Planning my expandable 60g cube(s) setup

[Mandelstam]

Hey! First post here. Good to be here!

I've been binge reading and watching YT on reef tank setup and maintenance for the last few weeks. I've always thought that reef tanks needed to be these super large tanks with equipment worth thousands of dollars. Quite recently I discovered that it doesn't need to be that way, you can have succesful setups that are quite small and where the startup cost doesn't require all of your life's savings. That was when I decided that I would pursue my dream of having a reef tank. So I started planning..

My plan is to start with a 60g cube display where I can start with the easier stuff that doesn't require the high end equipment and lighting and so on, and there learn the craft so to speak. If and when I want to progress from there my idea is to have planned the setup so that I can add another 60g cube to the existing system. The stand, sump, plumbing, etc, should be planned out so that I don't have to tear everything apart and start over to add tank no 2 to the system. I'm not a rich man either and this way seems like a good way to start pretty basic and then gradually add and upgrade.

Image below showing fase one with one 60g cube and the sump.

Image below showing fase two with two 60g cubes on the stand.

Last night I wanted to see if all the plumbing from two tanks would fit under the stand and how to plan it out so that I wouldn't have to redo the plumbing from tank no one to fit the new pipes. With a beananimal style overflow and a return, that's a total of eight pipes between the tanks and the sump in a pretty small area...

Here's the plumbing for fase one (from overflow in red, return pipe in green)

And here's the plumbing for fase two (added plumbing in orange, existing in grey)

I haven't put in any baffles or equipment in the sump yet. But as the sump potentially can be quite big, at least for a 60g tank, I was thinking of running a refugium with some good lighting on it as it will have the space for it. If I get that running well I've been thinking of starting with the Triton method down the road.

I haven't decided on a specific size for the sump, I think I'll keep my eye out for a second hand tank that will fit underneath the stand and customize that. The one in the pictures is about 50g (total volume).

I just wanted to throw my idea and plans out here and see if maybe there are any pitfalls or concerns that I should be aware of with a dual display setup like this. For me it seems the optimal way, I live in an apartment and don't have a lot of space. This way I can start pretty small and expand from there without having to start over completely once I want to expand. Having two tanks would also allow me to play around with two completely different types of habitats and types of corals etc.

Again, thanks for having me, good to be here! Any comments, warnings, etc, are very appreciated!

 

[40B Knasty]

I only see one problem. You will have roughly 480lbs of weight on one side of a stand just from water. Which could make that stand very wobbly. 60gx8lbs per gallon. Then add another 480lbs to the other side later on. Then you will have to make sure it is all leveled again, because you don't want a stress fracture to happen. I have had a 40B crack down the middle due to that. It is a nightmare! Just my 2¢

 

[Mandelstam]

I only see one problem. You will have roughly 480lbs of weight on one side of a stand just from water. Which could make that stand very wobbly. 60gx8lbs per gallon. Then add another 480lbs to the other side later on. Then you will have to make sure it is all leveled again, because you don't want a stress fracture to happen. I have had a 40B crack down the middle due to that. It is a nightmare! Just my 2¢

Good point! I will have to look into that when i plan the stand. The one in the pics are pretty beefy already, I don't think it will be wobbly. But it can be stiffened up even more I'm sure. The uprights will be double 2x4 and the upper and lower frame single 2x4's. Then the back and side panels (plywood or OSB board) screwed to that. But I understand your concerns. I have a coworker who is a structural engineer who I can discuss it with further.

The levelling is another good point. I think maybe when adding the second tank the best way would be to temporarily empty a large amount from the first tank and then gradually fill both up again at the same time being careful to shim as needed.

Thanks for great input!

 

[40B Knasty]

Good point! I will have to look into that when i plan the stand. The one in the pics are pretty beefy already, I don't think it will be wobbly. But it can be stiffened up even more I'm sure. The uprights will be double 2x4 and the upper and lower frame single 2x4's. Then the back and side panels (plywood or OSB board) screwed to that. But I understand your concerns. I have a coworker who is a structural engineer who I can discuss it with further.

The levelling is another good point. I think maybe when adding the second tank the best way would be to temporarily empty a large amount from the first tank and then gradually fill both up again at the same time being careful to shim as needed.

Thanks for great input!

I hope your build goes swimmingly
I can not tell you how many times in just one year I have made "improvements." Ya kind of want to build around the fish and coral placement, but there is always maintenance. Like the glass work. Fish it is a matter of swimming space and where they sleep. Say if you wanted to get a tang or wrasse. You limit your fish with 2 tanks. If you had one tank the length of 2. Now you have expanded your limit to what kind of fish. 3 feet is not very good at all for a tang and barely good enough for a dwarf angel or wrasse. If you are looking at 2 tanks with 2 feet of spaces per tank. You have probably lessened your options for a fish choice by 2/3. If you have 4 feet+ of length. Your fish choice for a tang, wrasse, & dwarf angel is greater. Maybe even a non dwarf angel. Then you can have a few wrasse or a few tangs. You can be happy with the build all you want, but what is on the inside will tell ya what you did wrong. I have had a Randall's Prawn goby that is a peaceful fish. Well mine was Satan's spawn and felt like a 40B wasn't big enough for a fish 4". There are so many variables.
The one plus to the idea is if you had a major issue with one tank. The minus would be if you had an outbreak in both tanks and they both needed to be quarantined vs one tank where the community all know each other.

 

[40B Knasty]

One other question. What do you plan on doing for lighting?
If you plan on doing T5s. You would need 2 fixtures. So 2x$300+ for an okay set of fixtures. Then replacing the bulbs for 2 would be an 8 bulb replacement. 8x$20+ or one tank at 4x$20+. So it might be $600+ +$160=$760+ or $300+ +$80=$380+. Saving you $360 just for the 1 buy and $80 each year on bulbs.
Then you need to think about how many plug in spaces you have.

 

[Mandelstam]

Yes, I know there are limits due to the tank size for fish selection. Generally I tend to enjoy small fish more than large fish though. Of course it would be awesome to be able to have a large tank with tangs for instance but I think I'll be quite happy with fish that will be happy in a 2 foot tank. I think I will have it pretty low stocked when it comes to fish. What really excites me about saltwater tanks is the amount of other creatures that you can have besides fish. All the different "clean up crews" will be just as enjoyable to me as the fish. All of the tiny little critters. Crabs, shrimp, worms, snails, etc, etc.

When I first got the idea to run two separate displays I thought that I would have a separate display refugium with macroalgae as the second tank. I've always thought that they looked really cool and there are some pretty cool macroalgaes. But then I just wanted to have something smaller and easier to start with. One display and one sump. But the idea of running two displays on the same system stuck with me. And I've seen Marc from Melev's Reef run a couple of "satellites" off his main display.

For lighting my idea right now is to make a diy led array from for instance Cree diodes on a few different channels. Then run that on a Arduino or RPi controller. I'm not planning on growing SPS or anything else with super high demands. If I later wanted to setup tank no 2 with higher demanding corals I could do that separately for that tank, not needing to light up a 4 feet tank with high end leds. OR maybe setup a separate darker tank with non photosynthetic corals even. Having two separate tanks would allow for two completely different displays. For instance, I LOVE Marc's clown/anemone cube and would love to have that but that would make it difficult to keep any corals and I want to be able to keep those too.

I guess this would just be a way to keep my options open and be able to explore different aspects of reefing. Further down the road I might have gotten so far into the hobby that I can decide on one focus and one bigger display. I mean the ULTIMATE goal is to someday live in a house where I can run a BIG tank and have a separate equipment and sump room.

 

[40B Knasty]

I am a big fan of the clean up crew and smaller fish. Unfortunately I lost 90% of them when my tank cracked. I started off with a 20g. Then upgrade to a 40B(which I personally still think is the perfect size). Then when that cracked, I upgraded to a 65g. I will say a few things to consider, one I wish I personally did was establish a major population of Tisbe pods. They can live in a home aquarium better than most. That is a great food source/clean up crew that gets in all the cracks to keep your tank clean. Plus it is wonderful idea if you plan to have a dragonet or pipe fish. Mandarins are a beautiful easy fish to keep IF you have either the Tisbe pods or a baby brine shrimp feeding station. Tisbes are smaller than other pods and will be eaten by other bigger pods like tigger and amphipods.
I do have a blueberry gorgonian that is non photosynthetic. Beautiful coral! So I completely get that side to have a whole aspect dedicated to that kind of coral. Other than that a war coral and one acan. Everything else is 3 gold touches, 3 frogspawns, candy cane, and 12 zoathind colonies. I love the flow of a soft coral.
One thing I wanted to point out is the weight of all the tanks, live rock, water, sand, and equipment. Make sure you have a floor that can hold it or in a spot that can have added support beams if needed. Like my buddy who has a 210g, 120g, and 60g all in his living room. Just the water weight alone is 3120lbs.

 

[Mandelstam]

Thanks again for great input! That is a beautiful coral!

I live in an old apartment building with thick brick load bearing walls and I'll put the tank up close to one of those. So it won't be standing in the middle of a floor beam.

 

[JoshH]

With a dual tank setup I'd be inclined to do a reef in one and a species only or pred tank of some kind in the other like you said above. Very cool concept!

 

[Mandelstam]

With a dual tank setup I'd be inclined to do a reef in one and a species only or pred tank of some kind in the other like you said above. Very cool concept!

Thanks Josh! Yes having one very specialized tank would be very cool. I don't know enough about all the cool creatures/corals and symbiotic relationships that exists but I'm sure there are plenty that would be cool to have in a species only or highly specialized setup. The clown/anemone cube is amazing.

 

[Unregistered User]

Your diagrams are so great! I'm just starting to set up a 50 gallon. My first to. I'm going to "follow" you. If that's not ok let me know.

 

[Tuffyyyyy]

Why does the person in your mockup seem so taken aback by your tank(s)?

 

[Mandelstam]

Why does the person in your mockup seem so taken aback by your tank(s)?

I choose to view it as awe and amazement!