Plumbing review plz

[Savant]

Could the experts (lol or anybody that has an opinion) please review this design and evaluate it for problems?

TankSA 105g neo pro (duel overflow/return)

I am also interested if it would cause problems to expand the 1" drains to a larger diameter after it leaves the overflow, im thinking that it would help maintain maximum siphon and flow with the gate, ball valves and unions.

* the tank is tempered so I cant change the drain and return sizes

 

[Bluesaltwater87]

It looks good but are you going to use ball valves or gate valves?
With me i have always went by the rule 1/2 the size.
were if you have a 3/4 in return than you should have a 1 1/2 in primary.
it looks like it will work and i like how you put a waste drain on there. it dos make it easier to do water changes.
If it was me i would use 2 tanks for my sump system and use an external pump to pull water from each one.
that way if there is a emergency than each tank is connected and you wont have a water mess on the floor
and if you need to work in one tank you wont disturb the other tank.
but i think your plumbing will work!:bigsmile:

 

[twintrades]

Id make the Fuge Come right after the skimmer area. Not make the plumbing more complicated. The way i think about it is After the skimmer theres a set of 3 baffles. Then The Fuge catching the Water the skimmer didnt finish pulling gunk outa. Then a Spill over baffle. To the return pump.

This way water flows in one direction.

I would lose a valve on the return line and just use one.
The drain if your going to use your sump layout just use the gate for the flow to the fuge. But straight to sump dont use a valve. Not really a reason. Its going to flow as fast as you put in.

Have fun and good luck!

 

[Savant]

It would be definitely be easier with the fuge between the skimmer and return, but isn't it more desirable to have a slower flow through the fuge and allow more contact time in that area?.
The reason I put ball valves and gate valves on the return and main drain is so that once I get the flow "tuned" with the gate valves I can still turn turn off flow with the ball valve. That way I wont have to "re-tune" the gate valves from scratch for proper flow on restart.

Im not sure how much the "T" to the fuge will mess with regaining full siphon on a restart...does anybody have a similar system they could comment on?

While the placement of the gate & ball valves might seem random there is madness to the method(I hope..lol)
The gate valves on the main drain and return are close to the DT so I can tune the overflow.
The ball valves on the main drain and return are in the basement so I can restart after maintenance without having to wait for the plumbing to refill with water.
After some more thought I will move the emergency drain ball valve to the basement as well, but continue to leave the waste drain upstairs as the drain exits the house above the foundation and drains onto a gravel bed under the deck outside(im not sure what the effect of dumping saltwater into a septic tank would be)

 

[Reefing Madness]

Looks good. Don't go 1" to 3/4" on the returns, it will restrci the flow on any pump your going to use. Go with the 1" and don't branch it off. Unless your going with a huge return pump, its usually not even counted as flow, because you want all the water coming from the pump, and not trying to force it into an area of the tank, its just a return.
Oh, you might want to throw some Unions in there so you can take it apart if necessary and when needed.

 

[Savant]

Sry I didnt mention it-all valves will have unions.

I havnt got the tank yet but the one Im looking at is the DSA 105 neo pro, I havnt seen the return plumbing in person but I believe(and I could be wrong) that they told me the return consisted of two 3/4" returns. Now if thats a single 1" pipe they split or 2 actual bulkheads I wont know till Saturday. Im going with a blueline 55 hd pump (im looking at 10-12' head pressure) and its got 1" fittings so Im kinda stuck with my return sizes. I used a head pressure calculator and it seems to work on paper...lol but ultimately thats what the gate valve on the return is for if its to strong.

 

[AZDesertRat]

Stick with the two 3/4" outlets but don't reduce to the 3/4" from the 1" until the last minute like using 1x3/4 90 degree elbows or 1" 90 degree elbows with reducer busings to 3/4". Two 3/4" outlets is actually more area that a single 1" at this point, 0.88 square inches versus .78 square inches so will have less restriction not more, slight but still there.

My sump is very similar except my skimmer in placed in the center section where the overflow feeds into and I also have a line branching off to my refugium on the left side. The refugium overflows in to the center/skimmer section and both overflow via three, over-under-over baffles in to the return pump section.

I'm not sure the functionality of the waste drain since once the level drops 1/2" or so in the display the drain will be exposed to atmosphere and the siphon will quit so it won't do much?

I am not a fan of the Herbie overflow and cringe when I see valves on the overflow but with that method you have a back up. My current 100G is 9 years old, uses a single 1" overflow drain and has never once been a problem. The modified Stockman or Maggie Muffler standpipes either one have been silent and I'm using a Water Blaster HY-5000 pump wide open so really pushing the overflow rate hard.

 

[Savant]

Thanks for the info!
I just got off the phone with DSA and it is 2 seperate bulkheads for the returns.

AZ could you clarify the part about the elbows in the first paragraph, Im not sure what you are saying (sorry)

My thoughts on the waste drain would be to open the waste drain, close the main and emergency drains and reduce the level in the sump by the amount of water I wanted to remove. This is mainly for 10 to 15% water changes. I will add a clean out after the waste drain ball valve that will accommodate a large diameter hose in the event that I need to quickly drain/siphon the DT of large amounts of water.

 

[AZDesertRat]

That makes sense.

What I am saying is you show a 1" return line from the pump and two 3/4" returns at the display. Someone suggested sticking with 1" all the way as the 3/4" would reduce the flow but as you pointed out you are committed to 3/4" bulkheads. That is fine and if you calculate the surface area of two 3/4" openings versus a single 1" opening you will find the two has greater flow so there is no restriction. Stay with the 1" all the way to the bulkheads or as close as possible before reducing to the 3/4" and you will not have any problems. You could use two 1" 90 degree PVC elbows and reduce on the bulkhead side using a bushing or male adapter or you can up to the first outlet with the 1" then install a 1x1x3/4 branch tee and continue the 1" over the the other return outlet and use a 1" 90 and reduce it at the bulkhead or .... there are many possibilities without reducing flow.


What I did on my own tank is use 1" up to a Oceans Motions Squirt two way with 3/4" from each side of the Squirt to the bulkheads and Loc Line return nozzles and get great flow with the added switching back and forth for random flows.

 

[Savant]

Oh yea that ocean motion looks like the ticket:bigsmile: except Im going to have to wait for the duckets. Well that goes in the "save money upgrades for the ultimate tank" bin along with the Vortech circulators

 

[Coral Dreams]

Why not set a small submersible pump in the skimmer area then hose it to the fuge with a ball valve then have the water from the fuge go into the return chamber. In the setup you have now will you have the water from the drain going to the fuge with no pre-filter so you will have food and other ditrus accumulate in the fuge?

 

[Dana]

if your return is 1" then your drain should be 2"

 

[Reefing Madness]

if your return is 1" then your drain should be 2"

Not necessarily. I've got two 1" drains, and only one 1" return, its all in the volume.

 

[Dana]

But two 1" drains would be equivalent to one 2" drain no?

 

[Dana]

Or at least able to drain at the rate of a 2" drain

 

[Reefing Madness]

Well, not really. CPR uses a Weir to syphon water, so they can use 2 1" drains for a variety of different overflows. Like mine is a 900gph, one they never made, it was messed up on the table, but they make a couple others using 2 1" overflows, at different rates.