Need help fast...

[CCauthers]

I have a WD that has been growing and coloring very well for the past few months that has been losing pe for the past 2-3 days. I decided to take a look at it today, and noticed some very worrying tissue loss. The skeleton is bright white in person, just not quite captured well with the camera. Its in around 400-450 par, in moderate flow, no changes in a few weeks in position. There are several other larger colonies doing very well, along with some frags that are growing, mixed reef tank. Nothing else is having any issues. Params have been stable and go as follows:
Salinity: 35.0 ppt with refracto and hanna probe
Temp: 77-78
Alk: 8.8-9.2, hanna checker
Ca: 465, red sea
Mg: 1420, red sea
Nitrate: 1.5, red sea
Phosphate .08-.1, red sea
Fish are tomini tang, naso tang, unicron tang, sailfin tang, sixline, algae blenny, 5 occellaris clowns, 1 tomato clown. Inverts are some turbos and conches, tank is a 260g with 90g sump. Lights are radion g4 pros, run full spectrum with blue in the mornings and evenings.

The tissue loss wraps around in between the branches. The second picture is how the light hits it. Looking for any causes, as well as some solutions. I'm at a loss, because all other sticks are thriving, and this one was as well until a few days ago. One suggestion I have gotten is a possible gorilla crab invader that I will be looking for tonight. Thank you!

 

[jda]

That looks like physical damage from a fish, invert or something of the like... This is a total guess, since this kind of thing is 90% guesswork.

Does this happen to be where the light does not hit the coral from a point-source lighting?

 

[CCauthers]

That looks like physical damage from a fish, invert or something of the like... This is a total guess, since this kind of thing is 90% guesswork.

Does this happen to be where the light does not hit the coral from a point-source lighting?

These sections are shaded, that's why I tried to include a picture of about how the light usually hits it.

 

[jda]

I do not know if that is what caused it, but a reason why people don't use puck-style LEDs alone as corals start to move away from frags into colonies, or the double and triple up on manufacturer recommended number of pucks. If this is what did it, it is just going to happen more and more... might want to look at some T5s in your future, or more pucks (this is why people often use 2-3 xr30s over each 24x24 or 27x27 area with actual acropora colonies).

Again, I have no idea if this is it, or not... usually shadowing death is more widespread than this, but maybe it is just the beginning and you found it early?

...all guesses.

 

[jda]

Oh, get ready for the "your N and P are too low" people to post. I would ignore them, but you can do what you want... it isn't like your other stuff is suffering or that stuff not in the shadows is hurting at all.

 

[fishguy242]

hi,dip and observe..at this point,#'s look good

 

[Sabellafella]

Do you have a bandsaw? Randomly once in a while ill get some strip spots like that, and it'll usually heal up and go away. If you seen declined PE it might be on its way out. If it gets progressively worse in a super short amount of time, cut into flesh and remount.

Unless your seeing these issues with other pieces, I wouldn't take hard-core action with your system. Although it doesn't hurt to narrow down an issue. And troubleshoot from there.

 

[vetteguy53081]

White is good, green is not as it has lost zooanthele
Mag is a little high and phosphate is getting there

You want without chasing numbers:
Mag 1300
ca. 450
Alk. 8-9
Salinity 1.025
Temperature. 77-79
Pho’s .04
Nitrate .03
Ph. 8.1 - 8.3

Any change in lighting or flow?
Perhaps a second opinion would be warranted with a water sample to a trusted LFS and have them check water for you and verify your readings

 

[CCauthers]

I do not know if that is what caused it, but a reason why people don't use puck-style LEDs alone as corals start to move away from frags into colonies, or the double and triple up on manufacturer recommended number of pucks. If this is what did it, it is just going to happen more and more... might want to look at some T5s in your future, or more pucks (this is why people often use 2-3 xr30s over each 24x24 or 27x27 area with actual acropora colonies).

Again, I have no idea if this is it, or not... usually shadowing death is more widespread than this, but maybe it is just the beginning and you found it early?

...all guesses.

Do you think that this would heal if I was able to get these sections lit better?

Do you have a bandsaw? Randomly once in a while ill get some strip spots like that, and it'll usually heal up and go away. If you seen declined PE it might be on its way out. If it gets progressively worse in a super short amount of time, cut into flesh and remount.

Unless your seeing these issues with other pieces, I wouldn't take hard-core action with your system. Although it doesn't hurt to narrow down an issue. And troubleshoot from there.

I do see quite declined pe, I dont have a band saw but I should be able to cut them with bone cutters if it comes to that. Everything else is doing well, so I'm not going to be taking any drastic measures related to the system as a whole.

White is good, green is not as it has lost zooanthele
Mag is a little high and phosphate is getting there

You want without chasing numbers:
Mag 1300
ca. 450
Alk. 8-9
Salinity 1.025
Temperature. 77-79
Pho’s .04
Nitrate .03
Ph. 8.1 - 8.3

Any change in lighting or flow?
Perhaps a second opinion would be warranted with a water sample to a trusted LFS and have them check water for you and verify your readings

There was a change in flow and a slight increase in par when I mounted it a few weeks ago, but nothing else. I actually have two sets of kits, all because of various reasons, and have checked with both, and sadly don't really have an LFS I'd trust with the tank short of driving 2-3 hours to @Sabellafella

As a question to all, at what point to I cut my losses and slice it up?

 

[jda]

I have seen corals like this heal. If it is healthy, it can come out of it. If it is a shadowing problem, then you need to fix that first.

 

[CCauthers]

I have seen corals like this heal. If it is healthy, it can come out of it. If it is a shadowing problem, then you need to fix that first.

That's good to hear. This may seem like a dumb question, but I'll ask it anyways: How could there be shading with a relatively high light intensity (400-450 par)? Wouldn't these to ideas be contradictory?

 

[fishguy242]

Do you think that this would heal if I was able to get these sections lit better?

I do see quite declined pe, I dont have a band saw but I should be able to cut them with bone cutters if it comes to that. Everything else is doing well, so I'm not going to be taking any drastic measures related to the system as a whole.


There was a change in flow and a slight increase in par when I mounted it a few weeks ago, but nothing else. I actually have two sets of kits, all because of various reasons, and have checked with both, and sadly don't really have an LFS I'd trust with the tank short of driving 2-3 hours to @Sabellafella

As a question to all, at what point to I cut my losses and slice it up?

if continues to recede,slice and dice,cut slightly into live ,staying away from dead

 

[jda]

That's good to hear. This may seem like a dumb question, but I'll ask it anyways: How could there be shading with a relatively high light intensity (400-450 par)? Wouldn't these to ideas be contradictory?

1000w light can still make a dog shadow puppet on the wall with your hand if it only comes from a single point.

 

[CCauthers]

1000w light can still make a dog shadow puppet on the wall with your hand if it only comes from a single point.

Fair point, I guess I figured that there would be enough bending and reflection of the light in the tank to alleviate this.
I have rotated it so that this section is getting more light, we'll see it goes. What would an expected timeline be if this was the issue, and my solution is enough, in terms of how long it will likely take to heal or stop receding?

 

[Sabellafella]

Do you think that this would heal if I was able to get these sections lit better?

I do see quite declined pe, I dont have a band saw but I should be able to cut them with bone cutters if it comes to that. Everything else is doing well, so I'm not going to be taking any drastic measures related to the system as a whole.


There was a change in flow and a slight increase in par when I mounted it a few weeks ago, but nothing else. I actually have two sets of kits, all because of various reasons, and have checked with both, and sadly don't really have an LFS I'd trust with the tank short of driving 2-3 hours to @Sabellafella

As a question to all, at what point to I cut my losses and slice it up?

If you continue to see skin flopping off cut it. Honestly the colony skin looks healthy to me, its not sucked in or wrinkly.

I'll have euphyllia drop polyps and slap up my acros from time to time usually is the reason why it happens with me. Otherwise a strip spot in the middle of the colony is not a good sign. You can try to narrow down what the issue would be but for now cutting it is your best option if it continues to get worse.

There was plenty of times I seen trauma like that resolve so, more so it had gotten better instead of got worse.

 

[jda]

There is no way to know a timeline. Stopping the recession is good. Having the rest of the coral look great is even better. Even if it does nothing for a while, that is still good. You should see some healing in time.

 

[CCauthers]

If you continue to see skin flopping off cut it. Honestly the colony skin looks healthy to me, its not sucked in or wrinkly.

I'll have euphyllia drop polyps and slap up my acros from time to time usually is the reason why it happens with me. Otherwise a strip spot in the middle of the colony is not a good sign. You can try to narrow down what the issue would be but for now cutting it is your best option if it continues to get worse.

There was plenty of times I seen trauma like that resolve so, more so it had gotten better instead of got worse.

How exactly would you describe the skin looking wrinkly?

There is no way to know a timeline. Stopping the recession is good. Having the rest of the coral look great is even better. Even if it does nothing for a while, that is still good. You should see some healing in time.

Sounds good. Well see whether giving this section more light is able to stop the recession.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Do you think that this would heal if I was able to get these sections lit better?

I do see quite declined pe, I dont have a band saw but I should be able to cut them with bone cutters if it comes to that. Everything else is doing well, so I'm not going to be taking any drastic measures related to the system as a whole.


There was a change in flow and a slight increase in par when I mounted it a few weeks ago, but nothing else. I actually have two sets of kits, all because of various reasons, and have checked with both, and sadly don't really have an LFS I'd trust with the tank short of driving 2-3 hours to @Sabellafella

As a question to all, at what point to I cut my losses and slice it up?

If it continues to lose ANY more tissue

 

[schuby]

Can you correct this timeline, if it of incorrect?

1. Frag was growing well, with good color and PE
2. Mounted frag in a new location: change in flow and PAR
3. Frag immediately displayed poor PE
4. A few weeks later, noticed tissue-loss in shaded area of frag

I propose that the frag is still adjusting to its new location. Tissue loss where the sun don't shine is not unusual, IME.

 

[CCauthers]

Can you correct this timeline, if it of incorrect?

1. Frag was growing well, with good color and PE
2. Mounted frag in a new location: change in flow and PAR
3. Frag immediately displayed poor PE
4. A few weeks later, noticed tissue-loss in shaded area of frag

I propose that the frag is still adjusting to its new location. Tissue loss where the sun don't shine is not unusual, IME.

Close, but the frag looked great for a few weeks and then displayed decreased pe and shortly after, tissue loss in shaded area