Metal Halide Flickering

[tacosricos]

My bulb has recently started flickering when powered up. The bulb is long overdue do for replacement. I am wondering if this flickering is more likely a problem with the ballast, or just the bulb going. I have a 250w medal halide, it's a hydrofarm fixture with a built-in ballast. It's probably about 6 years old or so.

I want to avoid buying a new bulb if what I really need is a new fixture altogether.

 

[Jeepguy242]

If it has been working it probably isn’t the ballast.

Usually they either work or they don’t.

 

[A. grandis]

Probably the ballast...
I would get a nice halide system for aquariums instead the Hydrofarm.
Hamilton fixtures are nice. The Cebu is great!
Another more expensive option that I like very much is the Giesemann Spectra.
Get some nice ballasts for the bulbs... Luxcore is a great electronic ballast.
The recommendations would depend on your system and what you want to keep and the bulbs you want to use.
Grandis.

 

[tacosricos]

Thanks for the responses. I know the hydrofarm isn't very highly regarded, and certainly looks clunky above my tank. But I will say this thing has been a powerhouse that has worked flawlessly for 6 or 7 years now. I'm going to try a new bulb first.

When I do upgrade my lighting I will probably move away for metal halide and go LED/T5.

 

[10Seconds]

Get a new bulb.

I can say a big 2x on the Giesmann Spectra, love it! Trust me if you get away from MH/t5, especially a long time user as yourself you we regret it big time.

 

[A. grandis]

Giesemann Spectra is the holy grail of the fixtures IMO.
Dream of your corals! They will love you forever.
Spectra stands above all with power and authority.
Grandis.

 

[jda]

Bad bulbs can flicker. Nearly nobody runs them that long, though.

Usually when I ballast does, it cuts power and then has to recycle which can take 10-15 minutes when hot.

It would not hurt to check or corroded connections, either.

 

[tacosricos]

Bad bulbs can flicker. Nearly nobody runs them that long, though.

Usually when I ballast does, it cuts power and then has to recycle which can take 10-15 minutes when hot.

It would not hurt to check or corroded connections, either.

Haha, the bulb isn't 6 years old, just the ballast. The bulb has 1-1.5 years on it, which I know is still longer than people tend to run them.

 

[KJAG]

Thanks for the responses. I know the hydrofarm isn't very highly regarded, and certainly looks clunky above my tank. But I will say this thing has been a powerhouse that has worked flawlessly for 6 or 7 years now. I'm going to try a new bulb first.

When I do upgrade my lighting I will probably move away for metal halide and go LED/T5.

Would totally disagree with this. In fact I’d place Hydrofarm Phantoms well above most, if not all aquarium hobby Ballasts. They’re bulletproof. Personally been indoor gardening for longer than I’ve been in the reef hobby and some of my Phantoms have been running for almost ten years years with zero issues. They have a solid reputation in the Hydro/ gardening world, and we run substantially more power in that hobby. Multiple thousand watt HPS/ Halides. I’ve just bought more of them for my 250 W Radiums. Switchable from 400-250W, and you can overdrive them on Boost mode.

 

[tacosricos]

Thanks for your input. To clarify, I'm not slamming hydrofarm here. My fixture has worked great for years. I was stating that it's probably not a lot of people's go-to for reefing. The point of this thread was to get some advice on my next move, not to debate the merits of different brands.

 

[KJAG]

Thanks for your input. To clarify, I'm not slamming hydrofarm here. My fixture has worked great for years. I was stating that it's probably not a lot of people's go-to for reefing. The point of this thread was to get some advice on my next move, not to debate the merits of different brands.

I didn’t take your quote as a slam, was more responding to a potential misleading bit of information about that company, not from you personally. The broader scope of any thread is to better the hobby, which may result in tertiary points other than just the singular goal of a thread. In this case, anyone else reading shouldn’t be discouraged from trying that particular brand. Since it was brought up.

 

[mtraylor]

Hopefully its just the bulb. When I ran MH's. If a bulb was flickering it was usually upon initial setup and you would know if you had a bad bulb or not. If you are keeping your bulbs in the system for say over 6-8 months depending on brand etc.... they will not give off the right spectrum anymore and if you have corals they will suffer... especially sps. They should be changed out. Not to mention allot of bulbs will start to promote algae growth in the aquarium once they get old.

If you just have some low light softies, I have seen people say "I have been running this bulb for 2 years".....and they have. If changing out lights is a big issue and not something you like doing. I would start looking at a light alternative, as your corals would be more stable and less for you to worry about. Just my 2cents.

 

[jda]

There have been a lot of studies and articles that indicate that using a MH bulb for 2 years does no real harm, but output is lower. Same is being found out about T5...only with fewer studies. I use my 14K Phoenix for 2 years... not because I am cheap, just because it does not matter if I do. Anybody changing bulbs at 6-8 months is wasting money, IMO.

 

[Jeremy Luke]

Totally support the purchase of the Spectra. I love mine!

 

[A. grandis]

Would totally disagree with this. In fact I’d place Hydrofarm Phantoms well above most, if not all aquarium hobby Ballasts. They’re bulletproof. Personally been indoor gardening for longer than I’ve been in the reef hobby and some of my Phantoms have been running for almost ten years years with zero issues. They have a solid reputation in the Hydro/ gardening world, and we run substantially more power in that hobby. Multiple thousand watt HPS/ Halides. I’ve just bought more of them for my 250 W Radiums. Switchable from 400-250W, and you can overdrive them on Boost mode.

That was my fault!
I was referring mostly to the fixture not being the best reflector for aquarium applications in terms of exposure to the saltwater environment and light distribution.
Their reputation for hydroponics would show us that it could be a plausible alternative, though.
Good to know that this is a good brand option in terms of lasting.
Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

There have been a lot of studies and articles that indicate that using a MH bulb for 2 years does no real harm, but output is lower. Same is being found out about T5...only with fewer studies. I use my 14K Phoenix for 2 years... not because I am cheap, just because it does not matter if I do. Anybody changing bulbs at 6-8 months is wasting money, IMO.

Please post the links. Thanks,
Grandis.

 

[hybridazn]

There have been a lot of studies and articles that indicate that using a MH bulb for 2 years does no real harm, but output is lower. Same is being found out about T5...only with fewer studies. I use my 14K Phoenix for 2 years... not because I am cheap, just because it does not matter if I do. Anybody changing bulbs at 6-8 months is wasting money, IMO.

Could you post these studies? Curious because I've read numerous write ups where they show actual proof via par, light output and actual coral reaction to aging bulbs. And just about all came to the same conclusion, anything over a year you lose tremendous output, kelvin slippage and slowing coral growth.

Now a lot of it has to do with bulb/ballast combos but all in all it concluded the same.

 

[mtraylor]

I would like to see the studies as well. I never had any type of time table on when to change my bulbs. I let my sps tell me when I needed to change them. There was also another tell tell sign and that was the arc of algae in the sand telling me that my bulbs were done and drifting spectrum. When I seen either of those signs I changed them.

Now I know for certain to keep my sps going, I could not keep a bulb for 2 or 3 years. Tried it when I first started out and got a badge for it. If I got a real good bulb, I could squeeze in 10months. Each bulb was different. That being said. When I first starting reefing with a leather coral and some brown zoo's. Maybe they weren't brown but all I had was 6500K bulb and some power compacts. I never changed the bulbs. They stayed alive and that was about it. My aquarium then didn't look mine now. I keep my husbandry up. I think each aquarium has different requirements. I would like to see if people with sps dominant aquariums are keeping their bulbs for 2 years successfully.

 

[jda]

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2007-04/ac/index.php

There are some 12-24 month old bulbs as well as 0-12 in here. BRS is doing one with T5s right now... but need the clock to tick off more months to finish it off. Yes, you use output, but it is not as signifiant as the loss in the first year.

I do use 14K Phoenix and I do use them 24 months. When I put in new bulbs after 24 months, I do not acclimate or anything... just put them in and the tank never seems to notice. I do change my 20K Radiums and 10K Hamiltons after 12, but sometimes I go as long as 18 months, but this is mostly on accident. When I used to use actinic bulbs, I would run them until they turned brown or went out - they were just for supplement anyway.

In any case, 6 to 8 month bulb replacement is bunk for normal/spec bulbs, IMO. ...maybe if you are overdriving a bulb quite a bit.

 

[Jeremy Luke]

Bulk Reef Supply just test ATI T5HO Blue+ bulbs for a simulated 12 months. They found that in the first month they lose 10% but then maintain that for the rest of the year. They said they wouldn't replace them after a year. They are now going to simulate another 12 months of use on the same bulbs over the next 4 months. Can't wait to see what they find.

I wish they'd do this testing on Radium Halide bulbs. I replaced mine after 11 months to be safe just recently but I'm keeping my Blue+ in until I see the results of the 24 months test.