No Cycle Method

[Nano Saltyy]

Hey Everyone..
Is there anyway one can add fish to a 15 gallon, Freshly Setup, QT tank on Day 1 without the need for cycling the tank using products like Amquel and Seachem Prime?

What would the protocol for water changes be if using the above method?

TIA

 

[Alaeriel]

If you're okay with them dying shortly thereafter from ammonia burns, possibly. If you must, I'd recommend doing massive water changes at least every other day, but you'd be spending more on salt than on the bac boost. You'd also have to adjust copper levels every time you do a water change if you're planning on treating the fish.

 

[elorablue]

Hey Everyone..
Is there anyway one can add fish to a 15 gallon, Freshly Setup, QT tank on Day 1 without the need for cycling the tank using products like Amquel and Seachem Prime?

What would the protocol for water changes be if using the above method?

TIA

No easy answer to that one. @reefbuilders did something similar though. They have a video on it

 

[Cell]

Yes, drop in some Bio-Spira first and only add 1 fish to start. Monitor your ammonia, but you should be fine.

 

[Cell]

Or toss a sponge in your DT for a week or so and transfer it to your QT when you are ready to set it up.

 

[Cell]

It's not uncommon for people to set up QT tanks as needed, not keeping one always cycled. In this case, ammonia control is usually done with monitoring and frequent water changes. But you should always keep Prime on hand just in case.

 

[ThePurple12]

In theory, if you set up the tank with live rock with preexisting beneficial bacteria, and add fish slowly while monitoring ammonia, it should work out.

 

[Nano Saltyy]

Yes, drop in some Bio-Spira first and only add 1 fish to start. Monitor your ammonia, but you should be fine.

Basically my concern was the decomposition of Chloroquine Phosphate by the bacteria in the tank. That is why I wanted to add the CP to a tank with minimal bacterial population so as to maintain the therapeutic level in the water column. This is the only reason for asking this question.
It would be great if @Jay Hemdal could chime in on this.

 

[Nano Saltyy]

It's not uncommon for people to set up QT tanks as needed, not keeping one always cycled. In this case, ammonia control is usually done with monitoring and frequent water changes. But you should always keep Prime on hand just in case.

How effective is Prime in detoxifying Ammonia?
I mean if I add a pair of clownfish in a 15 gallon tank, will a daily dose of Prime be able to keep it detoxified so it doesn’t harm the fish in any way?

 

[Uncle99]

Do It frequently.
Add a piece of seasoned rock.
Put in heated saltwater to 1.018-1.
Put in fish.
10% WC daily.

Certainly use prime.

No seasoned rock, then seed one in a bucket with bacteria and flow for 24 hours, then add to tank including the water.

Not cycled. In a reasonable sized QT 20-40g, you can do 20% WC daily, and syphon out the crap on the bottom daily, should keep your ammonia in check in you don’t place a big load on it.
When I use this, it’s on 1 fish only for about 15 days.

 

[Nano Saltyy]

Do It frequently.
Add a piece of seasoned rock.
Put in heated saltwater to 1.018-1.
Put in fish.
10% WC daily.

Certainly use prime.

No seasoned rock, then seed one in a bucket with bacteria and flow for 24 hours, then add to tank including the water.

Not cycled. In a reasonable sized QT 20-40g, you can do 20% WC daily, and syphon out the crap on the bottom daily, should keep your ammonia in check in you don’t place a big load on it.
When I use this, it’s on 1 fish only for about 15 days.

Thanks for the response.
I have a question..
Would this work…

1. I setup a fresh 15 gallon QT tank with NO Bacteria to reduce the BACTERIAL DEGRADATION of Chloroquine Phosphate.

2. I add the pair of clownfish which I’m getting from my friend and which I know for a fact has had Ich in the tank that they are coming from.

3. I add Prime and Dose Chloroquine Phosphate at recommended dosage. I’ll keep an Ammonia badge for monitoring.

4. I siphone and change 20% water daily and keep adding Prime daily for the next 15 days till the CP treatment is done.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Hey Everyone..
Is there anyway one can add fish to a 15 gallon, Freshly Setup, QT tank on Day 1 without the need for cycling the tank using products like Amquel and Seachem Prime?

What would the protocol for water changes be if using the above method?

TIA

I try to never do that. There is more instability in an uncycled tank than just the nitrogen cycle, I prefer to keep my QT running with a fish in them so they are rock solid and ready to go at any time.

Jay

 

[tikalize]

Is it possible yes but i would wait until the tank is fully cycled. I understand wanting to see fish swimming now but it takes time to be really successful and should not be rushed. Hell we loose fish with a mature tank..

 

[Uncle99]

Not used an non-cycled tank with meds.

There were times when it was impossible to put fish with ick in a cycled tank because I did not have one handy

I was diligent in water changes and as important, vacuumed up the bottom twice a day after feedings.

I did not run into Ammonia during the 25 days in QT.

For ick I use hypo.
I found this process more forgiving than CP.
In 4 days ick off fish, I went another 14, then took another 7 to increase salinity back to DT.

Jay thinks it’s a bad idea, I’d always follow his advice first.

 

[Cell]

How effective is Prime in detoxifying Ammonia?
I mean if I add a pair of clownfish in a 15 gallon tank, will a daily dose of Prime be able to keep it detoxified so it doesn’t harm the fish in any way?

Prime will bind the ammonia in the water but not get rid of it, so you will still test positive for ammonia until you change the water. I do not know if excess Prime in the water will remain stable to bind new ammonia as it is produced, but I doubt it. I consider Prime to be a quick fix emergency tool to neutralize ammonia until you can change the water out, not for long term repeated use in lieu of ammonia nitrification.

 

[Dolphins18]

If you must do it, Please only use chromis or damsels, they have a chance at surviving.
One who can't wait for a cycle may find this hobby to be an extreme struggle.

And people quoting professionals who do it are merely encouraging bad behavior, sure it can be done, but its highly unlikely to be successful by a novice to this hobby.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Prime will bind the ammonia in the water but not get rid of it, so you will still test positive for ammonia until you change the water. I do not know if excess Prime in the water will remain stable to bind new ammonia as it is produced, but I doubt it. I consider Prime to be a quick fix emergency tool to neutralize ammonia until you can change the water out, not for long term repeated use in lieu of ammonia nitrification.

Another issue with ammonia neutralizers is they don’t work as well in subsequent doses on the same tank, I don’t know why. Plus there is the reaction these reducing agents have on Cupramine and possibly coppersafe and copper power.

Jay

 

[RC51]

Hey Everyone..
Is there anyway one can add fish to a 15 gallon, Freshly Setup, QT tank on Day 1 without the need for cycling the tank using products like Amquel and Seachem Prime?

What would the protocol for water changes be if using the above method?

TIA

Does a lot of bacteria and 1 or 2 small nano fish in a 15 gallon won't hurt too much but you'll have to do a water change every other day of every 3 days to make sure the fish don't die from ammonia burns. But don't add snails or inverts yet because they will probably die from new tank syndrome stuff

 

[tikalize]

I also believe practicing patience in this hobby will gear you up for the long road ahead. Trust me I'm a "now" type person but there is NOT a quick way without something going wrong. When i started keeping glass boxes long ago there was always someone selling something in a bottle so you can drop fish in and enjoy and they got alot of my money before i learned. You are better off with some cured rock and 15 gallons of you buddy water than trying to find a Genie in a bottle. Again JMO..

 

[RC51]

I also believe practicing patience in this hobby will gear you up for the long road ahead. Trust me I'm a "now" type person but there is NOT a quick way without something going wrong. When i started keeping glass boxes long ago there was always someone selling something in a bottle so you can drop fish in and enjoy and they got alot of my money before i learned. You are better off with some cured rock and 15 gallons of you buddy water than trying to find a Genie in a bottle. Again JMO..

kinda true.
But most first timers really want to have fish in the first week. I learned from it the hard way. Lol