Phosphate in fresh Tropic Marin Pro Salt Mix

[psumms]

Had a bump in PO4 for the past two weeks, been monitoring but not coming down. I auto-water change 10% / 25 gallons a week split over the seven days and have approx. 30 gallons mixed each Sunday for the coming week using RODI and Tropic Marin Pro salt - Have been doing this for a couple of years without issue. Just PO4 tested the fresh salt mix with my Hannah Phos URL - and got 0.07ppm! I articles with people reporting similar issues with Red Sea salt but no real explanation. I've not tested my RODI as I don't believe the Hanna will work on freshwater? Anyone else had a similar issue and found a cause?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I'm not sure if that is real or not, but it is insignificant to the tank phosphate.

A 10% change only adds 0.007 ppm phosphate, while foods at far more, like 0.02 to 0.2 ppm every day.

 

[Marine Life]

Most likely Rodi unit.

 

[psumms]

Anyone know if the Hanna will give accurate readings with fresh water?

 

[Marine Life]

Anyone know if the Hanna will give accurate readings with fresh water?

It won't...

 

[Sthomp01]

I just checked my phosphate level of a fresh batch of tropic marine salt and got .08. That seems a little high for a new mix of salt water.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I just checked my phosphate level of a fresh batch of tropic marine salt and got .08. That seems a little high for a new mix of salt water.

It is most likely test error, or from your source water.

 

[FreeEnergyReefer]

You aren't the only one saying they're getting. .08 from freshly mixed saltwater using tropic marin

 

[psumms]

I always thought Tropic Marin Pro was super 'clean', I used to use Red Sea, after a few weeks i'd have a layer of brown crap in the bottom of my mixing / storage tank. In the last six months, i'm now seeing that with my Tropic Marin Pro salt, i'm sure it didn't do this when I first switched. I wonder if this is the source of the phos.

 

[windemerejack]

Lots of sources about po4 in tropic marin salt, its not so much the amount but the fact it is advertised as 0 po4 which is not true,
A member on a uk site had an email ftom tropic marin confirming po4 is present.
Quantum salt | Page 8 | Ultimate Reef
Its post 159

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

IMO, those values are insignificant. Foods add far more every day.

 

[windemerejack]

IMO, those values are insignificant. Foods add far more every day.

I agree and wouldnt use any other salt but knowing it has po4 in it and advertise as zero is a bit naughty

 

[Dr. Jim]

I always thought Tropic Marin Pro was super 'clean', I used to use Red Sea, after a few weeks i'd have a layer of brown crap in the bottom of my mixing / storage tank. In the last six months, i'm now seeing that with my Tropic Marin Pro salt, i'm sure it didn't do this when I first switched. I wonder if this is the source of the phos.

I had a lot of brown-black build-up from my last bucket of T.M.Pro. It seems OK with a new bucket. This is what I was told from T.M. when I sent them a photo. (Note: my tank is in a dark room which would tend to rule out algae/cyano):

"It definitely does not look like any kind of precipitate. It absolutely has the look of something biological. It could be cyano bacterial growth, if the holding tank is exposed to light during a period of holding. Or it could, more likely, be some kind of algae growth. It could also be manganese precipitates induced by bacterial oxidation. This means a biofilm of bacteria covers the insides of the tank. After adding our salts, which contain slightly elevated concentrations of iron and manganese, these trace metals get precipitated and form this dark film together with the bacterial biofilm. Finally this is exactly the mechanism by which both trace metals are removed from the saltwater after adding it to the display tank, so the elevated concentrations from the salt cannot be found in the display tanks.
If we are correct about any of this, it should not show up directly at the time of mixing, but some hours or maybe even days later. A good cleaning of the mixing tank and using of new batches of salt water solution soon after they are mixed, should make it that this issue does not show up again so soon."

 

[Reef.]

Weird as I thought the reason my PO4 shot up was because I missed a couple of weeks water changes as the LFS didn’t have my salt I stock, I couldn’t wait any longer so swapped to Tropic Marin pro, this coincided with a high raise in PO4?
Could be down to missed water changes or over feeding but this thread has me wondering now.

I have been using phosguard and sometimes rowaphos but the PO4 doesn’t seem to move, I also do a lot of water changes? I could be adding PO4 as fast as I’m removing it.

 

[RVA REEF]

lol save 60 bux and get IO

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Weird as I thought the reason my PO4 shot up was because I missed a couple of weeks water changes as the LFS didn’t have my salt I stock, I couldn’t wait any longer so swapped to Tropic Marin pro, this coincided with a high raise in PO4?
Could be down to missed water changes or over feeding but this thread has me wondering now.

I have been using phosguard and sometimes rowaphos but the PO4 doesn’t seem to move, I also do a lot of water changes? I could be adding PO4 as fast as I’m removing it.

Salt mixes are never the primary source of phosphate (unless possibly if you do a lot of water changes with tap water that is 1 ppm plus in phosphate). Foods are far, far higher, and water changes are rarely effective at lowering phosphate, even when none is in the new water. Even a 100% water change will not drop phosphate all that much becuase so much of the total is held in a reservoir bound to rock and sand.

 

[Reef.]

Salt mixes are never the primary source of phosphate (unless possibly if you do a lot of water changes with tap water that is 1 ppm plus in phosphate). Foods are far, far higher, and water changes are rarely effective at lowering phosphate, even when none is in the new water. Even a 100% water change will not drop phosphate all that much becuase so much of the total is held in a reservoir bound to rock and sand.

Thanks, I guess then the phosguard in a media bag is not that effective.

 

[Kfactor]

If it does have po4 all be happy my po4 is always bottomed out lol I just got my first Pail of it lol

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Thanks, I guess then the phosguard in a media bag is not that effective.

Binders can be a good way to reduce it, since they constantly pull it out of the water.

 

[Jmp998]

I am seeing this also with new bucket of Tropic Marin Pro Reef. I occasionally check my fresh salt mix basically to confirm that my Hanna Phosphorus ULR checker is working correctly, a check on my RODI unit, and for comparison to my tank results. I have never seen it read above 3 with a fresh mix, which is effectively 0 given the instrument error. With this fresh bucket of salt I read around 20 after testing multiple times (equivalent to .06 PPM phosphate). I had a little of the old salt left and confirmed that it mixes to zero with the same RODI water. Per Randy’s calculations this is insignificant compared to the phosphate addition from food, and I will keep using the salt for now. However it does raise the issue of whether there may be other ‘contaminants’ in this batch of salt, and makes me question my choice to spend more on a supposedly premium salt mix.