PH & SPS

[chefmur]

I am back in the hobby after several years, had a very successful SPS system back 5 years ago and I changed jobs , moved etc. and decided to get back in. I set up a Red Sea reefer several months ago and all is well , great flow, Radion lighting , Apex controlled all parameters are in line. I am a little disappointed in growth with frags, good color and polyp extension but practically no growth after several months. The only thing I can think is I have low PH , 7.5 during evening ( I have refugium on reverse light cycle ) 7.8 during day. We built a new house , very energy efficient as my power bills are half of my old house so I am assuming not enough fresh air. I do not have the option to hook skimmer to outside as the tank is on central wall in the house. What about a CO2 Scrubber ,I heard the media can get expensive and needs changing constantly. any thoughts/suggestions are appreciated.
Mike

 

[Macdaddynick1]

I am back in the hobby after several years, had a very successful SPS system back 5 years ago and I changed jobs , moved etc. and decided to get back in. I set up a Red Sea reefer several months ago and all is well , great flow, Radion lighting , Apex controlled all parameters are in line. I am a little disappointed in growth with frags, good color and polyp extension but practically no growth after several months. The only thing I can think is I have low PH , 7.5 during evening ( I have refugium on reverse light cycle ) 7.8 during day. We built a new house , very energy efficient as my power bills are half of my old house so I am assuming not enough fresh air. I do not have the option to hook skimmer to outside as the tank is on central wall in the house. What about a CO2 Scrubber ,I heard the media can get expensive and needs changing constantly. any thoughts/suggestions are appreciated.
Mike

Anytime my ph dips below 7.8 I am almost guaranteed to see some stn/ rtn. A lot of people say ph doesn’t matter but it does. The way to fix it is to dose kalkwasser every hour during the night, just match your evaporation rate and take your ato offline

 

[chefmur]

How does adding Kalk work with my current dosing of 2 part

 

[ycnibrc]

Dosing kalk will definite help. U can try to reduce 2 parts with dosing kalk and adjust the 2 parts to get your desire alk n cal. Kalk has a ph of 12 so definitely it will raise your ph.

 

[DesertReefT4r]

I was going to suggest kalk as well. Just stop using 2 part all together and replace it with kalk. IME kal is cheaper and easier than 2 part for supplementing ca and alk. Has the added benefit of increasing Ph and also binds po4. The other choices for increasing Ph you already mentioned, air line outside, Co2 scrubber and running fuge light opposite the display lighting. Oh increasing surface agitation to promote better gas exchange can help a little.
You can do a test to see if you low Ph is Co2 related. Take a cup of tank water outside and run an air pump and air stone in it for 1-2 hours, test the tank Ph and right away test the Ph of the water you took outside to oxygenate. If the outside water has increase in Ph the you know for sure its a Co2 issue.
@Randy Holmes Farley can better help you on chemistry issues.

 

[Reef of Fillory]

I am back in the hobby after several years, had a very successful SPS system back 5 years ago and I changed jobs , moved etc. and decided to get back in. I set up a Red Sea reefer several months ago and all is well , great flow, Radion lighting , Apex controlled all parameters are in line. I am a little disappointed in growth with frags, good color and polyp extension but practically no growth after several months. The only thing I can think is I have low PH , 7.5 during evening ( I have refugium on reverse light cycle ) 7.8 during day. We built a new house , very energy efficient as my power bills are half of my old house so I am assuming not enough fresh air. I do not have the option to hook skimmer to outside as the tank is on central wall in the house. What about a CO2 Scrubber ,I heard the media can get expensive and needs changing constantly. any thoughts/suggestions are appreciated.
Mike

I didn't like Kalk when I gave it a try, I prefer to stick with 2-part dosing. On my last tank I ran a CO2 scrubber made out of a dual BRS media reactor tied to my skimmer air intake, with the air "pulling" from an elbow that I attached to the skimmer cup [to bring in moist/humid air]. My media before tying in to the skimmer cup lasted around 4 days per canister, and after the adjustment lasted 3-4 weeks.

A CO2 scrubber will certainly work. I purchased my media in bulk from shopmedvet. It's medical grade scrubber material used in hospitals.

My current nano tank is suffering from low pH after closing up my windows and running the A/C, so i've ordered a skimmer for it purely to run a CO2 scrubber and increase my pH levels. I'll be using a Two Little Fishies Phosban 150 reactor filled with the mentioned media, feeding the skimmer air intake.

Good luck!

 

[biophilia]

What's your alkalinity at? pH will be higher at any given indoor CO2 level as alkalinity gets higher. Before investing in a CO2 scrubber, consider slowly ramping your alk up to a higher level (say 10.5-DKH) over the course of a couple weeks and use kalkwasser in your ATO instead of 2 part dosing. Those two changes alone should get your pH up into a reasonable range (7.8 at night and over 8 during the day). Higher alk will boost your SPS growth rate by as much as 50% as well. Keep in mind, you need slightly more detectable nitrates and phosphates in the water at higher alkalinity to keep color and avoid tip burn in SPS so make sure you're in range (say >5 ppm NO3 and at least 0.03ppm PO4.

As for the transition from 2-part to kalkwasser, I'm not sure of an exact formula, but a good start would be to stop dosing two part and add 1 tsp kalkwasser per gallon of ATO water. Check your alkalinity once or twice per day and adjust accordingly. Fully saturated kalkwasser is 2 tsp per gallon, though you can go as high as 3 tsp/gallon by adding 45ml/gallon vinegar if needed. Note: never use kalkwasser to raise your alkalinity as it will spike pH too high. If you need to get your alkalinity up, use 2 part and then maintain it at that level with kalk.

Randy Holmes Farley's article on low pH is a must read! http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-09/rhf/

 

[biophilia]

Also consider picking up a second pH test kit by another manufacturer. A pH of 7.5 seems suspiciously low even in an energy-efficient home...

 

[bubbaque]

My suggestion is just let your ph be. You can do more harm chasing ph than just letting it go where you tank takes it. I get good sps growth and my ph goes from 7.65 to 7.95 during the day.

If you do decide to try and raise it, the easiest way would be using kalkwasser and just starting slow to find your consumption rate. If you have a way to add a line to the skimmer to the outside to get fresh air also may help. Using a co2 scrubber can get expensive replacing the media but it also a good way to raise it also.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I didn't like Kalk when I gave it a try, I prefer to stick with 2-part dosing. On my last tank I ran a CO2 scrubber made out of a dual BRS media reactor tied to my skimmer air intake, with the air "pulling" from an elbow that I attached to the skimmer cup [to bring in moist/humid air]. My media before tying in to the skimmer cup lasted around 4 days per canister, and after the adjustment lasted 3-4 weeks.

A CO2 scrubber will certainly work. I purchased my media in bulk from shopmedvet. It's medical grade scrubber material used in hospitals.

My current nano tank is suffering from low pH after closing up my windows and running the A/C, so i've ordered a skimmer for it purely to run a CO2 scrubber and increase my pH levels. I'll be using a Two Little Fishies Phosban 150 reactor filled with the mentioned media, feeding the skimmer air intake.

Good luck!

I'm not sure why you didn't like limewater/kalkwasser, but one can make a DIY two part with equal pH boost to limewater using one of these recipes:

Second New DIY Two Part Recipe with Higher pH Boost
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/second-new-diy-two-part-recipe-with-higher-ph-boost.357080/

and

New DIY Two Part Recipes with Higher pH Boost
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/new-diy-two-part-recipes-with-higher-ph-boost.344500/

 

[chefmur]

Thank all great suggestions. I did order scrubber from BRS only $40 so will see how that works. I use my Apex to test PH and it’s new so calibrated, maybe worth picking up test kit to double check .

 

[jda]

Before you do anything, you need to make sure that your PH is really that low. Are you sure that you are not still cycling a bit? 7.5 at night is really hard to do. Even in a really closed up, high CO2 home, 7.8 at night and 8.0 during the day is not hard to achieve.

The is a great time of year to open some windows for some fresh air. If this helps, then you really do have a problem that might need solving. If it does not help, then your method of testing is probably not accurate.