NO3, PO4 not the enemy

[pseudorand]

Here's a tank pick. Most of the green is what I think are protopalythoas, which came on my live rock. Not the prettiest close up, but they sure do glow in pics under dimmed blue leds.

Two years is still young, but I'm seeing some good growth on some cyphastria and psammy and I'm hopeful my new acros will survive. I think I'll keep up the water tests if only to have a record of fluctuations as a tank ages at some point in the future. I may feed more and just record the PO4/NO3 results, but not worry about them.

 

[pseudorand]

Another more specific question (thought perhaps approaching existential in the reef keeping world) is why sticks seem great for a month or so and then die. That was the fate of other bird's nests and stylos I've kept.

There are obviously lots of potential causes, but to what extent is water chemistry/nutrients one of them.

 

[Jacob Fawley]

I don’t care what the natural reef parameters are. I, and the vast majority of hobbyist, don’t have the water volume, biodiversity, water movement and the sun to replicate it. I also don’t prefer the way acropora look in nature (mostly brown and/or grey).

They only look like that due to the spectrum of light they are under and because we have specifically selected the most colorful specimens. We as hobbyists concentrate on providing a more blue skewed spectrum because it is cost efficient and more visually appealing. And true, we can’t fully replicate the reefs’ characteristics, but we can come close to replicating much of the water chemistry.

 

[KK's Reef]

Alk 6.5-9
Ph 8.0-8.65
Par 200-500
I don’t really care about anything else

Alk is a range of 6.5 - 9.... what amount of time passes between 9 and the drop to 6.5? Or do you generally keep in the middle?

 

[Charlie’s Frags]

Alk is a range of 6.5 - 9.... what amount of time passes between 9 and the drop to 6.5? Or do you generally keep in the middle?

4 or 5 days. I know it’s time to refill my kalk reactor when alk drops below 7

 

[ZoWhat]

Po4 literally inhibits skeletal growth. Please don't confuse random reef dudes on the internet not knowing for scientists not knowing.

https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rsos.201214

I can outright TESTIFY that no3 above 20ppm and po4 above 1ppm makes high end zoas SHRINK at first and then slowly melt away.

By shrinking I mean their disc heads shrink to tiny discs then begin to melt

I can also TESTIFY that if you catch a shrinking zoa in time and get no3 and po4 back in line, zoas can and do recover with TLC.

No3 and po4 are used by corals but at an extremely small qty. In undetectable small amounts.

No3 and po4 in upper ranges are absolutely poison to corals bc its too much for them to handle biologically. Like us trying to live and be healthy in a septic tank.

 

[Stigigemla]

This discussion had its first fueling in 2014 by Rich Ross () if I remember right. In the discussion afterwards he stated that some corals didn't go well in this tank.

The answer is simple: Corals are different. Some can adapt well to values, lighting and circulation that others don't.

 

[Damien Buckley]

I’m not sure we’re looking at the right factors. Having had both what would be considered low and high nutrient level tanks, with and without refugiums and with,

I’m leaning these days in the direction of thinking the level of biodiversity you host and how much space you give over to a refugium and/or algae reactor seems to make more of a difference than chasing low nutrient levels.

My nitrate is sitting between 10-15ppm and phosphate around 0.2ppm at the moment but my coral, fish, and inverts are thriving, and I have no nuisance algae in the display - at all. I don’t run filter socks, have plenty of marinepure, a PaxBellum, skimmer, and have the sump chock-full of chaeto and turtle grass.

My last tank had no room for a fuge, I fought to maintain low nutrient levels, and had constant battles with nuisance algae…

Just my 10c

 

[biocubeboy]

My tank doesn’t seem to mind nitrates. But when I fed reef roids too much without a filter change, and phosphates rise my anemones shrivel up and get small. So I changed to AB+ it gives me less phosphates and the coral look great.

 

[725196]

Water changes solve problems, I don't think that's in debate. But why they work is unclear to me.

Last year I had to move my mother in law to a non-smoking, assisted living facility. She had 3 month to prepare for it and to quit smoking. This was a battle to be sure. I drove the hr drive every day to go make sure she was “stepping down” her cigarettes, from 2 packs a day to nothing. Each day I would give her her ration for that day, a couple less than the day before. When I get there I would open the front and back door for 10 minutes before went in the house, it was simply unbreathable before that. Smoke would billow out the whole time. When I closed the doors to go in it was still like going into a crowded pool hall that allowed smoking. It was AWFUL!!!

BUT…

That 10 minutes made a HUGE difference, even though the house was still full of smoke. The bit of frag air helped. She even would say she felt better after I would do that.

I relate that to a water change in an aquarium. The fish/corals cannot go out to get “fresh air” so that water change is their frag air. Every time I do a WC I can see the difference almost immediately as corals open up more and the fish, seem, happier. (I water change from the sump to be as un-intrusive as I can be.) I know I am personifying the fishes reaction and I know this is anecdotal but it is repeatable every time I do it so it has merit.

As for nitrate and phosphates… I have had my phosphates as high as 2.7 with no immediate ill effects. I did take action to lower them. And I have my nitrates as high as 15 at times. When that happens I just feed a bit less for a few days then they drop below 10. It works for me had has for years. Yes again anecdotal.

 

[GARRIGA]

Perhaps finding that which thrives in one’s conditions a better approach for some then trying to force conditions for that they want.