mixing angels?

ThaBeast · Oct 12, 2015

working on stock list for my incoming 400. Can a navarchus and a xanthometopon be kept in an 8ft tank together successfully? I know they are in the same family so my guess would be no. If it is possible, which one goes in first?

MrDJeep123 · Oct 12, 2015

The only chance of any success is to introduce them together. Do you have one in your current tank already? Nvm...had to reread. You haven't set up the tank.

ThaBeast · Oct 12, 2015

MrDJeep123 · Oct 12, 2015

Personally, I would not do it. The risks of one of them more territorial over the other just doesn't outweigh the benefits. You'll eventually have to remove the Blue Face as I think they are the more aggressive.

Are you buying them as juveniles or adults?

sc50964 · Oct 12, 2015

An 8', 400 gallon tank should have plenty of space for these two angels based on my experience with them. You do want to do a good open aquascape that has many passages, tunnels, and caves for the Angels to feel safe. Lowest chance of fighting of any kind if they are purchased as juvi and introduced at the same time.

4FordFamily · Oct 12, 2015

The only reason I hesitate to say yes despite your tank size is the fragile nature of the blue girdled angel (navarchus). They are also notably smaller for a large angel.

That said I break dang near every rule in angel keeping in my angel tank:

4" blue face
4.5" emperor
5" Passer
4.5" queen
3.5" Rock beauty
2.75" Potters
2" Flame

In with a moorish idol who somehow holds his own too.

Eventually I want a scribbled angel as well.

MrDJeep123 · Oct 12, 2015

sc50964 said:
An 8', 400 gallon tank should have plenty of space for these two angels based on my experience with them. You do want to do a good open aquascape that has many passages, tunnels, and caves for the Angels to feel safe. Lowest chance of fighting of any kind if they are purchased as juvi and introduced at the same time.

3FordFamily said:
The only reason I hesitate to say yes despite your tank size is the fragile nature of the blue girdled angel (navarchus). They are also notably smaller for a large angel.

That said I break dang near every rule in angel keeping in my angel tank:

4" blue face
4.5" emperor
5" Passer
4.5" queen
3.5" Rock beauty
2.75" Potters
2" Flame

In with a moorish idol who somehow holds his own too.

Eventually I want a scribbled angel as well.

What works for one doesn't always work for another. In the case of angels, it's really best to err on the side of caution and assume things will not go as planned. As it rarely ever does. The problem is when they become adults. They will more than likely start having issues with each other.

sc50964 · Oct 12, 2015

His investment in a 400 gallon tank is already playing conservative for just two angels. In this hobby, there are always risks. After all, it's something that he should enjoy. Keeping angels in a community tank isn't that rare anymore, especially in such big tank. I know I sure will do something similar in my 560g when I finally have time for it.

4FordFamily · Oct 12, 2015

sc50964 said:
His investment in a 400 gallon tank is already playing conservative for just two angels. In this hobby, there are always risks. After all, it's something that he should enjoy. Keeping angels in a community tank isn't that rare anymore, especially in such big tank. I know I sure will do something similar in my 560g when I finally have time for it.

Two angels IMO is more risky aggression-wise than 5

Quinn123 · Oct 12, 2015

i had four regal angel in my 144 gallons for years without any problem, and i did not add them all at once. i think the key to my success was that every time, i purchased a new regal, i would catch my existing regal and QT it with my new regal.

sc50964 · Oct 12, 2015

I agree. I had one of every angel genus in my old 180g setup and they were all adults living peacefully.

4FordFamily · Oct 12, 2015

Quinn123 said:
i had four regal angel in my 144 gallons for years without any problem, and i did not add them all at once. i think the key to my success was that every time, i purchased a new regal, i would catch my existing regal and QT it with my new regal.

that AND because regal angels are not particularly aggressive, either.

sc50964 · Oct 12, 2015

I guess I had an aggressive regal coz he would let the queen and the emperor know who the boss was.

MrDJeep123 · Oct 12, 2015

sc50964 said:
His investment in a 400 gallon tank is already playing conservative for just two angels. In this hobby, there are always risks. After all, it's something that he should enjoy. Keeping angels in a community tank isn't that rare anymore, especially in such big tank. I know I sure will do something similar in my 560g when I finally have time for it.

Risks in that there is a possibility for flooding. I'd consider that an acceptable risk. Taking a risk in that certain fish do not get along and potentially kill each other. I'd consider that extremely unnecessary. If you've been in this hobby for any length of time, you should know what happens when you take unnecessary gambles. They rarely, if ever, pan out.

Just because a person wants to a enjoy a tank full of animals that doesn't get along doesn't make it acceptable. If you think it's ok then you aren't putting the needs of the animal first and foremost. In the end, it's OP's decision. OP asked and was answered. It may work because they are juveniles, but it won't when they become adults as their needs and wants change.

Quinn123 said:
i had four regal angel in my 144 gallons for years without any problem, and i did not add them all at once. i think the key to my success was that every time, i purchased a new regal, i would catch my existing regal and QT it with my new regal.

Again, what works for you doesn't work for someone else.

3FordFamily said:
that AND because regal angels are not particularly aggressive, either.

+1

ThaBeast · Oct 12, 2015

Didn't think it would work, but I don't have a lot of experience & knowledge pertaining to large Angels. I'm not going to try after seeing the response posted here....I don't even know anyone near me I would trust with one of my fish if I had to remove one

MrDJeep123 · Oct 12, 2015

HndMafia said:
Didn't think it would work, but I don't have a lot of experience & knowledge pertaining to large Angels. I'm not going to try after seeing the response posted here....I don't even know anyone near me I would trust with one of my fish if I had to remove one

You could always have more than one big tank.

ThaBeast · Oct 12, 2015

Lol...don't have the time or the space for more than one large tank

sc50964 · Oct 12, 2015

Not sure what experience @MrDJeep123 has had in the past, but it sounds like you either have never tried it or have failed. I'm only speaking from my own experience. With the time and research I've done to get an angel community tank going, I've had pretty good success. Anyway, no need to sound like an animal rights activist. I give my opinion and you give yours, and let's just leave it like that.

MrDJeep123 · Oct 12, 2015

I've been in the hobby since around 2000. I know more about fish than I do corals. I've had many tanks. I can also tell you I'm more about learning from others mistakes, watching time and time again what works and what doesn't.

As for being an animal rights activist, I'm not suggesting we give them the right to vote, and I'm certainly not against eating them.

But being a hobbyists requires us to be diligent and responsible.

sc50964 · Oct 12, 2015

There is enough info out there to push beyond the old boundaries. It's always simpler to stay in the comfort zone and not taking in info that are helpful. It's also always simpler to stay on the sideline and call others out when you have no real hands on experience. Pretty much all marine species that make it to this hobby don't live their natural expected lives. They just don't belong on land in the tanks, regardless how diligent and responsible you are.