New Reefer getting everything ready

[glooper]

Hello, I am a new reefer and buying everything that I will need for my new setup. I am using a 40 gallon breeder tank and have talked with my local fish store to get a start but could not remember everything when I went there. I have also been watching the BRS 5 minute beginner guide videos to learn everything that I can. I also decided that I want to do HOB style and not use a sump for complexity/cost reasons.

I was going through the list of things that I need to order while watching all the videos and have a question about the filter.

I remember the shop talking about a canister filter but in the BRS videos it looks like all they are using is a protein skimmer. Do they not use a filter in their setup or is protein skimmer doing the filtration.

Thank you very much and will take any advice that you can give me.

 

[moorjames]

I don't believe canister filters are used much for reef tanks- though I could be wrong. A skimmer is a great mechanical filter and does a good job of removing waste from you tank. You may still need bio filters or something to combat nitrate and phosphate, but there are plenty of ways to design your filter system. Welcome to the hobby!

 

[glooper]

I don't believe canister filters are used much for reef tanks- though I could be wrong. A skimmer is a great mechanical filter and does a good job of removing waste from you tank. You may still need bio filters or something to combat nitrate and phosphate, but there are plenty of ways to design your filter system. Welcome to the hobby!

By bio filters do you mean live rock and live sand? I have those on order from BRS and should be in tomorrow. If I combine the live rock/sand with the skimmer would that be all that I need for filtration?

 

[tharbin]

Welcome to R2R! HOB filters and skimmers are both filtration devices but differ in what and how they filter. A HOB or canister filter provides mechanical filtration, i.e. it removes uneaten food, detritus, etc. before it breaks down. They may also optionally provide some biological or chemical filtration but that is really just sharing the same plumbing and pumps for different purposes. A skimmer removes dissolved organics via foam fractionation.

All filtration is somewhat optional other than biological which is usually provided by bacteria on your rock and/or sand. If you watch the 5-minute guides from BRS they set up a 40 breeder. They use both a mechanical filter (a comline model from Tunze) and a skimmer (also a comline model from Tunze).

This was too quick an answer to give you all you need. Watch the 5-minute guides and then come back and ask questions here. I would not necessarily recommend too many BRS videos and I would not necessarily set up a 40 breeder as they did but I think it does give a very good introduction.

Good luck.

 

[shakacuz]

welcome aboard the r2r board!

canister filters aren't used as much for reef tanks, but can still be used. i don't have experience with this though.

 

[JachPot]

Hello, I am a new reefer and buying everything that I will need for my new setup. I am using a 40 gallon breeder tank and have talked with my local fish store to get a start but could not remember everything when I went there. I have also been watching the BRS 5 minute beginner guide videos to learn everything that I can. I also decided that I want to do HOB style and not use a sump for complexity/cost reasons.

I was going through the list of things that I need to order while watching all the videos and have a question about the filter.

I remember the shop talking about a canister filter but in the BRS videos it looks like all they are using is a protein skimmer. Do they not use a filter in their setup or is protein skimmer doing the filtration.

Thank you very much and will take any advice that you can give me.

FWIW, I know a lot of people that have had success (including me) running a tank with a HOB like this: https://www.petco.com/shop/en/petcostore/product/marineland-emperor-filter-systems-400b and a HOB skimmer like the reef octopus 1000. I ran a 29 gallon for about 2 years like that and kept everything I ever wanted (clowns, anemones, etc). The perk of the emperor is that the filter pads have carbon in them already, so you're not in need of any additives. If you are, you can easily slide them in between the pad and the wall of the filter though. The little wheels on there act as your extra bacteria holder like rubble in your sump or the bioballs/biomedia would. They're also reasonably quiet and pretty sturdy.

Continue to watch those videos and educate yourself so that you're best set up for success. I can not stress enough how important it is that you be patient with everything. Don't add anemones before 6 months(minimum), slowly introduce fish AFTER you're clearly cycled, etc. The quickest way to failure and frustration is trying to do too much too fast. One of the biggest turn offs is people realizing they're going to have an empty tank sitting in a room cycling for 2-3 weeks. It's just part of the game. You can use turbo start if you're impatient though. (FritzZyme turbo start, dang link broke) lots of people have had success with it.

You'll also want a proper amount of rock, the old rule used to be 1lbs/gallon (probably very old rule), but don't skimp on rock. It's the base of your bacteria filtration and is important.

 

[Sebastiancrab]

I have used an Eheim canister filter and Seachem Tidal Filter for my 29 gallon fish only saltwater tank. I recommend the latter if you are not going to have a sump for your 40 breeder (which I upgraded to). The Tidal Filter is so much easier to maintain. You can also put any kind of filter media in it you want.

Tidal 55 HOB Power Filter

TIDAL hang on filters are designed from the ground up to provide the aquarium with high-quality, easy to implement, comprehensive filtration. While having a system plumbed with an overflow and sump certainly has its advantages, this isn’t always practical. In some situations, space constraints...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

I keep it now for emergency backup.

 

[glooper]

FWIW, I know a lot of people that have had success (including me) running a tank with a HOB like this: https://www.petco.com/shop/en/petcostore/product/marineland-emperor-filter-systems-400b and a HOB skimmer like the reef octopus 1000. I ran a 29 gallon for about 2 years like that and kept everything I ever wanted (clowns, anemones, etc). The perk of the emperor is that the filter pads have carbon in them already, so you're not in need of any additives. If you are, you can easily slide them in between the pad and the wall of the filter though. The little wheels on there act as your extra bacteria holder like rubble in your sump or the bioballs/biomedia would. They're also reasonably quiet and pretty sturdy.

Continue to watch those videos and educate yourself so that you're best set up for success. I can not stress enough how important it is that you be patient with everything. Don't add anemones before 6 months(minimum), slowly introduce fish AFTER you're clearly cycled, etc. The quickest way to failure and frustration is trying to do too much too fast. One of the biggest turn offs is people realizing they're going to have an empty tank sitting in a room cycling for 2-3 weeks. It's just part of the game. You can use turbo start if you're impatient though. (FritzZyme turbo start, dang link broke) lots of people have had success with it.

You'll also want a proper amount of rock, the old rule used to be 1lbs/gallon (probably very old rule), but don't skimp on rock. It's the base of your bacteria filtration and is important.

Yes, I am trying to get it set up and cycled as fast as I can so that I can see the process. My local fish shop says that I can bring in my water there to test and they will help as well. I did buy 40 pounds of rock so hopefully that will be a good starting point, will buy more if need be.

I just want to buy all the essentials to get the cycling process started. So you would recommend a skimmer AND a filter correct?

Thank you

 

[JachPot]

Yes, I am trying to get it set up and cycled as fast as I can so that I can see the process. My local fish shop says that I can bring in my water there to test and they will help as well. I did buy 40 pounds of rock so hopefully that will be a good starting point, will buy more if need be.

I just want to buy all the essentials to get the cycling process started. So you would recommend a skimmer AND a filter correct?

Thank you

You don't need a skimmer right away imo, you can even get around using one at all. Feeding moderately, once a day or once every other day, biweekly water changes, changing the pads out once a month (You can also rinse them with rodi in between to help) will do you well. Also don't overstock your tank. That's a very common issue, people want to cram everything into their tank. I had 2 clownfish and a small shrimp goby in my 29 and never wanted to add another fish. Never had issues.


For starting a new tank I'd put in the sand, rock, water, and turn on the HOB filter and let it ride. If you'd like to use fritz you can. Again, the goal is patience. I know it's exciting, but going fast is going to cause you a lot more issues and cost you money in the long run. You also don't want to kill any fish or snails that can be avoided. "


I tested my tank daily with a cheap API kit that has ammonia, nitrate, nitrite, pH tests and just watched the cycle go through. Then I went and purchased salifert tests for the future. You can probably skip buying the kit and just take your water in every 3-5 days until they say you're cycled. With Fritz you're paying to cut that from 2-3 weeks to a few days I guess. It's just an added cost though.

 

[JachPot]

At a second thought, a wavemaker that's appropriate for your 40G would help too. You'll want to add one before you add anything, it will keep you from getting bad cyano in low flow areas.

So just the HOB and a wavemaker I think.

 

[glooper]

You don't need a skimmer right away imo, you can even get around using one at all. Feeding moderately, once a day or once every other day, biweekly water changes, changing the pads out once a month (You can also rinse them with rodi in between to help) will do you well. Also don't overstock your tank. That's a very common issue, people want to cram everything into their tank. I had 2 clownfish and a small shrimp goby in my 29 and never wanted to add another fish. Never had issues.


For starting a new tank I'd put in the sand, rock, water, and turn on the HOB filter and let it ride. If you'd like to use fritz you can. Again, the goal is patience. I know it's exciting, but going fast is going to cause you a lot more issues and cost you money in the long run. You also don't want to kill any fish or snails that can be avoided. "


I tested my tank daily with a cheap API kit that has ammonia, nitrate, nitrite, pH tests and just watched the cycle go through. Then I went and purchased salifert tests for the future. You can probably skip buying the kit and just take your water in every 3-5 days until they say you're cycled. With Fritz you're paying to cut that from 2-3 weeks to a few days I guess. It's just an added cost though.

Thank you again for a well thought out response, you all are amazing on here. It is alot of information and overwhelming at times but when you break it down like this it all seems manageable.

I will probably wait to get the skimmer once I get months down the road and start adding coral.

 

[glooper]

At a second thought, a wavemaker that's appropriate for your 40G would help too. You'll want to add one before you add anything, it will keep you from getting bad cyano in low flow areas.

So just the HOB and a wavemaker I think.

Yes, i am looking at those right now to order them.

 

[tharbin]

I agree with @JachPot and @Sebastiancrab . You don't need a skimmer in the beginning, maybe never. I would suggest the HOB over a canister filter and I would further suggest that you make sure the HOB offers surface skimming (like the Tidal offers). The internal filters like the Tunze Comlines are also very good.

 

[JachPot]

Yes, i am looking at those right now to order them.

I would highly, highly recommend you check out your local facebook group "Chicago reef keepers" or whatever it is called. You'll save a ton of money and can get things like wavemakers for 33%. You can do part of this hobby on a budget to start out and it makes mistakes cost a lot less in the end. Pro tip: look up soaking old equipment in vinegar to remove coraline and such. You can revitalize older equipment.


Also, try to only buy once if you can. Find a nice deal on a solid reef light that will get you to your end game for this tank, so that you don't have to string together 1-3 light purchases and such. I'm not saying go all in on a $200 wave maker, but find the right one for the tank that you'll be happy with. Honestly, most people that stick with this hobby like to "upgrade" to a larger tank and when they do they know exactly what they want and they spend more money on that tank to get it just right. I think most people with friends that are in this hobby start out with a pile of hand me downs and go from there.

I also don't know your local fish store (LFS) and I don't want to speak to their work, but be very advised that some places like to try to sell you a ton of crap (usually chemicals) for keeping corals and stuff. I used to work at a store and I had a lady bring in a shopping basket of crap and ask me why she couldn't keep corals, the other store said this would help her. I felt so bad for her. We got her righted though and I got her to use only what she needed.

 

[glooper]

I agree with @JachPot and @Sebastiancrab . You don't need a skimmer in the beginning, maybe never. I would suggest the HOB over a canister filter and I would further suggest that you make sure the HOB offers surface skimming (like the Tidal offers). The internal filters like the Tunze Comlines are also very good.

Thank you, I am planning to go with what sebastian offered and get the

Tidal 55 HOB Power Filter - Seachem​

 

[glooper]

I would highly, highly recommend you check out your local facebook group "Chicago reef keepers" or whatever it is called. You'll save a ton of money and can get things like wavemakers for 33%. You can do part of this hobby on a budget to start out and it makes mistakes cost a lot less in the end. Pro tip: look up soaking old equipment in vinegar to remove coraline and such. You can revitalize older equipment.


Also, try to only buy once if you can. Find a nice deal on a solid reef light that will get you to your end game for this tank, so that you don't have to string together 1-3 light purchases and such. I'm not saying go all in on a $200 wave maker, but find the right one for the tank that you'll be happy with. Honestly, most people that stick with this hobby like to "upgrade" to a larger tank and when they do they know exactly what they want and they spend more money on that tank to get it just right. I think most people with friends that are in this hobby start out with a pile of hand me downs and go from there.

I also don't know your local fish store (LFS) and I don't want to speak to their work, but be very advised that some places like to try to sell you a ton of crap (usually chemicals) for keeping corals and stuff. I used to work at a store and I had a lady bring in a shopping basket of crap and ask me why she couldn't keep corals, the other store said this would help her. I felt so bad for her. We got her righted though and I got her to use only what she needed.

I will check them out now and see if I can snag some cheap stuff.

 

[JachPot]

I will check them out now and see if I can snag some cheap stuff.

I'm also an idiot. You need a heater. I set mine for 78 personally. That's the one thing I'd get new. Heaters have a finite lifespan, so I'd rather have a new one for ~$30-35 than a cheap one with half the life for $10.

 

[glooper]

I'm also an idiot. You need a heater. I set mine for 78 personally. That's the one thing I'd get new. Heaters have a finite lifespan, so I'd rather have a new one for ~$30-35 than a cheap one with half the life for $10.

Yes, I should've mentioned what I already have in my beginning post, but I do have a 100W heater on order as well.
Thank you for looking out!

 

[Sebastiancrab]

Glooper, a key thing in the hobby is to go slow and have patience. I used Seachem Stability and a pinch of flake fish food in my tank every day for 2 weeks. I didn't even bother to test it until after those two weeks because I knew the bacteria was doing it's thing. Then I also had the LFS double check my work. I was good to go. The Stability is inexpensive compared to many other bacteria starters.