PE extention

[Saltgator]

Can someone point me in the direction (I'm pretty sure there's a thread already) on what causes lack of PE? Half of my sps frags have no PE, but 2 of my monties do. Also, (maybe same underling issue), but 2 frags have RTN'd. Thanks


Btw, before you ask:
240 DT w/55 sump, 100% led at 70% (all sps are middle to lower for adjustment from previous owners lights), no bio load (fish still in hypo from ich 9 weeks ago), nitrates and nitrites read 0, phosphate is at 0.01, Cal is 430, Alk is 10, medium flow on all corals, DT is well established and lps, clams, 2 nems, pods x a billion, bristle worms x 100ish, anything else, please ask.

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[sutton6989]

Could it possibly be flow? I had some sps that had little PE then I got another PH and they opened up a lot more.. just a thought..maybe they want strong flow.

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[Saltgator]

Could it possibly be flow? I had some sps that had little PE then I got another PH and they opened up a lot more.. just a thought..maybe they want strong flow.

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I've tried a stronger flow and almost no flow, each for 3+ days (all redirecting the flow, not moving the coral) and had no new results. Now they get a medium alternating flow.

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[kuyatwo]

might inspect your corals for red bugs and pests

 

[Saltgator]

might inspect your corals for red bugs and pests

I inspected them prior, but will do again. Some of these frags came from locals and looked great (full PE) in their frag tanks, but nothing now and they were there prior to any other frags.

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[Saltgator]

Bumping for evening crew thoughts

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[Me z]

The no fish in the system is likely the cause of the tissue loss. Amonia nitrate (fish pee and poop) is an essential element for zoanthale (just another kind of plant) to grow normally. If there is insuficent nutrients the coral cant sustain itself so it will start to die back to point where the nutrients are able to sustain the zoanthale population again. PE ive noticed in my system is linked to light I had a thread on here with the same issue. When I had really high par I had less polyp extension as I have decreased the par in my tank the polyps are more present in the sps corals. Try taking a milli or bottle brush acro if you have one and put it in a really shaded area on bottom of the tank and watch it for a couple days and see if the PE increases. If so its an issue of too much light and the polyps dont need to reach. Really simple experiment with minimal risk to your acro. Good luck hope you get it sorted. Always no fun when the corals wont cooperate!

 

[chort55]

might inspect your corals for red bugs and pests

I agree, and despite looking good in others tanks those tanks also had fish which may have helped keep the #'s in check to lessen the issue, since you have no fish they are free to multiply and irritate/ damage coral at will. I have received coral from a local that was covered in redbugs, but looked great until I put them in my tank and my 6 wrasses didnt eat as many as his 13... I now dip and interceptor everything.

#s don't look bad, only thing I could really think of besides pests would be lack of food. SPS like fish poo, with no fish in the tank are you feeding anything or having them rely on light and cal/alk... alone? Also, are you doing any carbon dosing (vinegar/sugar/vodka...), biopellets or something similar? if so w/o fish u may have the water too striped and starving them.

 

[Aquaph8]

Brad, for whats it worth I haven't had any fish in my tank for a couple months and my PE is normal still. I believe they extend more when they're hungry. Look at them after the lights are out and see if they are any better, mine have always had better PE at night. If they are semi new to you maybe they just need to settle in for a while.

The red bugs thing is also a good possibility for no PE, look real close cause they're tiny.

 

[Saltgator]

Thanks Brett and others. I'll take a look and see if i can see any with my magnifying glass (lol) and I'll try shading a no PE one. My 2 encrusted monties have beautiful PE, but nothing else has it. I feed my mag nem every 3 days and feed the entire system (pods) reef chili every 4-5 days. I did start Bio pellets this week (about 20% recommended), but RTN and no PE prior. I'm trying to get the pellets started prior to shocking the system with the Bio load of the fish returning.

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[Saltgator]

Forgot to mention too, no PE at night (checked last few nights).

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[Saltgator]

Well after a close watch on the corals, something is bothering them, but I can't see anything. Unfortunately I can't treat them until tomorrow after work. It just so happens that I have Bayer insecticide in the garage and will dip tomorrow. Probably going to do 8ml to 1/2 cup. 2 questions though: do I remove the corals from the frag plug and anyone know why pods are covering these sps corals (the ones that don't appear happy)?

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[clowndude]

I had the same issue until recently I figured it out. I started feeding my sps and their color came back and PE is better than ever. Try two weeks of feeding your coral at night twice a week. I noticed a difference within a week with the PE and color within two weeks. Currently I'm using coral frenzy, but I hear oystery feast is really good and I will be trying that this week.

 

[Me z]

Well after a close watch on the corals, something is bothering them, but I can't see anything. Unfortunately I can't treat them until tomorrow after work. It just so happens that I have Bayer insecticide in the garage and will dip tomorrow. Probably going to do 8ml to 1/2 cup. 2 questions though: do I remove the corals from the frag plug and anyone know why pods are covering these sps corals (the ones that don't appear happy)?

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Pods can irratate corals even softies like zoanthids. If you have a big population add a mandarin or my favorite inhabitant the dragon faced pipefish. Not only will do they eat pods but if you do end up with redbugs in your tank the dragon face will eat them. I dip all acro frags but I like having them in my tank as extra insurance. The only "pod" that will eat your acros that I know of is red bugs. Also this sounds counterintuitive but again thinking in the hobby stays the same even when technology advances. If you are using a calcium reactor and dont have nitrate or phosphate problems ease off the water changes a bit. Sounds like bad advice but the guys I know with the best sps tanks around do few if any water changes retailers and hobbyists alike. This is my buddy martys tank Marty1 - YouTube one of the guys that does 0 water changes and a guy who has been in the hobby a long time kinda my informal journeyman to the trade. I am another that doesnt do water changes my tank isnt as grown out as martys but I have zero algae problems, zero disease, zero problems of any kind. Lots of guys will argue with this advice but I am offering proof that if you maintain alk, calc, and mag and keep low nitrate and po4 whats the point in a water change? Remember in days gone by those were the reasons for doing them and times and tech have certainly changed. Good luck!

 

[Saltgator]

I had the same issue until recently I figured it out. I started feeding my sps and their color came back and PE is better than ever. Try two weeks of feeding your coral at night twice a week. I noticed a difference within a week with the PE and color within two weeks. Currently I'm using coral frenzy, but I hear oystery feast is really good and I will be trying that this week.

Thanks clowndude. I just started on Tuesday feeding reef chili, but only my acans and meat corals respond. I'll keep up the feeding even after the dip.

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[Saltgator]

Pods can irratate corals even softies like zoanthids. If you have a big population add a mandarin or my favorite inhabitant the dragon faced pipefish. Not only will do they eat pods but if you do end up with redbugs in your tank the dragon face will eat them. I dip all acro frags but I like having them in my tank as extra insurance. The only "pod" that will eat your acros that I know of is red bugs. Also this sounds counterintuitive but again thinking in the hobby stays the same even when technology advances. If you are using a calcium reactor and dont have nitrate or phosphate problems ease off the water changes a bit. Sounds like bad advice but the guys I know with the best sps tanks around do few if any water changes retailers and hobbyists alike. This is my buddy martys tank Marty1 - YouTube one of the guys that does 0 water changes and a guy who has been in the hobby a long time kinda my informal journeyman to the trade. I am another that doesnt do water changes my tank isnt as grown out as martys but I have zero algae problems, zero disease, zero problems of any kind. Lots of guys will argue with this advice but I am offering proof that if you maintain alk, calc, and mag and keep low nitrate and po4 whats the point in a water change? Remember in days gone by those were the reasons for doing them and times and tech have certainly changed. Good luck!

Even if it's bad practice, I haven't done WC's (unless the nitrate level went up) in some time. The pods were (to my knowledge or eyes) almost wiped out when I had a potter's wrasses. Without any fish in the system, the pods and bristle worm population has exploded. Really wanting flame wrasses, I was trying to avoid the other wrasses that hunt 24/7 and keep the DT almost bug free (mystery, sixline, yellow coris), but looks vs health of my system might be a factor. I want a mandarin, but finding a healthy one can be a chore and if given the chance, I believe a pipe fish might go for my overflow. My overflow has 1/4 gaps, so nothing small or it's going to the sump.

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[Saltgator]

Anybody think standard pods eat red bugs when food is scarce? Just a thought.

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[Saltgator]

Dip started (we'll see what happens). Something already has come off my monti cap (whitish looking, spiked thing. Sorry, can't see or tell exactly what or how to describe it yet).

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[Me z]

I wouldnt worry about the pipe fish I have two mp40s a 2,500gph return with a sea swirl and a koralia 4 for flow in my tank and my overflow has 1/4" gaps at the top as well. The tend to hang around the rock and frag racks getting pods. Pods wouldnt openly attack anything healthy. If corals are sick and dying they will definatley make the most of it and eat the tissue. red bugs are technically a pod that likes smoothskinned acros (wont eat millis or prostratas to my knowledge).

 

[Saltgator]

I wouldnt worry about the pipe fish I have two mp40s a 2,500gph return with a sea swirl and a koralia 4 for flow in my tank and my overflow has 1/4" gaps at the top as well. The tend to hang around the rock and frag racks getting pods. Pods wouldnt openly attack anything healthy. If corals are sick and dying they will definatley make the most of it and eat the tissue. red bugs are technically a pod that likes smoothskinned acros (wont eat millis or prostratas to my knowledge).

Thanks. I'll look into them.