NO3 & PO4 . . . Why can't I get this right?

[esther]

OK, so I've been battling high NO3 & PO4 for a couple of weeks now. I've read almost every thread with the same issues, but I can't seem to get any subtle changes for the better. I'm at a loss for what to do. I'm not looking for a quick fix, but I'd love to be able to see *some* changes for the better.

I've completely stopped using ROWAphos & Carbon in my reactor because I started using NOPOX. A week ago I started dosing 10ml of NOPOX a day but haven't seen any change. I'm thinking that my issue may be a feeding issue. I was feeding about 5g 3X a day of the BRS Reef Chili recipe that they have online. I've heard a lot of people say that it increased their PO4 as well.

So, I'm asking for your help on what you think I should do with regard to feeding and the continuing of dosing NOPOX. Or if you have a recommendation completely different from what I'm doing. Thanks in advance for your help!

I'm considering not feeding at all today and testing again tomorrow morning to see if anything drops. What do you think?

Here's the situation:

• Total Water Volume : Probably about 180g to 200g. We have a Waterbox 220.6, but we do have a good amount of live rock in the tank.
• Livestock List
  • Various SPS, LPS & Soft Corals - Probably over 40 corals
  • Dejardini Sailfin Tang
  • Cleaner Shrimp - X4
  • Fire Shrimp - X4
  • Sand Sifting Stars - X4
  • Black Ice Snowflake Clowns - X2
  • Yellow Belly Blue Tang
  • Pistol Shrimp
  • Tiger Conch - X2
  • Tomini Tang
  • Scooter Blenny - X2
  • Mandarin Dragonet - X2
  • Loubouti Wrasse
  • Rainbow Anemone
  • Borbonias Anthias - X3
  • Flame Wrasse
  • Lineatus Fairy Wrasse
• Tank Parameters as of this morning:
  • Temp : 79.4º F
  • pH : 8.01
  • Redox : 375
  • Salinity : 1.0255
  • PO4 : 0.24 (Hanna ULR)
  • NO3 : 25 (Salifert)
  • Calcium : 449 (Hanna)
  • Magnesium : 1,440 (Red Sea)
  • dKH : 8.1

 

[splitting_lanes]

Try cutting feeding back to twice a day for a week and test results then.

 

[dwest]

OK, so I've been battling high NO3 & PO4 for a couple of weeks now. I've read almost every thread with the same issues, but I can't seem to get any subtle changes for the better. I'm at a loss for what to do. I'm not looking for a quick fix, but I'd love to be able to see *some* changes for the better.

I've completely stopped using ROWAphos & Carbon in my reactor because I started using NOPOX. A week ago I started dosing 10ml of NOPOX a day but haven't seen any change. I'm thinking that my issue may be a feeding issue. I was feeding about 5g 3X a day of the BRS Reef Chili recipe that they have online. I've heard a lot of people say that it increased their PO4 as well.

So, I'm asking for your help on what you think I should do with regard to feeding and the continuing of dosing NOPOX. Or if you have a recommendation completely different from what I'm doing. Thanks in advance for your help!

I'm considering not feeding at all today and testing again tomorrow morning to see if anything drops. What do you think?

Here's the situation:

• Total Water Volume : Probably about 180g to 200g. We have a Waterbox 220.6, but we do have a good amount of live rock in the tank.
• Livestock List
  • Various SPS, LPS & Soft Corals - Probably over 40 corals
  • Dejardini Sailfin Tang
  • Cleaner Shrimp - X4
  • Fire Shrimp - X4
  • Sand Sifting Stars - X4
  • Black Ice Snowflake Clowns - X2
  • Yellow Belly Blue Tang
  • Pistol Shrimp
  • Tiger Conch - X2
  • Tomini Tang
  • Scooter Blenny - X2
  • Mandarin Dragonet - X2
  • Loubouti Wrasse
  • Rainbow Anemone
  • Borbonias Anthias - X3
  • Flame Wrasse
  • Lineatus Fairy Wrasse
• Tank Parameters as of this morning:
  • Temp : 79.4º F
  • pH : 8.01
  • Redox : 375
  • Salinity : 1.0255
  • PO4 : 0.24 (Hanna ULR)
  • NO3 : 25 (Salifert)
  • Calcium : 449 (Hanna)
  • Magnesium : 1,440 (Red Sea)
  • dKH : 8.1

Sounds like a great tank!

I would feed your tank inhabitants what they need and not skip feedings.

There are many successful tanks that run nitrates and phosphates at or above your levels. Have you ever considered not worrying about them?

If it were my tank, I would feed my fish, stop NOPOX, stop reef chili.

There will be lots of opinions, but that is mine. Good luck!

 

[esther]

Try cutting feeding back to twice a day for a week and test results then.

For some reason the part I wrote about feeding isn't in the original post, so here's what I've done...

• On 6/24, I cut feeding back by half (weight of food) and started only feeding twice a day.
• On 7/1 I did a 32g water change.
• On 7/3 I started dosing NOPOX at 10ml a day.
• On 7/7, I stopped feeding the BRS food and just started feeding NYOS mysis and Reefnutrition pellets.
• On 7/8 I did another 32g water change.

I'm currently feeding only 10g of food. Is that still too much? Should I not feed today and see what happens tomorrow when I test?

 

[SteveEreef]

How do you corals look?

 

[esther]

Sounds like a great tank!

I would feed your tank inhabitants what they need and not skip feedings.

There are many successful tanks that run nitrates and phosphates at or above your levels. Have you ever considered not worrying about them?

If it were my tank, I would feed my fish, stop NOPOX, stop reef chili.

There will be lots of opinions, but that is mine. Good luck!

My SPS are looking a little browned out, which is why I wanted to try and reduce the NO3 & PO4.

 

[esther]

How do you corals look?

All corals look good with polyp extension and good growth. It's just that the SPS look a little browned out. Am I worrying too much? At what levels should I be alarmed? The PO4 has increased steadily over the last week from 0.15 to 0.24. I'm thinking I may add the ROWAphos back into the system this weekend along with the carbon and stop NOPOX and maybe do another water change.

 

[Stanley Wong]

How about thru put of the skimmer (nitrate) ? Phosphate is going to take longer (leak back out from rock).

 

[ruegaroo]

NOPOX isn't an immediate fix. It will take some time to see your numbers go down. I would stick with it for a couple of months and see what you think after that.

 

[IslandLifeReef]

IMO, you are probably feeding food that is too high in PO4 and maybe feeding a little to heavy.

You probably have PO4 bound to your rock, which will take a while to lower. I would try 15% weekly water changes as well as reducing your feeding and mixing up your food a little. It will take a while for the NoPoX to show any results.

I would just pick a plan, and stick with it for a month and see how things progress.

 

[Larry L]

All corals look good with polyp extension and good growth. It's just that the SPS look a little browned out. Am I worrying too much?

Probably. I've read so many threads about people messing up and even crashing their tanks by trying too hard to manage nutrients. The only thing I'd suggest is to cut back on the Reef Chili - 3 times a day seems like an awful lot, even BRS only recommends every other day.

 

[madweazl]

Do you NEED to add the Reef Chili? Certainly not for SPS and not for the majority of corals we typically keep. That would be the first thing I eliminated unless you're absolutely positive that you must use it (which is something I'll almost never agree with).

 

[92Miata]

Sounds like a great tank!

I would feed your tank inhabitants what they need and not skip feedings.

There are many successful tanks that run nitrates and phosphates at or above your levels. Have you ever considered not worrying about them?

If it were my tank, I would feed my fish, stop NOPOX, stop reef chili.

There will be lots of opinions, but that is mine. Good luck!

This is my take as well - most of these powdered/etc coral foods are super high phosphate/nitrate - and really only make sense to me in tanks that are having low nutrient issues.

There's very little evidence at this point that (SPS) corals actually eat any of this stuff in tanks.

 

[esther]

How about thru put of the skimmer (nitrate) ? Phosphate is going to take longer (leak back out from rock).

I’m using a Skimz SM167. It fills up with gunk about every day and a half. So, I’m thinking it’s doing it’s job. Not really sure how to determine that, though.

 

[esther]

Probably. I've read so many threads about people messing up and even crashing their tanks by trying too hard to manage nutrients. The only thing I'd suggest is to cut back on the Reef Chili - 3 times a day seems like an awful lot, even BRS only recommends every other day.

When I say Reef Chili, I mean this: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/m...-reef-chili-we-created-a-recipe-brstv.652412/

 

[esther]

Do you NEED to add the Reef Chili? Certainly not for SPS and not for the majority of corals we typically keep. That would be the first thing I eliminated unless you're absolutely positive that you must use it (which is something I'll almost never agree with).

Problem is I added it to a DIY fish food recipe. We have a couple of bags left, so I may feed that once or twice a week and then feed other stuff. Any recommendations on a good regimen for my tank?

 

[esther]

At this point, I’m going to see if someone like Reef Nutrition can come up with a food regimen plan specific for my tank and only buy what they recommend. A lot of people seem to really love their products.

 

[madweazl]

I'm too lazy for DIY foods LOL. I do LRS Reef Frenzy twice a day and leave it at that. I was adding algae sheets but I've gotten lazy about that too.

 

[esther]

I'm too lazy for DIY foods LOL. I do LRS Reef Frenzy twice a day and leave it at that. I was adding algae sheets but I've gotten lazy about that too.

I’ll check it out! My issue is figuring out how much food to fish for my group of fish. I guess I’ll just have to do trial by error.

 

[madweazl]

If they're skinny, they need more. If they're fat, they need less. It's no more complicated then that.