My Forever Tank - Plan/Build/Maintain Thread

[Bill Amaro]

Cycle Update: 15 Days 10 Hours

Ammonia 0.8
Nitrite 200+PPB/.2+PPM (exceeded max Hanna Range)
Nitrate 50+PPM (exceeded max Hanna range with dilution)

Started lowering the temp from 84.5 about 4 days ago.. Every two days, I lower the setting on my Inkbird by 1 degree with a goal temp of 78-79 which is where I tend to keep my tank.

Salinity is currently 1.018

(Following Dr Tim's recommendation of lower salinity and higher temperature during cycling).

3D printer is back up, so I should have some sump pictures available in the next day or two.

 

[Bill Amaro]

Cycle Update: 17 days, 13 hours

Note the Nitrate reading at 15 days, 10 hours (previous cycle post) was in error. I did the dilution incorrectly (Used tank water instead of salt water, not sure where my head was at that day)

Ammonia 0.2
Nitrite 200+PPB/.2+PPM (exceeded max Hanna Range)
Nitrate 25.6 (Hanna Nitrate Checker with dilution)

So my Ammonia is approaching 0, now waiting for my Nitrites to start to drop which I hope will happen in the next day or 3.

I have not done any water changes at this point.

 

[Bill Amaro]

Here is the start of my sump build (40 gal Breeder).

My first design goal was to utilize my 3D printer to make as many custom parts as possible and to build a very efficient sump.

As far as 3D printing, prototyping parts, part print time and the cost of filament makes this a lengthy and costly process. For every part, there were normally 2 to 4 prototype parts with some of these taking 5 to 20 hours to print.
What you see so far is probably over 125 hours of design and print time. This will be a one of a kind custom sump. All parts are printed with PETG and if anyone cares about the printer attributes I used, just ask. PETG to PETG was glued using SCIGGRIP 16. PETG to glass was done using SCS1200.

My second design goal was that all devices be stand-alone with no dependency on the flow rate thru the sump.

All flow to the devices would be via a single stand-alone pump located in what I am calling the device chamber. One thing I learned with my 90 is that if you build your manifold as part of your return, trying to balance everything to obtain desired flow rates is a real pain.

The 3 devices I still need to design and build are an ATS, media reactor and nitrate destroyer (if needed) which will be located in the device chamber. I have a protein skimmer, so no reason to build one of those.

As you look at the pictures below, the chamber in the back is my DYI RollerMat. Overall length is 20" with the flat filter area being 12" long by 4" wide.
The RollerMat is designed so the plates slide out, so I can change them (if a redesign is needed) or take them out to clean the chamber.
I am still working on obtaining the motor drive to advance the filter paper. If anyone has any suggestions of what to order, would love to hear them.

The drains from the overflow will have a diverter of some kind at the end so the water doesn't hit the filter paper directly, but flows out sideways and then settles down thru the filter paper. Have a design in my head that I need to flesh out a little more.

The bubble trap is in the front left. Built it so I can slide the panels out if I want to change the sump level (right now, it is set to 9").

The left front is the return chamber. It contains a COR-20 that will drive the 2 display returns and a COR-15 that will drive the UV and 3rd display return (I have not piped the COR-15 yet as I am still using my UV on my old 90).

The overflow box is rated at 2400 gals per hour, but pretty sure I will never try to put that much water thur the RollerMat. I have no idea at this point what my turn-over rate thru the sump will be but I am pretty confident that I can get at a minimum 5-6X (750-900GPH) per hour.

I will most likely get the sump wet next Monday. Heading to Reef-A-Palooza this weekend and I don't want to start it up and not be around.

I will post more pics as the sump moves along.

Questions/Comments/Suggestions are most welcome.

 

[Bill Amaro]

Cycle Update: 24 days, 11 hours

Ammonia 0.16
Nitrite .79 PPM (Hanna Nitrite Checker with 1->10 dilution)
Nitrate 12.2 (Hanna Nitrate Checker with dilution)

Will be adding 2 ml of Ammonium Chloride

 

[Bill Amaro]

As of today, I am declaring my new tank in a cycle complete state (total gallons 147 DT/Sump).

Started with Dr. Tim's and used Ammonium Chloride for a fishless cycle. In order to increase the bacteria diversification, for the last 3 weeks, on Sundays, I have been adding 1 tube of BioDigest and every Wednesday, I have added 15ML of MicroBacter7.

Overall, it took 46 days to cycle the tank to these parameters:

Ammonia 0.26 PPM
Nitrite 0.002 PPM (Hanna Nitrate Checker)
Nitrate 22.4 (Hanna Nitrate Checker with dilution)

I actually started to see Nitrite start to drop after 25 days of cycling. At that point I added an additional 3ML of Ammonium Chloride since my Ammonia had reached .16 ppm

I have not turned on any lights (I don't even have them installed yet).

I have my COR-20 pump running pushing water thru the sump and DT, however, I don't have any nutrient export devices in the sump yet. Basically the pump is keeping water moving between the sump and DT.

As previously reported, I started with a salinity of 1.018 (recommended by Dr. Tim to enhance bacteria growth). Starting last week, I have been slowly raising the salinity attempting to reach 1.025. As of last night it was 1.024. I also reduced my temp down to 77 from 82.

I plan on continuing to adding 1 or 2 ml of Ammonium Chloride once a week till the end of June. Have a couple of trips planned, so I don't want to transfer any fish (from my old tank) over till I know I will be home for an extended period of time.

My next step is to start to build my pod population. Going to add Pods and feed them phytoplankton over the next 2 or 3 weeks. Figure I will get a really good pod growth since there are no predators in the tank that will eat them and they will be well established by the end of the month.

Having my old tank up and running really allows me to have the patience to build this one correctly from the start.

 

[Bill Amaro]

As previously posted, I plan on having 4 methods of nutrient exportation:

RollerMat
Algae Turf Scrubber
Modified Donovan's Nitrate Destroyer
Protein Skimmer.


With the exception of the Protein Skimmer, the 3 exporters will by DYI 3D custom printed devices.


I have posted the DYI RollerMat,was hoping someone would recommend a motor to manage the filter roll, but haven't received any recommendations as of yet.

My 3D printer is down (waiting for a new mother board to be shipped), so I haven't been able to print the last piece for the RollerMat, however it should be here next week.

As far as the ATS, it will be a single lighted side (using a ReefBreeders Pico Refugium LED as the light source as I have a new one that isn't being used) with an 8" x 10" screen. The light is rated for a 12 x 12 area and using my par meter and a cardboard mockup, I got between 250 and 400 on that size screen.

The outside will be printed with blue PETG to prevent light bleed. I will be printing a white 3MM thick inside insert for the ATS to enhance light reflection.

Since I have other exporters in my sump, I decided to go with a single lighted side. I believe the other exporters will handle any export "gaps".

Most of the water that flows over the screens will flow back into the sump, however a small portion will flow into a "pod capture structure".

Based on everything I have read, seems an ATS will produce millions of pods by default. My thought is to 3D print a device (something like the "POD Hotel") what will capture pods that flow from the ATS.

The "floors" will be removable so that I can slide them out and put them directly in my DT to add pods. There will be a port what will allow me to add phytoplankton to the capture structure to feed and increase the number of pods.

While some may consider this overkill, it is my understanding that having a roller mat can capture a lot of free floating pods and can limit the population found in the DT.

Once my printer is back up, I will post some pics of what I have designed and printed.

Comments are welcome...

 

[Bill Amaro]

Had a total tank crash on my old 90 gal tank.

We went out of state from Tues to Sunday. On Friday, I was checking my tank via Apex Fusion and it wouldn't connect.

Tried two other wifi enabled devices I have on the tank and both of those reported "device offline".

Since I could connect to other devices in the house, I knew it wasn't a network issue.

My gut told me the GFI might have tripped, hoping I was wrong, but when I got home late Sunday night, the tank was pretty much gone.

Lost all of my fish (Blue Hippo Tang, Rabbit Foxface, about a dozen or so ClownFish). Most of the frags I purchased at Reef-A-Palooza didn't make it.

Most of my long tentacle anemones are alive along with my rock flower anemones, my zoa's are closed up tight, with just a few opening here and there.

In the process of doing 15 gallon water changes each day.

Have no idea why the GFI tripped. The only other time this happened was when I spilled a slight amount of water on the plugs (my GFI is right behind my sump), but I have checked and I don't see any water, plus when I got home and reset it, it reset fine and has been running since with no problems.

An expensive lesson, but one that now has me thinking what do I do for the new 150 I am building.

The outlets for the 150 are under the tank in the stand and not on the wall and there is a dividing wall between the sump and the plugs, so the chances of any water splashing on the plugs is almost non-existent.

The ideal solution would be to have a second circuit for the tank, but that just doesn't work. I would have to rip out sheet rock, the attic space above my office is not accessible and there is a pocket door on the wall behind the tank that fills the wall space where the line/box needs to go.

The good news is in the closet that is about 5 feet from the tank which is my electronics closet (has my router, DVR, 3D printer and so on). Prior to getting into the hobby, I had added a plug to the back of that closet which is on a different circuit.

So, I have 2 options that I have come up with at this point:

Option 1 is to plug one of my Neptune/Apex EB832 Energy Bar 832 to the closet circuit when we leave for an extended period of time.

Option 2 is to build a backup safety device that I can add to the tank when we go away for extended periods of time. Basically, this will be a 3D printed platform that will hold a power head and a bubbler that hangs on the side of the tank. I have an aquanuo Top-It-Off kit which basically is 2 float switches and a relay that allows power to be applied to device when the water level drops.

So if I lose power, the water level will drop and the relay will go hot and the power head and bubbler will go active causing a break in surface tension and adding oxygen to the tank until we return.

I am leaning toward option 2 as I am not comfortable running the Energy Bar over an extension cord.

I am also going to replace and move the GFI to an easily accessible location so that I can call a friend and have them reset it if necessary.

My old 90 has been running for over 2 years and other than the time water hit the plug, the GFI has never tripped.

Net is, I don't think this is an ongoing problem, but I do want to be prepared if it happens again.

If anyone has other suggestions, would love to hear them...

 

[Bill Amaro]

I am marking my tank as cycled as of 06/17/20121. This works out to a timeframe of 8 weeks and 2 days. Longer than I expected since I started with Dr Tim's.

On the completion date I had the following parameters:

Ammonia 0.2 (Red Sea)
Nitrite 0.021 PPM (Hanna Nitrite Checker)
Nitrate 50+ PPM (Hanna).

I went ahead and did a 30 gal water change and got the nitrates down to 11.1PPM (I am questioning my Nitrate test that resulted in 50+ PPM on 6/17, 30 gal water change should have only brought it down about 10PPM)

At this point I have no mechanical filtration active. Have one of my pumps moving water from DT->Sump->DT.

I plan on turning on my mechanical filtration in about 3 weeks (will be out of town and waiting for repair parts for my 3D printer so I can print the required devices).

I don't plan on turning any lights for 2 more months. Following the BRS recommendation of 4 months of no light to build a solid bio film of all my rock work.


I have started adding some (know I will need lots more) of my cleanup crew and some stuff to enhance my micro fauna.

2 8oz containers Algagen Reefpods Tisbe Live (I am seeing pods on the glass)
1 8oz contain of Rotifers
2 x Fighting Conch (based on my research, looks like I can add 4 to a 150, but since they required sand and my NSA bases take of a lot of real estate, I am going to stick with 2 for now)
5 x Nassarius snails


On Sundays, I add one vial of BioDegest and on Wednesdays I add 3 cap fulls of MicroBacter7.

Each day I add 1/2 teaspoon of very small pellet food for my clean up crew, plus every 3 days I add 3 capfuls of Phytoplankton for the pods.

Will add some more cleanup crew later this week.. trying to figure out what type to add next.

Making progress

 

[Bill Amaro]

Had a total tank crash on my old 90 gal tank.

We went out of state from Tues to Sunday. On Friday, I was checking my tank via Apex Fusion and it wouldn't connect.

Tried two other wifi enabled devices I have on the tank and both of those reported "device offline".

Since I could connect to other devices in the house, I knew it wasn't a network issue.

My gut told me the GFI might have tripped, hoping I was wrong, but when I got home late Sunday night, the tank was pretty much gone.

Lost all of my fish (Blue Hippo Tang, Rabbit Foxface, about a dozen or so ClownFish). Most of the frags I purchased at Reef-A-Palooza didn't make it.

Most of my long tentacle anemones are alive along with my rock flower anemones, my zoa's are closed up tight, with just a few opening here and there.

In the process of doing 15 gallon water changes each day.

Have no idea why the GFI tripped. The only other time this happened was when I spilled a slight amount of water on the plugs (my GFI is right behind my sump), but I have checked and I don't see any water, plus when I got home and reset it, it reset fine and has been running since with no problems.

An expensive lesson, but one that now has me thinking what do I do for the new 150 I am building.

The outlets for the 150 are under the tank in the stand and not on the wall and there is a dividing wall between the sump and the plugs, so the chances of any water splashing on the plugs is almost non-existent.

The ideal solution would be to have a second circuit for the tank, but that just doesn't work. I would have to rip out sheet rock, the attic space above my office is not accessible and there is a pocket door on the wall behind the tank that fills the wall space where the line/box needs to go.

The good news is in the closet that is about 5 feet from the tank which is my electronics closet (has my router, DVR, 3D printer and so on). Prior to getting into the hobby, I had added a plug to the back of that closet which is on a different circuit.

So, I have 2 options that I have come up with at this point:

Option 1 is to plug one of my Neptune/Apex EB832 Energy Bar 832 to the closet circuit when we leave for an extended period of time.

Option 2 is to build a backup safety device that I can add to the tank when we go away for extended periods of time. Basically, this will be a 3D printed platform that will hold a power head and a bubbler that hangs on the side of the tank. I have an aquanuo Top-It-Off kit which basically is 2 float switches and a relay that allows power to be applied to device when the water level drops.

So if I lose power, the water level will drop and the relay will go hot and the power head and bubbler will go active causing a break in surface tension and adding oxygen to the tank until we return.

I am leaning toward option 2 as I am not comfortable running the Energy Bar over an extension cord.

I am also going to replace and move the GFI to an easily accessible location so that I can call a friend and have them reset it if necessary.

My old 90 has been running for over 2 years and other than the time water hit the plug, the GFI has never tripped.

Net is, I don't think this is an ongoing problem, but I do want to be prepared if it happens again.

If anyone has other suggestions, would love to hear them...

GFI has been fine since I reset 9 days ago... still have no idea what made it trip...

 

[Bill Amaro]

I am marking my tank as cycled as of 06/17/20121. This works out to a timeframe of 8 weeks and 2 days. Longer than I expected since I started with Dr Tim's.

On the completion date I had the following parameters:

Ammonia 0.2 (Red Sea)
Nitrite 0.021 PPM (Hanna Nitrite Checker)
Nitrate 50+ PPM (Hanna).

I went ahead and did a 30 gal water change and got the nitrates down to 11.1PPM (I am questioning my Nitrate test that resulted in 50+ PPM on 6/17, 30 gal water change should have only brought it down about 10PPM)

At this point I have no mechanical filtration active. Have one of my pumps moving water from DT->Sump->DT.

I plan on turning on my mechanical filtration in about 3 weeks (will be out of town and waiting for repair parts for my 3D printer so I can print the required devices).

I don't plan on turning any lights for 2 more months. Following the BRS recommendation of 4 months of no light to build a solid bio film of all my rock work.


I have started adding some (know I will need lots more) of my cleanup crew and some stuff to enhance my micro fauna.

2 8oz containers Algagen Reefpods Tisbe Live (I am seeing pods on the glass)
1 8oz contain of Rotifers
2 x Fighting Conch (based on my research, looks like I can add 4 to a 150, but since they required sand and my NSA bases take of a lot of real estate, I am going to stick with 2 for now)
5 x Nassarius snails


On Sundays, I add one vial of BioDegest and on Wednesdays I add 3 cap fulls of MicroBacter7.

Each day I add 1/2 teaspoon of very small pellet food for my clean up crew, plus every 3 days I add 3 capfuls of Phytoplankton for the pods.

Will add some more cleanup crew later this week.. trying to figure out what type to add next.

Making progress

Increased my CUC with the following on Wednesday:

5 x Nassarius snails
10 Red Leg Hermit Crabs
10 Astraea Snails
1 Brittle Starfish (fairly small)

Thinking that is enough clean-up crew for now.

 

[Bill Amaro]

Since I lost all of my existing livestock when my 90 crashed (see above, GFI tripped while I was out of town), I am going back to square 1 for my stocking list.

My wife (and I agreed with her), always complained that my 90 looked "dirty". The gravel bed was never white, had lots of algae growing on my rock work. Never looked like the beautiful tanks I have seen people post on here and other sites.

My design goal was to ensure that this new 150 was of "showcase" quality at all times.

To that end, I believe I needed 2 levels of filtration/maintenance. The first being mechanical and the second, the right utility fish in the tank.

I am comfortable that I have the mechanical side designed correctly. Have a roller-mat (12" filter area), Algae turf scrubber, modified nitrate destroyer, protein skimmer and 25W UV. In addition to the filtration components, I will have a media reactor and a pod capture device that will run off the ATS.

As far as the utility fish, I am leaning to starting with 2 x Engineering Goby and 1 x Diamond Watchman Goby for sand-bed maintenance. My thoughts are the Engineer Goby will keep the sand-bed turned over and the Diamond Goby will keep the sand-bed clean. I do understand the Engineer Goby will get to be about 12-14" in length.

I don't plan on keeping any small fish in this tank, so hopefully I won't lose any to the Engineering Gobies as they get larger. Also, if my mechanical works as well as I think it should, I will feed somewhat on the heavy side to keep down aggression.

As for other livestock, I know I would like to add a pair of clownfish, Blue Hippo Tang, Rabbit Foxface, Mandarin and some yet to be decided species to round out the tank.

So does anyone see a problem with the Engineering Gobies and Diamond Watchman combo. I plan on purchasing them in the beginning of July, so I can add them to the display tank at the end of July after quarantine.

Thanks...

 

[Bill Amaro]

Here is my new DYI RollerMat Bed - 5 x 3D printed pieces that slide on a mounted rails in the drain chamber. Changed the drain holes to be long slots vs holes as I think that will allow better filter paper flow-thru. The main bed is 12" x 4", so I have 48 square inches of flat filter area, plus additional area on the two sides (my estimate is about 62 additional square inches). had a couple of day test run with a different end configuration and it filtered pretty well.

 

[Bill Amaro]

16 days from reaching my 4 month cycle mark. Tank has never had any lights on yet. Just starting to turn on the mechanical filtration (RollerMat, Protein skimmer, UV will be next in about 12 days ). Have been ghost feeding for the last 2 months 1/2 teaspoon of TDO pellets to keep the small cleanup crew happy. Moving my first 2 fish from quarantine (Convict/Eng Gobies) to the tank tomorrow. ApexEL has been moved over from the old tank and appears to be functioning. I haven't hooked up my Trident/DOS yet as there are no corals in the tank and I have been taking measurements with my manual testing kits (mostly Hanna devices)..

Love printing my 3D sump elements, however, it takes a while to get the design right and to print all of the required parts. It truly is a one of a kind sump. Really looking forward to getting my bio-load up there and to see how it performs.

 

[Bill Amaro]

My 3D printer has been giving me trouble again so I am behind where I wanted to be timewise.

At this point I have the roller-mat, protein skimmer and UV all hooked up and running.

My UV is a 25W that is running in parasitic mode (running at 96 gallons per hour). The optimal is 77, but I can't seem to get my COR-15 to drop to that flow rate at this point. I never put a gate valve on that line as I thought I could control it using the COR-15 since it was a DC pump. May have to revisit that decision.

At this point, I have my return flow set so that I do 5.17 turnovers per hour thru the sump. So far that seems to be working fine. Water looks very clear at this point.

As far as tank only turnover, I have 3 Neptune Wav pumps. 2 on the right side, 1 on the left side. Based on what Fusion is telling me, I have somewhere around around +- 50 tank only turnovers per hour (Tank ended up with 123 gals of actual water). For Fusion users, my flow rate varies between 5.0 and 5.7 over a 24 hour period.

Still have no lights on the tank. As soon as my 3D printer is fixed and I can print the parts for my ATS and get it running, I will add the lights and turn them on. Then I will be able to post some nice pics of the tank.

 

[Tarius]

Great job! Would you happen to have any additional info on your DIY Rollermat & ATS like the STL files and part list?

 

[Bill Amaro]

Great job! Would you happen to have any additional info on your DIY Rollermat & ATS like the STL files and part list?

Sorry for the delay in answering... I use the non-commercial version of Fusion 360, so I don't believe I can share the STL files of the objects I have created. Happy to answer any particular questions you have on the devices I have designed...

 

[Bill Amaro]

Thought I would post a few tank pics of where I am today (150 Gal DT with a 40 Gal Sump)

In the process of building a new "All In One" Biopellet, ATS, Media holder, Media Reactor device. Will post it once I am a little further along.