Plumbing return w/ manifold

[ilyad]

Hey all,

I have a question regarding plumbing my new tank's return line. Due to space constraints in the sump, I will have to put a single manifold on the return which will go to my BRS reactor (which will be hanging on the inside of the stand over the sump).

My question is mainly regarding the flow of water and which of the following two scenarios will work better:

In #1 you have the standard manifold design, BUT, the water will have to trek down and back towards the reactor, which I dont necessarily see that often. In #2, the flow of water will just be split accordingly.

I suspect that both designs could work, but I dont have enough experience with plumbing tanks to know for sure that in design #1 water will move through the manifold/gate valve appropriately, giving me concern here. Im confident that #2 I can have the exact flow going to the correct location. I have ordered enough plumbing parts to run either design, but havent figured out which I would like to do, yet.

Figured Id ask for advice here to see if anyone sees any flaws in either design.

FYI, I simplified the design a bit for the sake of this post. The design is missing the part where the first vertical return pipe is actually a bit forward and will make a 90 to the back of the stand. Plus having it in 3D would be more difficult to draw. ahaha

 

[mtraylor]

I would run a dual or triple manifold like #1 for future use. That way if you add anything later your already plumbed. If you don't use it, then its still ok.

 

[ilyad]

I would run a dual or triple manifold like #1 for future use. That way if you add anything later your already plumbed. If you don't use it, then its still ok.

I though of doing a multi manifold one, but then realized I prob wont be able to run more than one additional thing because I usually dont run anything beyond carbon and I really wouldnt have room to put another reactor in. Because of the location of the tank and the stuff that will have to go inside the stand, there is honestly only room for one reactor.

 

[theMeat]

Agreed
Think the first picture
Except put more than one tee, for future. Maybe UV?
Would also put some hose between tank bulkhead and plumbing to reduce stress to bulkhead if plumbing gets bumped into, or pump gets moved.
As well would put hose between pump and manifold to reduce vibration/noise, and then you might be able to eliminate an elbow or two to help with flow

 

[ilyad]

Agreed
Think the first picture
Except put more than one tee, for future. Maybe UV?
Would also put some hose between tank bulkhead and plumbing to reduce stress to bulkhead if plumbing gets bumped into, or pump gets moved.
As well would put hose between pump and manifold to reduce vibration/noise, and then you might be able to eliminate an elbow or two to help with flow

So its ok for the water to flow from right to left, and then it would flow back to the right (to the reactor)? it wont just by pass it and flow to the tank?

 

[theMeat]

So its ok for the water to flow from right to left, and then it would flow back to the right (to the reactor)? it wont just by pass it and flow to the tank?

Not sure what you mean?

 

[ilyad]

Not sure what you mean?

Normally when the flow goes from return pump to manifold to reactor its all going in one direction. In my case, it goes from return to manifold and then back the other way to the reactor. Water travels where its easiest... is it easier for it to trek back towards the reactor or to just go back into the display past the manifold?

 

[Maacc]

I would definitely go for #1 with multiple valves for future use, either UV, or ATS or something that isn't even on the market yet.

 

[Maacc]

Normally when the flow goes from return pump to manifold to reactor its all going in one direction. In my case, it goes from return to manifold and then back the other way to the reactor. Water travels where its easiest... is it easier for it to trek back towards the reactor or to just go back into the display past the manifold?

Typically you would use a ball valve at the end of the manifold to cut off/reduce flow forcing water into the reactor.

 

[Mark Gray]

I also think number 1 with more T's for future use here's my new one not on use yet

 

[ilyad]

Typically you would use a ball valve at the end of the manifold to cut off/reduce flow forcing water into the reactor.

There would definitely not be enough room to put a ball valve and 2 T's in the space that goes between the return pump and the return bulkhead. There maaay be enough room for 2 T's if I glue all the fittings basically touching.

I also think number 1 with more T's for future use here's my new one not on use yet

Just no room, there is maybe a total run space of a foot where I would have to attach all this (including the bends to make it go up to the bulkhead. I think I can fit 2 T's very tightly, but that will again depend if the design can work where the water will flow back to the reactor.

Everyone is posting pics of their manifold but its still not addressing the question of whether the water would make its way back. All of the ones posted show the flow going in one continuous direction.

 

[Mark Gray]

I guess I am not 100% on what you mean. on mine for instance one will go to a chiller not purchased yet, the outlet side will run back to the tank. another will run a carbon reactor the outlet side will dump back into the sump

 

[JoshH]

Your question was answered here...

Typically you would use a ball valve at the end of the manifold to cut off/reduce flow forcing water into the reactor.

In order to direct flow to your manifold outlets you place a valve (Gate or ball) ATFER your outlets. When you tune this valve it creates head pressure which directs flow towards your manifold outlets. It is not mandatory as the natural head pressure of your setup will direct flow towards your reactors anyway (path of least resistance, in this case is towards the reactor and NOT to your return regardless of what design you choose because past that the water has to go upwards after your manifold which creates resistance). Adding the valve after just let's you control the amount of flow towards the reactors.

And FWIW, this is my manifold and it is 12" long from the right side of the last T to the handle on the ball valve. This could be cut even shorter, to probably ~8" if you trimmed the T's (1/2" plumbing).

Oh and to answer your origin question, both designs you have posted will work. I would do whichever one takes up the least amount of space. The only draw back to option 2 is how close the Y is to the return. This leaves you no option to add soft plumbing to reduce pump noise if you wanted to. It also makes things crowded around the pump itself which might make it a pain to pull out and maintain.

 

[ilyad]

Your question was answered here...



In order to direct flow to your manifold outlets you place a valve (Gate or ball) ATFER your outlets. When you tune this valve it creates head pressure which directs flow towards your manifold outlets. It is not mandatory as the natural head pressure of your setup will direct flow towards your reactors anyway (path of least resistance, in this case is towards the reactor and NOT to your return regardless of what design you choose because past that the water has to go upwards after your manifold which creates resistance). Adding the valve after just let's you control the amount of flow towards the reactors.

And FWIW, this is my manifold and it is 12" long from the right side of the last T to the handle on the ball valve. This could be cut even shorter, to probably ~8" if you trimmed the T's (1/2" plumbing).

Thanks Josh! That makes more sense now. Unfortunately I have a 1 inch return running (the return hole was an inch). The T's I bought are the reducing ones so they'll reduce down to 1/2 which the gate valves will connect to. I still dont think I'll be able to fit another gate/ball valve because the total length is about 12 inches, taking into account 2 90's going to the bulkhead and then down to the return pump (~2 inches each), that leaves only about 8 remaining for the 2 T's. Hopefully the fact that its going down towards the reactor (and only about 6 inches back) the water will go there first, instead of the 20 inches or so of the return in the tank.

 

[JoshH]

Thanks Josh! That makes more sense now. Unfortunately I have a 1 inch return running (the return hole was an inch). The T's I bought are the reducing ones so they'll reduce down to 1/2 which the gate valves will connect to. I still dont think I'll be able to fit another gate/ball valve because the total length is about 12 inches, taking into account 2 90's going to the bulkhead and then down to the return pump (~2 inches each), that leaves only about 8 remaining for the 2 T's. Hopefully the fact that its going down towards the reactor (and only about 6 inches back) the water will go there first, instead of the 20 inches or so of the return in the tank.

I would just cut the T's shorter, especially if they are reducing to 1/2" or you could go a whole other route and use 1 reducing T off the return and use 1/2" PVC to make a manifold just like mine. You can plumb it anywhere in the cabinet you want then use 1/2" T's and valves

 

[ilyad]

I would just cut the T's shorter, especially if they are reducing to 1/2" or you could go a whole other route and use 1 reducing T off the return and use 1/2" PVC to make a manifold just like mine. You can plumb it anywhere in the cabinet you want then use 1/2" T's and valves

Reading this comment, I just realized how you have your's plumbed. Your manifold is not in line with the return, its just a separate manifold away from the return line. Hmmm... I'll have to think about trying to see if I can fit one of those somewhere.

 

[JoshH]

Reading this comment, I just realized how you have your's plumbed. Your manifold is not in line with the return, its just a separate manifold away from the return line. Hmmm... I'll have to think about trying to see if I can fit one of those somewhere.

You would be correct. In the interest of full disclosure My manifold actually runs off it's own pump, separate from the return all together. BUT there is absolutely no reason why you can't run this same set up off your return, many people have done it this way. I just prefer to run mine off it's own pump. Do you have any pictures of your sump setup and cabinet atall??

 

[cracker]

I like the 1st design for reasons mentioned & I "think" the Yfitting right off the return could cause you to loose some pressure/volume. ,,Ah maybe

 

[lbacha]

This is mine the return to the tank is the final ball valve with the flow meter

I currently have a bashsea media reactor and a UV sterilizer running off it

 

[ilyad]

Here is the manifold for the return. Albeit it took me two tries to do it, I managed it. I took some cues from others here and made it so that it’ll have a hose connecting the return and the manifold in the event I accidentally bump it so not to put stress in the bulkhead cut.

That being said, do you guys think it’ll actually work as a manifold off the return? I have a vectra M1 that will be pushing the water back to the tank.

The manifold has unions on the bottom that will rotate. The left valve will be turned to the left and feed the chiller outside the stand. The one on the right will be going to a reactor that will be mounted on the inside of the right wall.