Low Alkalinity

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

In one day yes thats 24 hours of dosing but if you just mix carbonate in some water and pour it in, You would be asking for trouble.

Ever actually see or hear of anyone experiencing trouble from boosting alk one time from 5.3 dKH to 7 dKH? I'd be quite surprised.

That said, 5.3 dKH is unusually low and I suspect it may be testing error.

 

[ElusiveKumquat]

Ever actually see or hear of anyone experiencing trouble from boosting alk one time from 5.3 dKH to 7 dKH? I'd be quite surprised.

That said, 5.3 dKH is unusually low and I suspect it may be testing error.

It has been tested more than 5 times with 2 different red sea kits and api kh test. Same result each time. I suspect ph is actually lower due to my ph meter being off. I just dosed 75ml of the carbisea coral up B. Which said 1 ml per 1 gallon would raise alk by .6meq/l so it should only raise .3 I will test when I get home from work.

 

[ElusiveKumquat]

I have 150 gallons of water roughly so the 75 is a half dose.

 

[spidercrab]

Ever actually see or hear of anyone experiencing trouble from boosting alk one time from 5.3 dKH to 7 dKH? I'd be quite surprised.

That said, 5.3 dKH is unusually low and I suspect it may be testing error.

Yes definitely. I have killed a softy tank with soda ash raising a 20 gallon tank from 5.5 to 7.2 in one dose. zoas and mushrooms are especially sensitive to raising alkalinity abruptly. They closed up immediately and then some melted and the whole tank crashed within 2 days.

 

[spidercrab]

Here is another guy just yesterday who RTN'd his tank with a 1 dkh dose of soda ash. http://reef2reef.com/threads/lost-m...bacterial-infection-or-something-else.273569/

Have you tried rapidly increasing the dkh of your tank with soda ash? just curious.

 

[ElusiveKumquat]

Yes definitely. I have killed a softy tank with soda ash raising a 20 gallon tank from 5.5 to 7.2 in one dose. zoas and mushrooms are especially sensitive to raising alkalinity abruptly. They closed up immediately and then some melted and the whole tank crashed within 2 days.

That's why I'd like to go slow. One tank I'm the system is mainly zoas and the other has mainly lps

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Yes definitely. I have killed a softy tank with soda ash raising a 20 gallon tank from 5.5 to 7.2 in one dose. zoas and mushrooms are especially sensitive to raising alkalinity abruptly. They closed up immediately and then some melted and the whole tank crashed within 2 days.

Sorry, I have to say I just don't believe it could happen that way if the dose was clean.
I have read, really literally, hundreds of thousands of posts relating to reef chemistry, and I simply don't believe that experience, even if it is accurately attributed to the dosing in your case, translates to most folks. MANY people dose 1.6 dKH without killing a tank, and I have never EVER heard of a tank crash from bringing alk up to 7 dKH using bicarbonate or carbonate. Mushrooms don't even use alkalinity.

Maybe it was contaminated with something toxic. What exact product did you use?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Here is another guy just yesterday who RTN'd his tank with a 1 dkh dose of soda ash. http://reef2reef.com/threads/lost-m...bacterial-infection-or-something-else.273569/

Have you tried rapidly increasing the dkh of your tank with soda ash? just curious.

Let's not mischaracterize that post. He replaced his sand. That certainly has been known to lead to issues, 1 dKH boost to alk does not.

And yes, I have boosted my tank alk by far more than 1 dKH all at once. So have tons of reefers.

 

[spidercrab]

Hmm I use BRS. Well I guess it's okay then. Maybe there was something else about my tank chemistry that did it.

 

[spidercrab]

I still dont know how that could be possible. I see immediate stress when adding carbonate directly to the tank. I wouldn't advise new reefers to bolus dose soda ash it is very potent and even a small calculation mistake will kill a tank. Is there any reason why you would be opposed to dosing over a period of time and slowly raising to an appropriate level rather than trying to get there rapidly all at once?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I still dont know how that could be possible. I see immediate stress when adding carbonate directly to the tank. I wouldn't advise new reefers to bolus dose soda ash it is very potent and even a small calculation mistake will kill a tank. Is there any reason why you would be opposed to dosing over a period of time and slowly raising to an appropriate level rather than trying to get there rapidly all at once?

Not really. Slow is usually fine too. IMO, it may be more stressful for hard corals to be a 5.3 dKH than to boost it instantly to 7 dKH, but doing so over a day or so is certainly fine.

Baking soda (sodium bicarbonate) may be a better bet since it won't boost pH. A 1.4 dKH boost to alk with sodium carbonate boosts pH about 0.35 pH units (more at lower alk, less at higher alk).

 

[spidercrab]

http://reef2reef.com/threads/opinion-solicited-on-alk-overreaction-and-acropora.270224/

Just saw another report of alk overdose. 2.6 dkh increase caused some bleaching and further problems. What is the threshold? It seems like a 1.7 dkh slug of bicarb might be pretty risky.

 

[ElusiveKumquat]

Well I just tested the water and the coral up B worked as advertised. The alk is now 6.3 dkh. I will do another dose tomorrow morning.

 

[ElusiveKumquat]

And corals all still look happy!

 

[spidercrab]

Nice work

 

[MaccaPopEye]

Before I got a dosing pump I would dose 1dKH per day all at once and on occasion I missed a day due to work and would add 2dKH all at once to bring it back up to 8. I do think dosing spread out over the day is better for stability purposes however I never noticed any issues with clams, LPS, softies and one SPS when dosing 2dKH at once when my alk dropped to 6. I would pour it in as a slow dribble and not actually dump the whole lot in but I doubt that makes too much of a difference.

 

[spidercrab]

I guess depending on how slowly. So 2 dkh might be fine. 3 dkh definitely problems?

Before I got a dosing pump I would dose 1dKH per day all at once and on occasion I missed a day due to work and would add 2dKH all at once to bring it back up to 8. I do think dosing spread out over the day is better for stability purposes however I never noticed any issues with clams, LPS, softies and one SPS when dosing 2dKH at once when my alk dropped to 6. I would pour it in as a slow dribble and not actually dump the whole lot in but I doubt that makes too

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I guess depending on how slowly. So 2 dkh might be fine. 3 dkh definitely problems?

Depends on many things, and slower alk changes are best. If the alk is currently above natural levels of about 6.5 to 7 dKH, then there's never any reason to raise it fast and I usually recommend 0.5 dKH per day as a reasonable rate.

But that is a one time boost, not a daily dosing. There is little evidence that a tank which consumes 2 dKH per day suffers from getting the dose once a day. Spread out dosing might be better for it, and may make the corals thrive better, but it doesn't crash a tank.

The idea is that a coral adapts its ability to uptake carbonate to the conditions present, and drastic changes in the availability can cause the coral to take up too little or too much. But if it has adapted itself to the daily fluctuation of once a day dosing, it likely deals with the changes much better than a coral that is jumped 2 dKH per day for 3 days in a row from 7 to 13 dKH.

 

[ElusiveKumquat]

Now I need to ask because I want to be sure about dosing. But once I get my alk where I want it should I begin to dose using the calcium part aswell?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Now I need to ask because I want to be sure about dosing. But once I get my alk where I want it should I begin to dose using the calcium part aswell?

Yes.