New Cycled Tank - Dead Fish...Help!

[CanadianReefer]

Hi, I don't see a post where you reply about your nitrate level - and I only see ammonia and nitrite tezt pics. It's important to see nitrate levels of higher than 0... if they aren't, then your tank is not likely cycled. I'm just curious if that question was accidentally missed ?? I'd suggest upgrading you nitrate kit as well - API really only works for higher levels... but eventually you're going to want to dial it down to be able to read lower numbers as well....

 

[Belgian Anthias]

Does someone knows what is in the bottle ? As is claimed the addition seeds rock and speeds up the cycling proccess, able to replace a growing nitrifying biofilm , an aquarium may be cycled within one week. . I am curious to know what is in such a bottle, exactly. And it is correct it is not all about nitrifying bacteria as autothropic nitrifiers need a lot of other bacteria to prosper in there microbial community. When a biofilm is formed and growing part of it will continuously die off and the decaying biomass recycled and remineralized to be reused within the growing community. All bacteria and archaea needed to cycle an aquarium can be found in a growing nitrifying biofilm, including the important and essential sulphur bacteria and heterothropic and autothropic denitrifiers,. To install all bacteria needed oxygen minimum zones ( OMZ) and anoxic zones are needed which are provided within a growing nitrifying biofilm. +- 40% of a growing nitrifying biofilm are bacteria using an anaerobic pathway. (ref: One does not need any "bacteria in a bottle" to install these bacteria as they are present everywhere where organics are present. I am really wondering what those "bacteria in a bottle" may add what is not already there. Certainly because the addition seems to be able to replace a growing nitrifying biofilm as it is claimed an aquarium may be cycled within one week.
Most probably the fish have died because of other reasons of which a temporally low oxygen level due to bacterial growth may not be excluded. This assumes the additions may contain a lot of carbohydrates.

 

[Surfandturf]

A week!?
It is not possible to install a nitrifying carrying capacity in one week! A nitrifying biofilm is a community of all kinds of bacteria which are not provided by supplements. These communities need a lot of time to gather all co-workers needed and for to work together.
A new aquarium needs a lot of nutrients and building materials just to install primary live. In a new lighted aquarium most nutrients will be used for heterothropic growth until the organics are used up and the installation of the photo-autotrops, algae etc. . All this will need a lot of nitrogen and all other elements. The consumption of ammonia does not mean there is a sufficient nitrifying capacity installed! Additives needed to cycle an aquarium may be limited to the mix of food which one is going to use . To provide the building materials to develop a balanced mix of producers, consumers and reducers.
Nitrifiers do not like light. They are big and grow slowly. In a biofilm they are covered by an outer layer of other bacteria to protect them from the light. It takes several weeks before a nitrifying biofilm is installed. This does not mean there is no nitrifying and denitrifying activity possible because a lot of heterotops, which may be present in the water column, are able to perform both tasks aerobically, to some extend.
These heterothrops ( o.a.Acinetobacter sp.) can be provide by bacterial supplements but there contribution to the carrying capacity, the ability of the system to reduce ammonia, by nitrification, is very limited.

There may be a thousand reasons why the fish died and the new tank syndrome may not be one of them. But a new tank is not ready to support live after one week!
It can be done by providing enough carbohydrates to maintain a high C:N ratio, this way eliminating the need for and the installation of a nitrifying carrying capacity. But making the tank dependable of daily supplements is not my choice to make.

My tank is living proof that this statement is factually inaccurate when speaking to cycling a reef tank. I posted pics earlier in the thread of my tank. I used Dr. Tims one and only and the added a fish immediately. As directed by the Dr. Tims one and only directions. If what you say is true for reef tanks, mine and other must be the crown jewels of reefing.

 

[Belgian Anthias]

It is perfectly possible to keep fish or a reef tank without cycling the tank. One may install a heterotrophic carying capacity depending on regular organic carbon suplementation and a basic building material addition. This will also prevent the tank to cycle true all stages. This can be done in a few days just by adding some water from an established aquarium and daily carbohydrate based supplements, some basic modified F2 media and or some protein rich and balanced food. Not difficult at all if one knows what one is doing. One knows exactly what and how much is added to the tank..This is often done for temporary stocking of live stock!! The ammonia reduction will be done by heterotrophic assimilation, the nitrification capacity will be very limited or missing. An on heterotrophic ammonia reduction based carrying capacity is not an installed capacity as it is dependable on human intervention and regular supplementation. The capacity is not constantly present. The carrying capacity is limited to the by supplements supported and maintained growth ( assimilation) rate. For live stock the supplements are based on the daily protein additon. In such systems a high C:N ratio must be maintained. If the heterotrophic growth can not be maintained for some reason ammonia may build up ..
Cycling a tank is installing a carrying capacity mainly based on a nitrifying biofilm wich takes time. Getting the tank true all stages. Autotrophic carrying capacity is for free! Your patience will be rewarded.!
Installing a bio will make the ammonia reduction capacity easily manageable and may support any bio-load, now and in the future, without any regular supplemental costs.
I prefere a reliable and stable environment to keep my crown juwels. I certainly will not use any products of wich I do not know what they contain, exactly, or add such products to the safe keeper of my valuables.

 

[Kal93]

My guess is fish dying from disease. Damsels often get uronema and brook, in addition to possible flukes/ich/velvet. Any photos/outward symptoms?

 

[Belgian Anthias]

Slow ammonia poisoning?! Ammonia may build up in the cells, in holding tanks, during transport, during acclimatisation, pH changes, etc.. Bad ammonia and pH management may add that bit to much!