Nitrate problems, I need help

dsplunker · Oct 23, 2015

I have a 125 gallon tank with a 35 gallon Refugium. Lots of live rock in both on top of a 4.5 inch sand base. I am using a Reef octopus 150 sss skimmer. Guessing 24 inches total of fish. I do a 25 gallon water change twice a month.

I know the magnesium is low, I just got the test kit today.
Magnesium is 1044
Nitrite is between 0 and 0.25
ammonia is 0
PH is 8.1
Nitrate is off the scale.
I have been using two baseball sized pantyhose filled with seachem de*nitrate in the sump for two months.
I primarily feed with the LRS food. But I also supplement with live Brine shrimp, live copepods, live phyto, new era algae pellets, kent microvert, and ocean nutrition formula 1 and 2.

gmastr85 · Oct 23, 2015

How long has the tank been up and running?

dsplunker · Oct 23, 2015

10 months

Diesel · Oct 23, 2015

So what is your No3 if it's of the scale?
We can say your Nitrite is of scale if you can measure up to 0.25.
Any idea where you Po4 is?

Sabellafella · Oct 23, 2015

U have an ro unit

dsplunker · Oct 24, 2015

I do have a RO unit. Diesel, I think you are asking about phosphates .. I dont have that test yet.

Diesel · Oct 24, 2015

Phosphates and your Nitrate level as is.
Any bad effects on your tank?

hectat2 · Oct 24, 2015

Install a phosphate reactor.

yarddoctor123 · Oct 24, 2015

Quick fixes that cost you NOTHING :
Open your rock work. Google "marine aquascapes" for e.g.

Create a gyre flow with your power heads. http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2007/1/aafeature
Vacuum your sand bed. You can do this into a filter sock while your pumps are running with NO water change. http://www.rottertube.com/2015/09/11/lower-nitrates-in-reef-tank-awesome-sand-bed-vacuum-technique/
Stop overfeeding! With all the live foods (awesome), you can easily feed every other day and give the entire system a chance to process more nutrients efficiently. Every feeding starts a phosphate spike!

Your sandbed is pretty deep, too. Lots of videos on reducing/changing substrate for nitrate control.
Personally, I will never use argonite again. I removed my sandbed and slowly replaced it with Hawaiian black and pool silica sand no deeper than 1/2". My nitrates are now undetectable (from 20), and phosphates are consistently .25, (from 4). I carbon dose with my ATO and have been SLOWLY reducing my skimmer operation. I don't unplug it. I just move the effluent tube down on non-feed days to continue oxygenating water without pulling skimmate. The beneficial bacteria continue to feed the system/corals.

If you try any of these techniques (or all of them) please let us know how it goes for you. [emoji57] [emoji2] [emoji295]

Mike in CT · Oct 24, 2015

Lots of people including myself have had luck with carbon dosing. (Vodka and vinegar most common). Pretty cheap and not to complicated but it takes a while to work.

dsplunker · Oct 24, 2015

Thank you for your replies. My test kit is a API and what I meant about "Off the scale" is the highest the card goes to is 160 ppm and the color is darker than the chart. I live in a small town, went to petsmart and petco and neither carry a phosphate test kit. (I am about 80 miles from a fish store) What test kit is recommended? As far as bad effects I have a bubble tip that was a little bigger than a dime, it has been smaller than a pea for over a week and I have a neon green trumpet coral that was beautiful when I got it 4 weeks ago .. it is 3/4 dead now. I also forgot to mention I am spot feeding reef roids and a couple of months ago I started using the sea-lab NO 28 or N8 28 mineral blocks. Thanks again for your help. Bill

Mike in CT · Oct 24, 2015

Your probably are going to have to get more aggressive with your water changes if you think you are going to start losing life stock, until you come up with another way to export nitrates. With the API test kits you probably won't see much in a change in color after a water change until they really come down.

veselym · Oct 24, 2015

FWIW, LRS has a TON of phosphate in it...tested 1/2 penny sized chunk in 20ml of water and P04 tested 10ppm

ReefFrenzy · Oct 24, 2015

veselym said:
FWIW, LRS has a TON of phosphate in it...tested 1/2 penny sized chunk in 20ml of water and P04 tested 10ppm

All of the seafood ingredients used in aquarium foods by any manufacturer which are comprised of living tissue will contain phosphorus. There is no "magic bullet" way to remove this from a food, nor would we want to. Due to our location and purchasing volume we are lucky enough to source ingredients which contain no added sodium tri-phosphate rinses or preservatives like many other foods contain. This has been explained on our website FAQ page since 2012 here in the 3rd bullet down: http://www.larrysreefservices.com/faq.html

This article by Randy sheds a lot of light on PO4 and aquarium foods. It also explains why dropping a piece of food in a vial of water and testing for PO4 is not a way to determine anything.

http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2012/3/chemistry

I am thankful that you had some LRS food on hand to test which means you likely purchased our product and I am very appreciative. In no means is this post meant to "call you out" but rather I wanted to explain that foods have PO4 in them no matter what advertising claims are made. Certain foods are cleaner than others which may reduce overall nutrients in a captive system.

Every system is different and the hobbyist needs to find a method to balance nutrients in with nutrients exported in order to avoid nuisance algae and elevated nitrates.

Good luck to the OP and thanks for using LRS

yarddoctor123 · Oct 25, 2015

Yup. I LOVE Reefroids... my corals do ,actually[emoji57].
But, anything that goes into my body or my tanks in moderation... I consider a marine system a body with all the same functional organs... skin, bones, endocrine, nervous, circulatory systems, etc.
When our bodies are overloaded with nitrates,phosphates, sugars, hormones, blah blah, even super models (like me) get sick, too!

twilliard · Oct 25, 2015

Sounds like a case of over feeding.
I would look at how and what you are feeding and how much.
You have stated that you have nitrites and that alone is in an indicator of over feeding past the capabilities of your system.
End result .. no3
With a wide diverse macro algae farm you can pull a lot of that out, they will love it.
Also efficient skimming will do wonders.
The biggest problem to water changes is the end result of chemistry.
More harm may be done with constant changes of water that is not identical to the tank chemistry.