I'm fairly new and just set up my tank. I'm having some trouble plumbing the overflow. It has 2 holes in the overflow box, 1" and 3/4". I have my return plumbing coming over the back of the tank so i can use both holes in the overflow for my drain. I like the sounds of the herbie method, but does the outlet of the drain lines really have to be submerged in the water of the sump? Any help is appreciated.
Plumbing overflow
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Lenny_S
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A picture and more info would be helpful, like what size tank is it? It sounds like a similar setup as mine, the larger hole is for a Durso style drain, and the smaller for an integrated return. That's a guess without some pictures and info.
Lenny_S
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Ok, pictures when you can... Either Herbie or Durso would work and both have their advantages and disadvantages. I use Durso because it is simpler and if there is ever a falter of the skimmer box (i.e. it leaks down low) it won't empty the tank. But in my case I've compensated for the Durso's risk of clogging and thus stopping the drain with my return chamber in the sump being very small and float switches hooked into an Apex and programmed to send alerts and shut off the return pump if the sump runs dry. Either will work, but both need a contingency IMO.
oldsaint
Active Member
Small hole is for a return. Larger hole is for the drain.
But, as you're going to do, you can make both hole a drain and plumb the return over the back. Personally, I would just do a Durso in each hole. I've plumb many tank like that. If made properly, dursos can be very quiet.
But, as you're going to do, you can make both hole a drain and plumb the return over the back. Personally, I would just do a Durso in each hole. I've plumb many tank like that. If made properly, dursos can be very quiet.
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Maximizer
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I tried plumbing a durso with the 1" drain and the 3/4" as an emergency drain but my pump out ran the durso. I don't have any specs on the pump because it came with the tank and all the pump says is that its a utility pump. Ive used the pump before but the drain was just open ended and extremely noisy, but it was able to handle the flow.
TheEngineer
Formerly icecool2
For a herbie, the larger hole will be your backup and the smaller hole will be your siphon. Only the siphon pipe needs to be underwater, the emergency drain should only have at most a trickle of water in it. I user a durso with the end turned up instead of down so it does a little surface skimming.
Edit: Added a picture. That's the upside down durso.
Edit: Added a picture. That's the upside down durso.
Lenny_S
Well-Known Member
If the pump outran the Durso, then the drain just wasn't low enough. This chart shows the amount of water volume in different size drains for the height of water (values to the left) above the drain opening.
For a Durso, the height of the water above the "drain" should be measured from the bottom of the pair of elbows making the upside down 'U' to the top of the water. The chart is approximate and you do have some friction loss with a Durso. But if your return pump was running 500GPH to the tank (for example), then the drain (as I've described) would need to be about 4" below the water level in the overflow.
TheEngineer
Formerly icecool2
Not to be contrary, but at least the way I'm reading what you posted doesn't match my understanding of a Durso. The limiting factor for flow rate in a Durso is by the size of the plumbing, height and the amount of air it pulls in. A Durso is not designed to pull a siphon.
I'm not sure where the table you posted came from, but I would suspect that the "h" value is the height to the middle of the Durso inlet from the bulkhead. It is not how deep the Durso is in the water. A higher drop will lead to higher flow.
I'm not sure where the table you posted came from, but I would suspect that the "h" value is the height to the middle of the Durso inlet from the bulkhead. It is not how deep the Durso is in the water. A higher drop will lead to higher flow.
Lenny_S
Well-Known Member
It's not possible for me to get a picture of mine that would be any good. But I found an illustration of a quality Durso and it's how min is setup. The thicker section of pipe on the riser is an expansion coupling. It allows the ends to move in and out making the length longer or shorter. If you start off close by the measurements in the table I posted, you can fine tune it while it's running. The other advantage is if you ever replace your return pump, you can make adjustments if the volume is different without pulling the whole overflow apart.
Hope this all helps. I just know more about Durso drains than the others because that's what I use.
Hope this all helps. I just know more about Durso drains than the others because that's what I use.
Lenny_S
Well-Known Member
That table is for a drain, not a siphon. It came from "The Reef Aquarium Volume 3" pages 92-93 and applies to a Durso. At least that is what is said in the book and I have experienced it myself.
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Maximizer
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Okay thank you for all the information. I will probably plumb it for a herbie. I will post pictures tonight. the 3/4" will be the main drain and the 1" as emergency. The 3/4" needs to be 6" below the emergency drain correct? Also, does the outlets to the sump need to be below the water line.
TheEngineer
Formerly icecool2
The 3/4" line doesn't have to be 6" below the emergency drain, but somewhere in that range is good. You will need to tune the siphon line and the space between the top of the siphon and the emergency pipes will give you some room to work in.
I'm not sure what you mean about the outlets to the sump. Do you mean the pipe from the bottom of the tank to the sump? That doesn't have to be underwater, but it will be significantly quieter if it is.
