Montipora gods please shed some light.

[Reeferdood]

Well,
Jason returned my email from RAP in NYC..
Lower lights seems to be the right advice until they start to adjust...
Going to keep them lower for now and see what happens..
This has been a good thread, thanks everyone.

 

[Dana Riddle]

I have a research project concerning spectrum and Monti coloration in progress, but don't have any info to share yet. With that said, discussions I've had with some coral farmers/advanced hobbyists, two elements seem to be important - elevated magnesium (1,500 ppm) is often associated with intensified green and orange colors in plating Montis (M. capricornis) while potassium (elevated concentration, exact amount unknown) was reported to be important in promotion of green fluorescence (frags were so small as to make any ID impossible.)

 

[Retro Reefer]

I received a red and green Monti that I really didn’t want as freebies so I placed them side by side on a frag rack in my tank for about 10 weeks until I could find a home for them.. my red only grew maybe a 1/4 and just started attaching itself to the glass but the green went nuts and showed massive growth in just a little over two months firmly attaching itself to glass behind rack.

 

[Retro Reefer]

Picture from the back you can really see the growth..

 

[Reeferdood]

I have a research project concerning spectrum and Monti coloration in progress, but don't have any info to share yet. With that said, discussions I've had with some coral farmers/advanced hobbyists, two elements seem to be important - elevated magnesium (1,500 ppm) is often associated with intensified green and orange colors in plating Montis (M. capricornis) while potassium (elevated concentration, exact amount unknown) was reported to be important in promotion of green fluorescence (frags were so small as to make any ID impossible.)

I was hoping you would chime in, thank you for your valuable input.
I’ll see if I can make a couple adjustments and see if it helps me out.

 

[Dana Riddle]

I was hoping you would chime in, thank you for your valuable input.
I’ll see if I can make a couple adjustments and see if it helps me out.

Please keep us posted! I've been studying and experimenting with coral coloration for the last 20+ years and I'm still in the learning stage. There are 200-300 fluorescent proteins described and only 2 sets are genetically identical, meaning the other few hundred are likely unique and will react to environmental conditions in differing ways.

 

[Reeferdood]

Please keep us posted! I've been studying and experimenting with coral coloration for the last 20+ years and I'm still in the learning stage. There are 200-300 fluorescent proteins described and only 2 sets are genetically identical, meaning the other few hundred are likely unique and will react to environmental conditions in differing ways.

This is precisely how we learn, trading notes.
I would be honored to share knowledge with you.
Thanks again.

 

[Pho Dac Biet]

red grows faster

 

[Flippers4pups]

red grows faster

I agree:

 

[Maggie321]

I agree:

That red is beautiful! My purple grows faster than my red in my tank.
I turned my lights back down and my green is starting to look more green again, the pink lines that matched the polyp color is fading back to green.

 

[Flippers4pups]

That red is beautiful! My purple grows faster than my red in my tank.
I turned my lights back down and my green is starting to look more green again, the pink lines that matched the polyp color is fading back to green.

Thank you, started out as a quarter size frag. Size of a dinner plate now.

My green montipora caps are slower growers and are more sensitive to light intensity. Reds up high, greens like lower in my tank.

 

[jlanger]

Nothing really new to add to the discussion, but I could grow any plating montipora corals like weeds for years; until last year. Here's some information/thoughts from my experience.

First, some photos for reference...

Photo by ChristopherKriens

The green and red plating montipora colonies were both M. hodgsoni purchased from LiveAquaria's Diver's Den.
The corals grew very well under T5 and LED (Radion) lighting, but I found that to keep the bright red coloration under LEDs, I needed to supplement with two ATI Aqua Blue+ bulbs.
With a heavily stocked tank, my nutrient levels were always on the higher end; NO3 around 24-32ppm and PO4 was also high.
The corals grew differently depending on the amount/type of water flow. They do like high water flow and will grow towards it. The corals that were placed lower in the tank and not in a direct path of the water flow would grow down towards the undertow created by the water pumps.
I had great success with many other types of plating montipora corals in this tank; Idaho Grape, M. danae, M. undata, M. spongodes, Purple Rimmed and the Nauti Spiral.

All of them grew very fast and had great coloration.
Until...

Last summer, the montipora corals started to look drab. The coloration faded so that it looked like a silvery tone of the original color. After a few more weeks, the colonies started dying off. Nothing major had been changed/added to the system for months; maybe a year. I had implemented an ATS unit to help lower my nutrients which was maintaining them at better levels, but those were still high (NO3 at 16ppm).
To find out what was happening, we checked for pests (montipora eating nudis); found none.
I started fragging the decent corals and displacing them amongst other friends' tanks to see if they would survive and most of them did.

I decided to send in a water sample to be tested (TritonLab). The results showed elevated aluminum (two MarinePure blocks in sump) and extremely low potassium (should be 400, was 260).
In researching the potassium issue, I found that my salt mix (hw MarineMix) had bad batches of salt with low potassium. In trying to lower my nutrient levels with larger water changes, I was inadvertently driving my potassium levels lower with the bad salt. I ended up losing all of the montipora corals and the tank was eventually torn down; a new system is in progress.

To conclude, montipora corals are very hardy and should grow well and fast.
I'd take a look into the water parameters first. Montipora corals do well with higher nutrient levels and good lighting. If you're having issues, check your potassium levels; maybe the aluminum also.

Good luck.

 

[iemsparticus]

I’ve found Monti Caps to be incredibly sensitive to potassium levels... montis in general more so than any other coral, but caps particularly.

 

[Pho Dac Biet]

THATS WHY I DOSE POTASSIUM IODIDE AND POTASSIUM NITRATE

 

[Reeferdood]

I can tell you that the day I quit using marine pure the system began to look better..
Those blocks are snake oil IMHO..

 

[Reeferdood]

Update, so the one thing that has made a huge difference that I can see was elevating my magnesium from 1375 to 1450. I am not sure if this alone has been the smoking gun or coincidence but the montipora is definitely greener. I have 3 frags located in 3 different areas for par differences and so far all 3 are very vibrant.

 

[Reeferdood]

Nothing really new to add to the discussion, but I could grow any plating montipora corals like weeds for years; until last year. Here's some information/thoughts from my experience.

First, some photos for reference...

Photo by ChristopherKriens

The green and red plating montipora colonies were both M. hodgsoni purchased from LiveAquaria's Diver's Den.
The corals grew very well under T5 and LED (Radion) lighting, but I found that to keep the bright red coloration under LEDs, I needed to supplement with two ATI Aqua Blue+ bulbs.
With a heavily stocked tank, my nutrient levels were always on the higher end; NO3 around 24-32ppm and PO4 was also high.
The corals grew differently depending on the amount/type of water flow. They do like high water flow and will grow towards it. The corals that were placed lower in the tank and not in a direct path of the water flow would grow down towards the undertow created by the water pumps.
I had great success with many other types of plating montipora corals in this tank; Idaho Grape, M. danae, M. undata, M. spongodes, Purple Rimmed and the Nauti Spiral.

All of them grew very fast and had great coloration.
Until...

Last summer, the montipora corals started to look drab. The coloration faded so that it looked like a silvery tone of the original color. After a few more weeks, the colonies started dying off. Nothing major had been changed/added to the system for months; maybe a year. I had implemented an ATS unit to help lower my nutrients which was maintaining them at better levels, but those were still high (NO3 at 16ppm).
To find out what was happening, we checked for pests (montipora eating nudis); found none.
I started fragging the decent corals and displacing them amongst other friends' tanks to see if they would survive and most of them did.

I decided to send in a water sample to be tested (TritonLab). The results showed elevated aluminum (two MarinePure blocks in sump) and extremely low potassium (should be 400, was 260).
In researching the potassium issue, I found that my salt mix (hw MarineMix) had bad batches of salt with low potassium. In trying to lower my nutrient levels with larger water changes, I was inadvertently driving my potassium levels lower with the bad salt. I ended up losing all of the montipora corals and the tank was eventually torn down; a new system is in progress.

To conclude, montipora corals are very hardy and should grow well and fast.
I'd take a look into the water parameters first. Montipora corals do well with higher nutrient levels and good lighting. If you're having issues, check your potassium levels; maybe the aluminum also.

Good luck.

Very beautiful tank....

 

[Lor]

I agree:

So i have a noob question, are these multiple frags stacked and just grew like that? Or is this just 1 frag?

 

[madweazl]

I have a green monti undata that has always been a pain in my tank. It will look great for a while, pale out, come back, rinse and repeat. I've been looking for a trend over the past six months to isolate what may be the cause and the only thing I've been able to come up with was salinity fluctuations. With that said, magnesium levels are generally in the 1350 range so I may start dosing some to see if higher levels bring positive results (even though it's a different species).

 

[BluewaterLa]

I have always seen drab or even poor health in monti caps and other SPS corals when Magnesium levels got down to 1300 or there about.
Another element is Potassium being low or too high causing coloration to change.
Magnesium test kits, even well trusted ones we use in the hobby can be off as much as a few hundred ppm so my 1300 or there about was proven to be actually 1220 ppm from an ICP test done.
I tested all parameters in tank at same time and recorded them then took the sample for the ICP test and compared them when results came in.
We all know there are variables and tolerances that are at play here but still in all as long as I keep my Magnesium up to 1400 ppm by my test kit then everything looks fine with my Monti caps and other corals including coralline algae.
Usually I can tell Magnesium is low or has been too low for a while when my coralline algae starts to wash out in color or gets a bit thin looking.
Sounds crazy to some but this has been recorded several times over my years in logs I keep hand written with every tank I've owned.

With the advancements in our hobby test kits and readily available ''other '' elements like Potassium now available I test for everything I can and use them as a base / guideline to help me determine if my tank is needing anything more or less. Most times I can see a visible difference in one or more things that causes me to start checking certain elements.
Regular testing for me includes DKH a few times per week, Nitrates, Phosphate, Calcium on a regular basis say at least twice a month and Magnesium once a month for corrections as needed. Other elements are tested when I'm curious, bored or mainly see something is not quite kosher.