just have better luck.

I only buy QT'ed fish only now. The extra cost of shipping is worth it. They come in happy and ready to eat every time. To top it off my lfs charges the same as QT'ed fish prices. I have no quarrels towards the LFS but I don't buy fish from them or any other LFS now because of it.

The starfish is the only one I’ve had issues with at this current lfs all the others has been a gamble. I have been looking into buying qt’ed fishes as well