Nutrients and coral growth- seeking advice

[Toxic727]

hi R2R

First before I get to my questions let me tell you about my tank:

Tank and equipment:
60 Cube
AI 26 hydra hd
Octopus 110 space saver skimmer
Chaeto w/ H380
2 Tunze turbelles (1300gph total)
Finnex hmo heaters x2
Tunze ATO/alk
Up and running for just over a year


Water perameters:
SG 1.026
Temp 79
KH 9
Cal 480
Mg 1400
Phos 0
Nitrate 0
RODI water

Issues:
1) Slow to zero chaeto growth even with h380, some hair algae and various “snot” algae in fuge
2) Almost no coraline algae growth
3) very slow coral growth, if any
4) zoas melt, cloves fade, LPS maintains but doesn’t grow.

I have been suspicious that my water has been too clean. I have been increasing feeding, and it causes slight cyano blooms and some hair algae. N and P are still undetectable.

I’ve had some coral for about 8 months and I’ve seen very little or no growth.

Can someone help me troubleshoot what could possibly be going wrong?

 

[Justfebreezeit]

I'd say the zero detectable nutrients jumps out at me, what test kits are you using to determine phos and nitrate?

 

[Toxic727]

I'd say the zero detectable nutrients jumps out at me, what test kits are you using to determine phos and nitrate?

For those two, I’m using salifert. Red Sea for the rest.

 

[myaniz24]

I’d also like to think your water temp may be to high. I had issues myself when my tank ran on the hotter side. How is your stability with temp. Does it fluctuate? You are using great test kits. I would try lower your temp to 76 and keeping it there at all times fluctuate 1 degree. And go from there. Let us know

 

[Anirban]

High alkalinity with low or undetectable nutrient is not favorable for growth. You have to feed more. Try to feed frozen foods. Also chaeto will need higher no3 and po4 to survive. They don't survive just on the light if u dont have nutrients in the water.

 

[PatW]

The only phos test that I would recommend is the Hanna ultra low range, ULR, test. You want some measurable phosphate but not much. You want your phosphates to be between about .o1 and .o3 ppm.

You also want detectable nitrates. I use the Red Sea Pro, which I think is the most sensitive nitrate test out there. You want nitrates between .5 and 5 ppm. But I have an SPS dominant system.

I keep my phosphates under .o3 ppm and my nitrates under 3 ppm. I run chaeto and it grows vigorously. I crop it twice per week. I use the same light source as you do. I dose both nitrates, sodium nitrate, and phosphates, right now Brightwell’s Neophos. Having vigorous nutrient export with dosing allows me to keep the nutrients in a narrow band.

You can increase nutrients by increasing feeding.

Your corals need nutrients. Some people run really low nutrients and feed their corals which makes up for the lack. I figure if my chaeto is not growing than there isn’t enough for my corals.

 

[Toxic727]

I’d also like to think your water temp may be to high. I had issues myself when my tank ran on the hotter side. How is your stability with temp. Does it fluctuate? You are using great test kits. I would try lower your temp to 76 and keeping it there at all times fluctuate 1 degree. And go from there. Let us know

I do fluctuate about 1 degree throughout the day. I’ll gradually decrease and see what happens.

As I let my nutrients climb a little, I do start to see cyano and GHA blooms. Would you expect to see this in This situation?

 

[myaniz24]

I wouldn’t over feed or even think your over feeding. I honesty feed one cube of mysis every 3 days. Rather under feed than over

 

[Reef of Fillory]

I do fluctuate about 1 degree throughout the day. I’ll gradually decrease and see what happens.

As I let my nutrients climb a little, I do start to see cyano and GHA blooms. Would you expect to see this in This situation?

If you can maintain consistent nutrient levels, and continue to see GHA, I would suggest to get a more tailored clean up crew and/or add to your CUC numbers.

Cyano will come and go, I have 0 Nitrate and 0 Phosphate, and must keep a low ALK [I feed like i'm a mad man] and still have to dose nutrients [stump remover, Phosphate additive]

I have had cyano here and there for the last 4 weeks on my tank, and it has just now died off. I also dose/feed Red Sea's Reef Energy which contributes to Cyano growth, but it has all stabilized since beginning my dosing [amino acids, carbohydrates etc.]

 

[Justfebreezeit]

79 degrees is fine for temperature. From everything i've read and experienced first hand I would be surprised if the temperature was an issue.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I’d also like to think your water temp may be to high. I had issues myself when my tank ran on the hotter side. How is your stability with temp. Does it fluctuate? You are using great test kits. I would try lower your temp to 76 and keeping it there at all times fluctuate 1 degree. And go from there. Let us know

I also can't see how the temp is too high.

Optimal Parameters for a Coral Reef Aquarium: By Randy Holmes-Farley
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/o...-reef-aquarium-by-randy-holmes-farley.173563/

Temperature

Temperature impacts reef aquarium inhabitants in a variety of ways. First and foremost, the animals' metabolic rates rise as temperature rises. They may consequently use or produce more oxygen, carbon dioxide, nutrients, calcium, and alkalinity at higher temperatures. This higher metabolic rate can also increase both their growth rate and waste production at higher temperatures.

Another important impact of temperature is on the chemical aspects of the aquarium. The solubility of dissolved gases such as oxygen and carbon dioxide, for example, change with temperature. Oxygen, in particular, can be a concern because it is less soluble at higher temperature.

So what does this imply for aquarists?

In most instances, trying to match the natural environment in a reef aquarium is a worthy goal. Temperature may, however, be a parameter that requires accounting for the practical considerations of a small closed system that might suffer a power failure and trap the organisms in a small amount of poorly aerated water, something that rarely happens on a natural reef. Looking to the ocean as a guide for setting temperatures in reef aquaria may also present complications because corals grow well in such a wide range of temperatures. The greatest variety of corals, however, are found in water whose average temperature is about 83-86° F.

During normal functioning of a reef aquarium, the oxygen level and the metabolic rate of the aquarium inhabitants are not often important issues, and many reef tanks do well with temperatures in the low to mid 80's. During a crisis such as a power failure, however, the dissolved oxygen can be rapidly used up. Lower temperatures not only allow a higher oxygen level before an emergency, but will also slow the consumption of that oxygen by slowing the metabolism of the aquarium's inhabitants. The production of ammonia as organisms begin to die may also be slower at lower temperatures. For reasons such as this, one may choose to strike a practical balance between temperatures that are too high (even if corals normally thrive in the ocean at those temperatures), and those that are too low.

These natural guidelines leave a fairly wide range of acceptable temperatures. I keep my aquarium at about 80-81° F year-round. I am actually more inclined to keep the aquarium cooler in the summer, when a power failure would most likely warm the aquarium, and higher in winter, when a power failure would most likely cool it. All things considered, I recommend temperatures in the range of 76-83° F unless there is a very clear reason to keep it outside that range.

One additional comment on temperatures: having a small temperature swing is not necessarily undesirable. While temperature stability may sound like a desirable attribute, and in some cases it may be, studies have shown that organisms that are acclimated to daily temperature swings become more able to deal with unexpected temperature excursions. So while a tank creature that normally experiences only 80° F may be very healthy, the same organism adapted to a range from 78° F to 82° F may be better able to deal with an aquarium that accidentally rises to 86° F

 

[Tautog]

1+ w/ Fillory, you have a low nutrient environment. It’s important to have algae. I have to feed 3-4 times per day. Buy a auto feeder, it will keep your nutrient level above zero. I also have a hard time keeping a high Alkalinity 8.0. I have good to better growth on most corals
Your temperature is fine Over 84-85 is a problem, but most corals can handle it

 

[trido]

I also think that everything is in check for success except for the lack of food. I feed my tank up to 8 times a day. Feed heavy and strip it right back out as well. When your reactor is growing at full capacity, your corals are growing well and then a bit of algea starts to creep in where you dont want it then you know your near the sweet spot of balance.

 

[Toxic727]

Thank you guys very much. I really do appreciate your input. I’ll start being less particular about cleanliness and be okay with some cyano and GHA. I might pick up some Hannah testers too... just so expensive!