New 117g, Step Aquarium, Idea

[needbiggertanks]

It would be a great idea, but I agree about the double drop off being a little bit sketchy. Maybe there is a structural engineer on here who works with materials and load testing with some insight?

Per the tidal coral suggestion. I cant remember what video it is, but when im at work i listen to reefing youtube videos and someone referenced someone elses tank that did this. They had the return pumps shut off twice a day which lowered the DT some into the sump. He mentioned how the coral adapted to this (out of water, and high light). I consider it a great idea, and very feasible. I usually only listen to longer videos but will see if i come across it again.

 

[zcedric]

The tolerances on a double drop off is a nightmare as everything moves and bends. A single drop off tank can handle this with some foam. This is not the case with a double drop off. You can build this tank from acrylic but would do it out of ridiculously thick stuff. My original plan on my old tank was a double drop off. After looking into it and talking to cyro it was a no go . The overall idea is cool but the size of this tank makes the build not impossible but a pain.

If it was my tank I would make it out of 1" acrylic...

If you go glass you will need quite a bit more euro bracing on all the bottom edges but even then I would not put this tank in my house. Just my 2 cents..

I am not sure why something should move or bend?
I probably will constract the stand around the tank so that the stand itselve is a bracing on the bottom.

I understand your fear of breaking or leaking.

 

[zcedric]

It would be a great idea, but I agree about the double drop off being a little bit sketchy. Maybe there is a structural engineer on here who works with materials and load testing with some insight?

Per the tidal coral suggestion. I cant remember what video it is, but when im at work i listen to reefing youtube videos and someone referenced someone elses tank that did this. They had the return pumps shut off twice a day which lowered the DT some into the sump. He mentioned how the coral adapted to this (out of water, and high light). I consider it a great idea, and very feasible. I usually only listen to longer videos but will see if i come across it again.

I look into this. It is a great idea.

ok, haha

 

[Elder1945 Verified Sponsor]

I am not sure why something should move or bend?
I probably will constract the stand around the tank so that the stand itselve is a bracing on the bottom.

I understand your fear of breaking or leaking.

Things move and bend when you place 1000 lbs + on them.. Also I am not in fear of breaking or leaking its going in your house . You are just not the first to try this design nor fail at it.

 

[ludnix]

I would consider making the stand out of square tube steel if you do the double drop off. Like Elder1945 said, you have very little room for movement without it resulting in disaster. Wood movement from seasonal changes and swelling can impart a huge amount of force and even thousands of pounds of weight doesn't necessarily stop it. I think the tank idea is great and with careful planning can be a real novel beauty.

 

[zcedric]

I would consider making the stand out of square tube steel if you do the double drop off. Like Elder1945 said, you have very little room for movement without it resulting in disaster. Wood movement from seasonal changes and swelling can impart a huge amount of force and even thousands of pounds of weight doesn't necessarily stop it. I think the tank idea is great and with careful planning can be a real novel beauty.

Yes i am going with a metal frame and wood will be the beauty maker. I may decide to use white polished plastic instead wood.

I will start drawing some stuff for a stand tonight. I am not in a hurry. So as more tips I get from you guys as more it will be planned out.

 

[MartinWaite]

Personally I'd like to see the glass a bit thicker than the 0.5" you're planning plus I would use braces around the base to help with the silicon contact point and also help strengthen the base. Or you could double base it. A lot of homemade glass tanks we see in the U.K. are like one of the above at your planned depth.

 

[zcedric]

Personally I'd like to see the glass a bit thicker than the 0.5" you're planning plus I would use braces around the base to help with the silicon contact point and also help strengthen the base. Or you could double base it. A lot of homemade glass tanks we see in the U.K. are like one of the above at your planned depth.

hmm okay. thanks for the input.

 

[AlexG]

I think there are some valid points here on the expansion and contraction of the tank and stand. I think there are some options though that could be implemented to overcome the issues of a double drop off tank. One you could build a square tank with a flat bottom on top of foam with euro & cross braces. Install some drop off pieces in the tank to create the drop off effect but allow water flow through the entire tank. Think of the lower part as a refuge built into the display. It could be skinned over with removable stands panels so only the drop off portion of the tank is normally visible. The other issue I see with cutting glass with a double drop off is the stress that will be put on the front and back of the tank which might create some weak points on the inside corners of the drop off front and back panels that might create a situation where cracking is possible. The use of a modified square tank will eliminate the issue of uneven weight distribution, provide more water volume, and eliminate the issue of expansion and contraction between a double drop off tank & stand setup. The thicker the glass you can get the better. There are some glass thickness calculators out there that will provide you with a safety factor on the tank or you can lookup manufacture tanks of a similar size with height being one of the most important factors with glass thickness.

 

[Rip Van Winkle]

So do you mean like a moon cycle? That the water drops automatically ones a day to a certain level?
I am not sure for what this will be good? I guess coral will not like air?

I couldn't find lots of information about this. Do you have an example?

I've been to Okinawa and have seen tidal pools with coral exposed to fairly hot sun for hours on end until the tide comes in again. I've seen that in Indonesia and here in the Philippines also. I was in Calatagan a few days ago and saw many SPS exposed at low tide. So yes, it does take place in nature.
It would be a pretty cool idea for a reef tank, let alone a drop-off tank at that but my humble opinion would be don't do it. Why not? You're just giving yourself a whole lot of trouble for nothing. When it happens naturally the corals are in that environment from the time they're zooplankton and land on solid ground. So they acclimate to the (I'd say rather harsh) environment. The corals struggle to survive because they can't get up and move to deeper water. I'm sure the same corals do much better when constantly submerged. I really don't see this happening in an artificial environment like a home reef system. You'd have to get your corals to spawn sexually or grow from tiny frags and know exactly how to elevate your lights and gradually lower them (to get them to acclimate) as well as know precisely how long to leave them exposed and at what temperature, doing it gradually longer and longer until you're at the 12 hour point. I don't even want to get into typing all the environmental variables that I'm thinking about right now but I think you can see what I'm getting at.
If you're saying you're thinking of draining your tank until the top six inches of your rock is exposed for like, I don't know 5 to 10 mins or something like that and then having it fill up again slowly every two hours or so, maybe that's doable (without damaging your corals) but why?? I don't see the purpose of that.
I think you have your hands full with a DIY double drop-off tank of that size already without the added difficulty of pondering creating a tide-pool reef system.

My two cents on the double drop off tank would be to do it at a smaller scale first. Like maybe 1/3 to 1/4 of the size you're thinking about right now and then see how that turns out before going big with all your eggs in one basket so to speak. I voted no for this project. Not because I wouldn't love to see it done. I actually would. I just think you'll run into some problems going forward that you don't foresee right now. I think you will need some kind of special bracing on the sides like a double wall. Maybe even triple thickness bracing for the bottom corners. I don't see this doable at this size (and weight) with the way you plan to do it now but Godspeed and more power to you, Brother. Not trying to bust your bubble or poop the party.
I also started a thread on DIY stand construction a few days ago. Maybe the CAD software will help you with your stand (regardless of material you decide to use)
http://www.maytec.de/index.php?id=21

I think it's awesome of you to take on a project like this. I'd say don't charge blindly ahead, be practical about your plan.
BTW: beautiful drafting. Very nice.

 

[zcedric]

I think there are some valid points here on the expansion and contraction of the tank and stand. I think there are some options though that could be implemented to overcome the issues of a double drop off tank. One you could build a square tank with a flat bottom on top of foam with euro & cross braces. Install some drop off pieces in the tank to create the drop off effect but allow water flow through the entire tank. Think of the lower part as a refuge built into the display. It could be skinned over with removable stands panels so only the drop off portion of the tank is normally visible. The other issue I see with cutting glass with a double drop off is the stress that will be put on the front and back of the tank which might create some weak points on the inside corners of the drop off front and back panels that might create a situation where cracking is possible. The use of a modified square tank will eliminate the issue of uneven weight distribution, provide more water volume, and eliminate the issue of expansion and contraction between a double drop off tank & stand setup. The thicker the glass you can get the better. There are some glass thickness calculators out there that will provide you with a safety factor on the tank or you can lookup manufacture tanks of a similar size with height being one of the most important factors with glass thickness.

That is actually a really good input. I did not think on making a tank square and build a drop off into it. It will be hard to clean under it.. hmm I will find out on that. Thank you
For 27 Inch of deth (1 inch is spare)..it will be 1/2 inch needed . The glass will be all tempered, because my glass manufacture said this to me.. "that it should be tempered because of this week points."

 

[zcedric]

I've been to Okinawa and have seen tidal pools with coral exposed to fairly hot sun for hours on end until the tide comes in again. I've seen that in Indonesia and here in the Philippines also. I was in Calatagan a few days ago and saw many SPS exposed at low tide. So yes, it does take place in nature.
It would be a pretty cool idea for a reef tank, let alone a drop-off tank at that but my humble opinion would be don't do it. Why not? You're just giving yourself a whole lot of trouble for nothing. When it happens naturally the corals are in that environment from the time they're zooplankton and land on solid ground. So they acclimate to the (I'd say rather harsh) environment. The corals struggle to survive because they can't get up and move to deeper water. I'm sure the same corals do much better when constantly submerged. I really don't see this happening in an artificial environment like a home reef system. You'd have to get your corals to spawn sexually or grow from tiny frags and know exactly how to elevate your lights and gradually lower them (to get them to acclimate) as well as know precisely how long to leave them exposed and at what temperature, doing it gradually longer and longer until you're at the 12 hour point. I don't even want to get into typing all the environmental variables that I'm thinking about right now but I think you can see what I'm getting at.
If you're saying you're thinking of draining your tank until the top six inches of your rock is exposed for like, I don't know 5 to 10 mins or something like that and then having it fill up again slowly every two hours or so, maybe that's doable (without damaging your corals) but why?? I don't see the purpose of that.
I think you have your hands full with a DIY double drop-off tank of that size already without the added difficulty of pondering creating a tide-pool reef system.

Thank you! I am already at the point, and say no to tide. Just because of place issues as well. I would need a 20-30 gallon tank on the sideto do this. In the other hand.. this will be actually a realy good idea to make water changed automaticly. But no to this!

My two cents on the double drop off tank would be to do it at a smaller scale first. Like maybe 1/3 to 1/4 of the size you're thinking about right now and then see how that turns out before going big with all your eggs in one basket so to speak. I voted no for this project. Not because I wouldn't love to see it done. I actually would. I just think you'll run into some problems going forward that you don't foresee right now. I think you will need some kind of special bracing on the sides like a double wall. Maybe even triple thickness bracing for the bottom corners. I don't see this doable at this size (and weight) with the way you plan to do it now but Godspeed and more power to you, Brother. Not trying to bust your bubble or poop the party.
I also started a thread on DIY stand construction a few days ago. Maybe the CAD software will help you with your stand (regardless of material you decide to use)
http://www.maytec.de/index.php?id=21
I think it's awesome of you to take on a project like this. I'd say don't charge blindly ahead, be practical about your plan.
BTW: beautiful drafting. Very nice.

Thank you! Yes my CAT system helps me a lot. I started with a stand and I probably go with 2 inch hollow steel (square tubes). I will do the steel work all myself at the company with good tools. I will make wood around it so it looks nice and i have some draws in it. I have the idea to make a base of 15-30 inch out of steel and concrete so the tank will stay perfectly leveled and poor of fibrations. I have special level feeds for the stand (We also use them at my company for special machines which need to stay perfectly level.)

sorry for my english

 

[needbiggertanks]

I know its been a while, but i came across this on Pinterest today. Thought id share with you.

 

[zcedric]

I know its been a while, but i came across this on Pinterest today. Thought id share with you.

o really nice.
I worked a little more on this. But i did no have time to do more atm.

Do you know the thickness of the glass on this tank or have any contact informations?
Thank you

 

[Rip Van Winkle]

.....sorry for my english

No sweat. Don't worry about that.
Keep us posted on your progress.

 

[needbiggertanks]

o really nice.
I worked a little more on this. But i did no have time to do more atm.

Do you know the thickness of the glass on this tank or have any contact informations?
Thank you

Im sorry i dont, i just saw that picture on a phone app.

 

[chrissreef]

I'm a tank manufacturer that has made several drop tanks. If you make this out of glass, the glass should be 3/4 or 1" (preferred). Stress/crack points will be at the cutout corners. You need to build this on the actual stand it will rest on. I avoid using foam under the tank as it's inconsistent in compression and will cause further stress on the glass.

Good luck. Am I allowed to say we can build this if you're interested? If not, just delete that last bit =)

 

[zcedric]

I'm a tank manufacturer that has made several drop tanks. If you make this out of glass, the glass should be 3/4 or 1" (preferred). Stress/crack points will be at the cutout corners. You need to build this on the actual stand it will rest on. I avoid using foam under the tank as it's inconsistent in compression and will cause further stress on the glass.

Good luck. Am I allowed to say we can build this if you're interested? If not, just delete that last bit =)

Please pm me with some more information. My glass builder tells me that he can not make this with thicker then 0.5inch.