Need help w/Diagnosis - newcomers all died

[reefm]

Hello everyone, I just lost all 3 new additions to my reefer 350 and frankly I'm at a loss as to why this happened, any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

I have a reefer 350 that acts as my "small" fish tank, anything that gets too large gets moved to my 180. The 350 was established 3-4 months ago with fish, LR and a handful of corals that came from my old 46g. All these fish (clowns, wrasse, chromis etc). are healthy and show no sign of decease.

I added a Powder Brown Tang, a Kole Tang and a dottyback, all 3 died within 2 weeks. No signs of ich/velvet, no signs of aggression, they were all eating Nori/LRS/frozen food w/Selcon until they just started to fade away. Slight signs of fin rot on the PBT, kole tang acting lethargic, with a few days of hiding/no feeding before they're discovered dead in the morning. They were initially drip acclimated and moved to DT (no meds/QT out of commission sadly).

Params are stable (SG: 35ppt, no detectable ammonia/nitrites/nitrates, Alk 9.2, Ca 420, Mg 1430, 78.5F, 8.40pH - Salifert/RedSea kits), RODI water w/10% monthly changes. RoX/GFO reactor & skimmer.

It drives me nuts not knowing why this happened. I could attribute it to a bad shipment but I've had really good luck with LA orders over the years.

Any ideas as to anything else I should checking for in the DT? I'm at a loss as to next steps, I don't want to add anything else (even w/QT) if there's something going on in the DT. In the meantime all existing fish are doing fine...

 

[TheRealDmorty217]

tattered fins, lethargic, not eating all point to disease, I would suspect velvet since all 3 died from it within 2 weeks. Did you notice heavy breathing, erratic swimming, or flashing? I would not be adding anything to the DT again until after a minimum of 6 weeks to let the what I suspect was velvet die off

 

[Humblefish]

Velvet is possible and if so, your existing fish should start succumbing soon. Another possibility is gill flukes, as those usually remain unseen in the gills and even if they do crawl over the body will appear translucent. What I would do in your shoes is catch one of your fish (maybe the clown or chromis?), and check for flukes via a FW dip (see below).

Freshwater Dip: Provides temporary relief for Brooklynella, Flukes, Marine Velvet disease (Amyloodinium); possibly even Ich & Uronema marinum (both unproven). Can be used to confirm the presence of Flukes.

How To Treat - Fill a bucket with RODI water, and use a heater to match the temperature to the water the fish is coming from. Aerate the water heavily for at least 30 minutes prior to doing the dip, then discontinue aeration while performing the dip. Fish aren’t overly pH sensitive for short durations like this, but you can squirt a little tank water into the dip just before the fish goes in to help bring it up.

Place the fish in the freshwater (FW) dip and observe closely. It is not unusual for them to freak out a little at first. Also, tangs are notorious for “playing dead” during a FW dip. The important thing is to watch their gills; they should be breathing heavily at all times during the dip. If breathing slows, it’s time to exit the dip. Dip the fish for no longer than 5 minutes. Multiple dips may be done, but it’s important to give your fish a day to recuperate in-between dips.

For flukes, use a dark (preferably black) bucket so you can see if tiny white worms fall out of the fish (especially out of the gills) at around the 3-4 minute mark. The worms will settle to the bottom, so you can use a flashlight to look for them there as well.

Pros - Provides temporary relief for a wide range of diseases in a chemical free environment. Can “buy you more time” until a proper treatment can be done.

Cons/Side Effects - Not a permanent “fix” for any disease, as FW dips are not potent enough to eradicate all of the parasites/worms afflicting the fish. Some fish can have an adverse reaction to a FW dip by appearing unable to maintain their equilibrium once returned to the aquarium. If this happens, hold the fish upright (using latex, nitrile or rubber gloves), and gently glide him through the water (to get saltwater flowing through the gills again). It is also a good idea to place the fish in an acclimation box until he appears “normal”.

 

[reefm]

thanks guys, the kole tang was definitely flashing, the other 2 were not. I should have mentioned that. Wouldn't velvet be visible though?

I'll prepare the QT for my current crew, and will try the FW dip on one of the clowns and report back. thanks again!

 

[TheRealDmorty217]

Both times I have dealt with velvet there was nothing on the skin. If you see spots with velvet it's likely already too late even with meds on hand. My fish suddenly stopped eating after exactly 7 days and started hiding, breathing heavy, erratic swimming and flashing. I treated with CP at first signs but for ich, not velvet. 3 days later all 3 angels were dead. I since have started formalin dipping all new arrivals to help ensure velvet isn't brought into the QT.

 

[Humblefish]

Both times I have dealt with velvet there was nothing on the skin. If you see spots with velvet it's likely already too late even with meds on hand. My fish suddenly stopped eating after exactly 7 days and started hiding, breathing heavy, erratic swimming and flashing. I treated with CP at first signs but for ich, not velvet. 3 days later all 3 angels were dead. I since have started formalin dipping all new arrivals to help ensure velvet isn't brought into the QT.

+1 Sometimes velvet dinospores invade the gills, and the fish dies due to asphyxiation before visible physical symptoms ever manifest. It truly is a devastating disease and the #1 reason to always QT.

 

[reefm]

ok, so I caught the 2 clowns and FW dipped them in a black bucket. I saw no white worms at the bottom or detaching from the fish. I also setup my QT and moved the clowns there, catching the cleaner wrasse and the 3 chromis is...going to be a big project tomorrow evening. They are freaking fast!

Looking through the symptoms in Humblefish's velvet post, I noticed the comment about swimming in front of a powerhead, the PBT was doing that a lot so I'll start treating all of them for velvet. Ruby Reef Rally arriving tomorrow, that's the fastest I could get it. So far everyone's looking and acting ok.

 

[Humblefish]

ok, so I caught the 2 clowns and FW dipped them in a black bucket. I saw no white worms at the bottom or detaching from the fish. I also setup my QT and moved the clowns there, catching the cleaner wrasse and the 3 chromis is...going to be a big project tomorrow evening. They are freaking fast!

Looking through the symptoms in Humblefish's velvet post, I noticed the comment about swimming in front of a powerhead, the PBT was doing that a lot so I'll start treating all of them for velvet. Ruby Reef Rally arriving tomorrow, that's the fastest I could get it. So far everyone's looking and acting ok.

Good luck. If velvet is in your system, you need to move fast to save the lives of your other fish.

 

[reefm]

A quick update. Day 14 of QT, after initial FW and Ruby reef rally dips, and everyone is doing well all things considered. cupramine messed up the feeding schedule for a few days but we're back to normal now.

It still bugs me that I have no idea which specific decease I'm (was) up against. Based on what I'm reading, if it was velvet, the remaining fish would not have fared that well. Doesn't look like ich either, not bacterial, so...flukes? Either way, I'll leave the DT fishless as if this were ich and keep treating for everything in the QT.