Phospates High HIGH

[helldiver]

My Phosphates range from .15-.30 Hanna tester;I have been trying everything I know to get Phosphates down
Reef tank 8 fish 140 total system volume
My System. 15lbs of Miracle Mud; 10 Mangroves; Small ATS; Regal 200sss skimmer; 250 ML GFO in reactor PO4x4.Not getting any growth from corals
I feed once daily pellet food.
What else can I do to get my phosphates down to target range .01- .03

 

[ClownnGoby]

Maybe try Red Sea nopox or some other carbon dosing system ,
How long has the tank been set up ?

I never used miracle mud so I can't comment on that but I would say something is leaching po4
Maybe your live rock .
Do u do weekly water changes ?
Blow off rocks weekly ?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

There are lots of good ways to reduce phosphate, and if there is no big apparent problem (such as algae), it may also not be necessary.

I discuss phosphate reduction here:

Phosphate In The Reef Aquarium
https://www.reef2reef.com/blog/?p=3184

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

.15-.30

thats not that high. How old is the tank?
I have to disagree on it stunting coral growth if it hits those numbers for a while. Randys article actually outlines what high number do.
More likely it just equilibrium problems your having.
.Are you running caulerpa in the Mud fuge? or any chato. From what I have read mangroves are not as good at nutrient reduction and export due to slower growth rate.
Chato i do know from experience will strip the water pretty fast. And the Caulerpa taxifolia i think it is , is recommended in miracle mud methods for the same reason.

I had to rehab a tank earlier this year due to high No and Po. I used higher lighting and a refugium, and a higher coral bioload to reduce the numbers along with bacterial supplements.
With more available nutrients, I increased photosynthesis to increase uptake (and remove), those available nutrients. good flow is also a necessity in both plants and coral to do it too.

 

[NanoDJS]

I would also agree about the caulerpa though I run prolifera and im 0 across the boards with daily feedings of mysis rots and cyclops plus the natural wc stuff, I have seen rock leech for years and also remove any dead coral bone and dont use that to mount on also my mud system is 10 lbs / 40 gallons volume this works very well for me going on 2 years now

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

I would also agree about the caulerpa though I run prolifera and im 0 across the boards with daily feedings of mysis rots and cyclops plus the natural wc stuff, I have seen rock leech for years and also remove any dead coral bone and dont use that to mount on also my mud system is 10 lbs / 40 gallons volume this works very well for me going on 2 years now

is it the prolifera that's recommended in th ecosystem method? I forget.

 

[twilliard]

How much per day and what type of pellet are you feeding?
A great way to introduce Po4 is from dried flake and pellets. (I have to feed my tank 3-4 times a day to keep no3 and po4 up)

 

[CodyRVA]

+1 @Randy, if you're not having algae/bacterial issues I wouldn't get too excited. How often are you changing the GFO and how much flow do you have going through your reactor? How's your skimmer performing? Cora growth may very well be unrelated.

 

[BigJim]

You may also want to check the cuvettes you are using with the Hanna Checker for scratches. I was reading .10 with my old Hanna Phosphate Checker and noticed a lot of scratches on the cuvettes. My phosphate measured .01 - .02 after I replaced the cuvettes.

 

[jason2459]

I find algae harvesting and/or carbon dosing to be good at maintaining lower phosphates.

For very high phosohates I used Lanthanum Chloride. Briefly to bring levels to just high. GFO would exhaust itself to fast to be practical IMO.

Then use GFO to bring PO4 down the rest of the way to maintenance levels. This could take some time as phosphates could remain leaching out of rocks or substrate that it may be bound up in.

During that GFO phase is when I would start using Carbon dosing with something like vinegar or vodka or a combination of both. Before this phase you'll end up being nitrate limited and if you have pretty corals they could go pale or bleach. Eventually you may be able to reduce or stop GFO usage. Some people may need to keep using small amounts. Make sure to not strip out to much (nitrates and phosphates) unless you really do want to run an ULNS.

At any stage I would do some kind of algae harvesting. Either Macro in a fuge or an ATS.

I currently run a Turbo's Aquatics ATS, carbon dose, and a nice skimmer as my main means of PO4 control. I use to use straight vinegar and switched to vinegar vodka. Just recently I just switched back to straight vinegar.

 

[helldiver]

I have noticed using vinegar brings phos down but it drops ph and do not like it i think u are on to something yes right now my gfo is only lasting a week so i was thinking of using lanthum chloride also. And increasibg gfo
So you think it is my rock keeping phos high i think i am going to change gfo and go with 500ml of po4x4. I want to eventually not use that much gfo

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

you don't believe the macro algaes work as efficiently.

 

[jason2459]

I have noticed using vinegar brings phos down but it drops ph and do not like it i think u are on to something yes right now my gfo is only lasting a week so i was thinking of using lanthum chloride also. And increasibg gfo
So you think it is my rock keeping phos high i think i am going to change gfo and go with 500ml of po4x4. I want to eventually not use that much gfo

You don't want to bollus dose vinegar. Vodka can be ok. You generally want to spread it out through out the day.

I dose my vinegar 10 times through out the day using a BRS 1.1ml/m peristaltic pump.
Fallback OFF
Set OFF
OSC 051:41/008:19/000:00 Then ON
If Time 21:00 to 11:00 Then OFF
If Outlet vPH_Low_C8 = ON Then OFF

This causes very little pH impact and in the end its a wash.

If your PO4 is still that high I would wager your GFO is exhausting much sooner then a week.

If you use Lanthanum I would suggest making sure you have a way to filter out the precipitation and use very small amounts at a time over a few days. It can strip PO4 to much to fast.

 

[helldiver]

I do have a small amount of chato in sump are in a filter bag. Beacuse it kept cloggibg up my baffles

 

[jason2459]

you don't believe the macro algaes work as efficiently.

I believe it can work just fine. I like any kind of algae harvesting methods.

I do have a small amount of chato in sump are in a filter bag. Beacuse it kept cloggibg up my baffles

That is not the best way to grow algae especially chaeto. Chaeto likes flow and light. D2mini has a great example of the perfect chaeto setup.

http://www.everydayreef.com/blog/2015/6/6/chaetomorpha-algae

 

[helldiver]

My phos are currently at .25 i have read some where to does vinegar multiple time a day works best cause it feed bacteria and wipes phos si how many mills do you dose divided by 10 and what kind of punp do u use

 

[jason2459]

My phos are currently at .25 i have read some where to does vinegar multiple time a day works best cause it feed bacteria and wipes phos si how many mills do you dose divided by 10 and what kind of punp do u use

My vinegar dosing is described above. I use an apex to power on and off an outlet I have a Bulkreefsupply 1.1mL/m peristaltic pump on. The pump pulls directly from a vinegar bottle I shove a line into.

 

[jason2459]

And just an FYI many report the BRS 1.1ml/m peristaltic pump actually is faster then that. I've never tested mine. I just kept jumping up in dosage until I had an over abundance of bacteria and lowered it a bit at a time until my PO4 was in a range I liked.

 

[helldiver]

Ty

 

[ClownnGoby]

Zeovit is another good way to drop p04 but can be expensive option ,