OT fluoridation of tap water

[Cory]

Randy im curious what is your opinion about flouridation of tap water?

Apparently flouride can cause very bad things.

When i was a child, the dentist gave me flouride cavity protection that you put in your mouth and let soak for like 15 minutes. I wasnt aware that it was bad to swallow and ate most of the cherry flavoured flouride. That day i got very sick, and was throwing up.

 

[Cory]

Bump, anyone can reply not just Randy whos busy lol

 

[JimWelsh]

Sorry, I can't help myself: and also

I don't mean to make light of your experience, Cory, but whenever I hear about the dangers of fluoridated water, I think of these scenes in this wonderful movie.

 

[Cory]

Lol thats funny. What do you think Jim?

 

[JimWelsh]

Since you asked, I think that the movie clips I shared demonstrate that inspecific and unelaborated fears about water fluoridation have been widely ridiculed for over 50 years. Water fluoridation has been clearly shown to be both safe and efficacious. The U. S. Centers for Disease Control ranks it among the top achievements of the 20th Century, ahead even of the recognition of tobacco use as a health hazard. It has widespread acclaim from organizations such as the American Dental Association, Health Canada, and the World Health Organization.

 

[Cory]

I dont know i like to treat my body like a fish tank. "No more flouride than exists in nature". Lol

 

[Cory]

Heres a link that freaks me out

http://powerpointparadise.com/fluoride.htm

 

[JimWelsh]

One question that the skeptic in me asks, just for starters, is: Who wrote this?

Maybe I'm missing something, but I can't tell. Unattributed BS. Please consider the source.

 

[Cory]

Yeah i kind of doubted that too. So i whent looking for scholarly articles:

Male rabbit reproductive difficulties from flouride
http://m.reproduction-online.org/content/92/2/353.short

Flouride excess and perostitis
http://m.cid.oxfordjournals.org/content/52/5/604.short

And tons more, just do a search:
https://scholar.google.ca/scholar?s...+scholarly+articles&hl=en&as_sdt=0,5&as_vis=1

 

[JimWelsh]

What is the relevance of the first two papers you cite, both discussing extremely high fluoride exposure, to the subject of fluoridation levels in public water supplies?

 

[Cory]

Ok fair enough. Heres one that stated drinking water with flouride causes nerotoxicity in children:

Conclusions
This pilot study in a community with stable lifetime fluoride exposures supports the notion that fluoride in drinking water may produce developmental neurotoxicity, and that the dose-dependence underlying this relationship needs to be characterized in detail.

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/features/fluoride-childrens-health-grandjean-choi/

Do you have some sort of vested interest in flouride Jim?

 

[JimWelsh]

I have no vested interest in fluoride.

Have you read the paper behind the article you posted? It can be found here http://ehp.niehs.nih.gov/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/ehp.1104912.pdf. I was going to respond directly, but then I found that other people have already responded elsewhere online to the article you linked better than I could, saying a lot of the things I was going to say. You can find their response here: http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Water_fluoridation#How_to_actually_read_studies.

 

[Cory]

Well then drinking water even at normal levels at 1ppm is very over a natural level. Flouride levels in the great lakes range from .04-.14mg/l. And in sure due to fertilizer runoff which are composed some of flour are increasing that natural concentration which humans would consume.

Obviously people dont drink seawater with 1ppm flouride, thats why in showing lakewater flouride.

Why are you so "pro- flouride" Jim?

Dont you find it strange its added to a municipal water supply? Why not charge for it if its so good for us? Why give it for free?

 

[Neptunes Cove]

umm, if you use filtered water- you shouldn't have fluoride...

 

[JimWelsh]

Well then drinking water even at normal levels at 1ppm is very over a natural level.

Quite true, because natural levels are not efficacious to prevent tooth decay, and the elevated levels are. The "Appeal to nature" fallacy is already covered in the RationalWiki link I shared above: http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Appeal_to_nature

Why are you so "pro- flouride" Jim?

I am no more "pro-fluoride" than I am "pro-round-earth", "pro-vaccine", or "pro-moon-landing-really-happened". Please just label me "pro-rational-thought."

Dont you find it strange its added to a municipal water supply?

No, again because of its proven safety and efficacy. Please see http://www.cdc.gov/fluoridation/.

Why not charge for it if its so good for us? Why give it for free?

Again, the RationalWiki article I linked addresses this: "It is also extremely cost-effective: one study estimated that for every $1 a city invested in fluoridation it saved the average citizen (with a mean dental health cost) $38 on dental care." The cost to provide municipal water fluoridation to one citizen for a lifetime is less than the cost of a single dental filling. Fluoride is exceptionally cost-effective! It's just a wise use of tax dollars as a part of responsible governing.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I dont know i like to treat my body like a fish tank. "No more flouride than exists in nature". Lol

Well, then you should be happy, because current fluoride guidelines suggest added fluoride should be just a bit less than is present in seawater.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Randy im curious what is your opinion about flouridation of tap water?

FWIW, I think the benefits outweigh any detriments at the recommended dose (not necessarily so at higher doses).

Chlorine can do very bad things too. Just ask the soldiers in the trenches of WWI.

But it is still useful in tap water.

 

[Cory]

Dam, i think i officially lost this battle lol

 

[jackson6745]

Useful in tap water? Recommended doses? I was unaware of of the recommend drinking dosage of tap water. Toothpaste tubes say if you swallow more than a pea sized amount contact poison control

 

[Cory]

Psst i still think its bad for you

I agree it says that alarming info about contactin poison control lol. In fact, why not just brush teeth for flouride. Whats the sense to put it in water?

Jim i was thinking, how you said its so cheap so why not dose it, but what comes to my mind is i read that its a waste product from aluminum industry, and nuclear power plants. Strange.