Neptune APEX Reliability (Shocking in my experience!)

[Brew12]

@Brew12

Was this something confirmed by GHL or mentioned in the literature?

I didn't look what their recommendations are. I've used enough of them professionally, of many different brands, to know the requirements. You need that length to get nice laminar flow through the pipe or the vortex meters don't read correctly.

 

[homer1475]

Please if your going to have a conversation keep it honest.
Before Aquatronica Pulled out of the USA market in 2018 the Base Unit was $650 and NOT $990.
That included the Controller with built in 7" color touch screen along with an 8 plug power bar with it's own built in CPU and Memory that has 8 USB expansion ports and two float or level ports. It also comes with a Ph Module and Ph Probe along with Temp and a level sensor.

The Deluxe unit was $795 and came with:
Base unit with 7" color touch display.
1x 8 port Intelligent Powerbar.
1x pH module and Probe
1x Salinity Module and Probe
1x ORP Module and Probe
1x Temp Probe
1x Level Sensor

The equivalent Apex system is $799.95 on BRS and has no color touch Screen.



Nope I have about nine interfaces on my system and only one of them has failed in 15 years. Sorry but this thing of equipment failure that you have gotten so use to is a rarity on many of the other systems. Those module Interfaces are a nice part of the system because they are cheap, like typically $65 for an interface. If one does go you don't lose a whole section of your system you just replace that module. Also because they are like USB devices they are never antiquated. Most of my module were bought in 2004 and I have since upgraded my Head unit from the old tiny one with low res LCD displays made back in 2004 to the much more powerful Touch Controller in 2015. It was just a single USB cable change over and the new head unit Auto detected all my old modules, dosing pump and SMS equipment etc and was ready to be programmed.

No idea where you got your figures from, but mine was direct form the aquatronica site. I just went back, and realized it was in Euros, not dollars. Even still at USD price thats 1,200$. Now whos being honest? All you get extra is a touch screen that you do not get with the apex.
http://shop.aquatronica.com/epages/...bjectPath=/Shops/150247/Products/ACQKIT140-DL

Honestly, I had never heard of this before. Now that I have you have piqued my interest.

 

[robbyg]

No idea where you got your figures from, but mine was direct form the aquatronica site. I just went back, and realized it was in Euros, not dollars. Even still at USD price thats 1,200$. Now whos being honest? All you get extra is a touch screen that you do not get with the apex.
http://shop.aquatronica.com/epages/150247.sf/en_GB/?ViewObjectPath=/Shops/150247/Products/ACQKIT140-DL

Honestly, I had never heard of this before. Now that I have you have piqued my interest.

You are uninformed so let me correct you. The EU price has nothing to do with the US Price. Everything in Europe is much more expensive than in the USA because of the high taxes.
When items are exported I don't think they get taxed so the price drops by a lot.

Here is a picture of USA Website in late 2018 before they stopped selling it directly in the USA.

And it is not just some external 7" LCD screen, it is built into the controller and it comes with a Salinity probe and Temp probe that actually work properly.

 

[BZOFIQ]

I didn't look what their recommendations are. I've used enough of them professionally, of many different brands, to know the requirements. You need that length to get nice laminar flow through the pipe or the vortex meters don't read correctly.

Got it - will take that into consideration when putting together the new plumbing.

 

[Brew12]

Got it - will take that into consideration when putting together the new plumbing.

This is from an engineering site.

"The vortex meter requires a well-developed and symmetrical flow velocity profile, free from any distortions or swirls. This necessitates the use of relatively long straight piping upstream and downstream from the meter to condition the flow. Swirl meters, which are similar to vortex meters, contain flow-straightening elements, thus requiring less straight pipe.

The straight length of pipe for the vortex meter must be the same size as the meter and its length should be about the same as required for an orifice installation with a beta ratio of 0.7. Most vortex flowmeter manufacturers recommend a minimum length of 30 pipe diameters downstream of control valves, and three-to-four pipe diameters between the meter and downstream pressure taps. Temperature elements should be small and located five-to-six pipe-diameter lengths downstream."

The first 10 or so pipe diameters get's you very close and the last 20 pipe diameters that are normally recommended only give you around an additional 1% of accuracy. We normally go 10 to 15 pipe diameters when using them in our industrial applications.

 

[BZOFIQ]

You are uninformed so let me correct you. The EU price has nothing to do with the US Price. Everything in Europe is much more expensive than in the USA because of the high taxes.

Yes, prices in EU zone have a built in VAT (TAX) that can exceed 25%

 

[BZOFIQ]

This is from an engineering site.

"The vortex meter requires a well-developed and symmetrical flow velocity profile, free from any distortions or swirls. This necessitates the use of relatively long straight piping upstream and downstream from the meter to condition the flow. Swirl meters, which are similar to vortex meters, contain flow-straightening elements, thus requiring less straight pipe.

The straight length of pipe for the vortex meter must be the same size as the meter and its length should be about the same as required for an orifice installation with a beta ratio of 0.7. Most vortex flowmeter manufacturers recommend a minimum length of 30 pipe diameters downstream of control valves, and three-to-four pipe diameters between the meter and downstream pressure taps. Temperature elements should be small and located five-to-six pipe-diameter lengths downstream."

The first 10 or so pipe diameters get's you very close and the last 20 pipe diameters that are normally recommended only give you around an additional 1% of accuracy. We normally go 10 to 15 pipe diameters when using them in our industrial applications.

Great, live and learn.

 

[BZOFIQ]

I'll point you back to post 374, I provided a screenshot already.

Time zone is set correctly. Double clock persists.

Situation resolved itself, single clock today.

 

[LadyTang2]

Has anyone specifically experienced a neptune dos fail on or off?

 

[Tuffloud1]

In all honesty, I credit the Neptune Apex to be one of the reasons I have been able to be successful in this hobby.

My Apex Classic has been running flawlessly for 6 years straight - no problems whatsoever. It saved me on a dozen occasions from leaks, malfunctions of other equipment, etc.

My DOS has been running my auto water change for 4 years with absolutely no issues.

I am shocked to hear of the issues in this thread. Are those of you who are having issues using the 2016 Apex?

 

[vetteguy53081]

In all honesty, I credit the Neptune Apex to be one of the reasons I have been able to be successful in this hobby.

My Apex Classic has been running flawlessly for 6 years straight - no problems whatsoever. It saved me on a dozen occasions from leaks, malfunctions of other equipment, etc.

My DOS has been running my auto water change for 4 years with absolutely no issues.

I am shocked to hear of the issues in this thread. Are those of you who are having issues using the 2016 Apex?

I have had Apex 2016 since its' release and problem free. I have a classic on a different tank and other than internet connectivity at times- also problem free

 

[Bob Escher]

In all honesty, I credit the Neptune Apex to be one of the reasons I have been able to be successful in this hobby.

My Apex Classic has been running flawlessly for 6 years straight - no problems whatsoever. It saved me on a dozen occasions from leaks, malfunctions of other equipment, etc.

My DOS has been running my auto water change for 4 years with absolutely no issues.

I am shocked to hear of the issues in this thread. Are those of you who are having issues using the 2016 Apex?

 

[Crabby48]

I've got the DOS as well, and the ease of running it all through fusion works great for me

Time for trident lol

 

[Bob Escher]

I Agree I have two DOS, and almost a full setup APEX, I don’t have the WAV’s
I have had the system since 2014 and have had the 2016 model since early 2017. I had two issues both with the display both my fault, both fixed promptly by support. Other than that the whole system has performed flawlessly.
it has saved me several times from water all over my floors ( my wife’s would have killed me ( plus the downstairs neighbor in my condo)
i love it

 

[Jeff Jarry reef]

My 2016 apex has been great and the Trident ....atk.,...Dos all of it no problems.

 

[robbyg]

This is from an engineering site.

"The vortex meter requires a well-developed and symmetrical flow velocity profile, free from any distortions or swirls. This necessitates the use of relatively long straight piping upstream and downstream from the meter to condition the flow. Swirl meters, which are similar to vortex meters, contain flow-straightening elements, thus requiring less straight pipe.

The straight length of pipe for the vortex meter must be the same size as the meter and its length should be about the same as required for an orifice installation with a beta ratio of 0.7. Most vortex flowmeter manufacturers recommend a minimum length of 30 pipe diameters downstream of control valves, and three-to-four pipe diameters between the meter and downstream pressure taps. Temperature elements should be small and located five-to-six pipe-diameter lengths downstream."

The first 10 or so pipe diameters get's you very close and the last 20 pipe diameters that are normally recommended only give you around an additional 1% of accuracy. We normally go 10 to 15 pipe diameters when using them in our industrial applications.

That’s very good info but I wonder how much accuracy is lost if those guidelines are not followed at all?

Mine is about 3 diameters distant on the inlet and about 15 on the outlet. The flow reads about 1150 GPH on the Aquatronica and I manually measured it with a gallon jug at about 1080. I then went into calibration mode and set it to 1080 and proceeded to cut down the flow via the return valve to 750 GPH which is what my Klr-DI4 can handle. I tested it again and it was very close, I believe 735 GPH. It seems like the readings are now well within accepted accuracy:

 

[Justanano]

I have a 2016 apex.. just about every bell and whistle I could get 3 power bars,wave makers,probes, feeder, pump,water level switches and at points I do love it but the only parts that fail for me are the expensive ones....dose broke 2x would have been cheaper to buy another one.. both wave makers failed... I would like to say the company did something besides say huh that almost never happens you must have just got a ad couple pieces but I cant...it seems like it's a 3 year limit until things start failing big time for me...pretty disappointed in the system in that aspect

 

[Radman73]

I've been using an Apex for over 9 years now. Started with a Jr on my 32gal Biocube. A couple of years later a reef club buddy was selling off his spare Apex(now classic) control unit because he'd never needed to use it. That thing ran flawlessly for me for the last 7 years. I just took it down because the 60 cube it was running sprung a leak. My 2016 Apex has run flawlessly for the last 2 years.

The Apex, and its associated alerts, has saved each of my tanks at least once from either an equipment failure or my own laziness/stupidity. I wouldn't run a tank without one personally.

Perhaps other controllers are better or more cost effective, but Neptune hasn't given me a reason to look anywhere else. I just put myself on a LFS waiting list for the Trident. They said it should be about a month, two at most. I'm looking forward to adding it to my Apex environment.

Oh, my DOS has been rock solid as well for years. used it originally for AWC on my 60 cube and now for 2-part dosing on my 220. It still calibrates and keeps calibration even though I've never replaced the heads.

I expect one of my Apex units to fail, eventually. But Neptune has made me a happy customer so far.

 

[sarcophytonIndy]

In all honesty, I credit the Neptune Apex to be one of the reasons I have been able to be successful in this hobby.

My Apex Classic has been running flawlessly for 6 years straight - no problems whatsoever. It saved me on a dozen occasions from leaks, malfunctions of other equipment, etc.

My DOS has been running my auto water change for 4 years with absolutely no issues.

I am shocked to hear of the issues in this thread. Are those of you who are having issues using the 2016 Apex?

I agree completely, my Apex Classic has been perfect, and the alerting has saved my reef on several occasions

 

[Zos4me]

Mine is less than 6 a months old and having issues right now.has disconnected from fusion 12 times in last 24 hours and last night while I was sitting there it totally shut down and restarted all by itself shutting all the pumps and stuff down. Not sure if its the head unit for the bar