Lost two damsels today

vessxpress1 · Apr 3, 2020

Hey guys. I've been out of the hobby for 10 years. I kept a reef for 4 years before that so I'm fairly aware of what I'm doing. I had an online order of fish come in from a well known vendor this week. They were packed in the afternoon the day before and arrived at 9:30 a.m. at my house. One fish a gramma was DOA. It was very small. The others were two 1" Azure damsels, not tank raised. They were drip acclimated and added to a 10 gal QT tank that had a fishless cycle. They ate live brine shrimp when the day they arrived. Then sort of lost interest in eating in the following days. Their color was great. I sensed something was wrong with them last night. So I started mixing up 4 gal for a water change. Came home from work today on Friday and they're both dead. I dosed a half a teaspoon of Prozipro two days ago.

The water params when I took them out were:
0.4 ammonia
8.05 pH
1.023 SG

Would this be enough ammonia to kill them? I tested it yesterday and believe it was closer to 0.2 ppm. So this really sucks. I'm not sure what I should do now. Re-order to use my credit or get something from a more local LFS (all of which an hour away.)

The tank raised stuff must be in high demand because it seems like they're always unavailable. I think the wild caught go through too much stress in too short of a period if I had to guess. These were the smallest damsels I've ever had.

Deinonych · Apr 3, 2020

Really hard to say what killed them. That said, I prefer to match QT salinity to that of the transport bag, rather than drip acclimating. Drip acclimation can be problematic, as ammonia toxicity increases as soon as you open the bag. By matching the salinity, you can simply temperature acclimate, and transfer the livestock to the QT. Most online vendors use a salinity around 1.018 SG +/- 0.001.

george51349 · Apr 3, 2020

How long could they have been floating in the tank dead? The ammonia spike could have killed them, but it also could have been a result of them dying.

george51349 · Apr 3, 2020

I just found a good article with a chart which can help determine the toxicity of ammonia considering pH:
https://pethelpful.com/fish-aquariums/The-Truth-About-Ammonia

vessxpress1 · Apr 4, 2020

If I try this again, assuming it may have been a fast moving bacterial infection, should I go straight to the cupromine as soon as they arrive? I was trying to go with the less harsh stuff initially but I didn't have enough time to use the meds I wanted to. Its interesting that they both died at the same time though. The water is 78 degrees and there's a bubble wall on the back and a hang on filter for surface agitation. They were 1" each so not a lot for a 10 gal to handle. Ammonia was present but at about 0.2 ppm. pH was low so this shouldn't have had much impact in 4 days.

Deinonych · Apr 5, 2020

vessxpress1 said:
If I try this again, assuming it may have been a fast moving bacterial infection, should I go straight to the cupromine as soon as they arrive? I was trying to go with the less harsh stuff initially but I didn't have enough time to use the meds I wanted to. Its interesting that they both died at the same time though. The water is 78 degrees and there's a bubble wall on the back and a hang on filter for surface agitation. They were 1" each so not a lot for a 10 gal to handle. Ammonia was present but at about 0.2 ppm. pH was low so this shouldn't have had much impact in 4 days.

Personally, I don't medicate unless it is necessary. I like to let the fish settle in to a routine for a week or two before any prophylactic treatments (I use TTM and praziquantel for all new acquisitions). If there is an active infection present, then I would proceed as necessary. BTW, Cupramine doesn't treat bacterial infections; it is primarily an anti-protozoal. For bacterial infections, I would use Nitrofurazone, Kanamycin or Metronidazole (or a combination of the three).