Possible velvet irradication. Many warnings inside.

[greenhorn reefer]

I feel like there are a lot of unknown variables. Doesn't diluted bleach break down into salt/water? Doesn't light speed the process of chlorine breakdown? I feel like you have combined my two hobbies, pools and tanks. Good luck with your endeavors hope you find your solution... Pun intended.

 

[Humblefish]

I feel like there are a lot of unknown variables. Doesn't diluted bleach break down into salt/water? Doesn't light speed the process of chlorine breakdown? I feel like you have combined my two hobbies, pools and tanks. Good luck with your endeavors hope you find your solution... Pun intended.

I sort of look at this as an initial experiment. If it proves successful, then it would be worthy of more detailed study done in a controlled environment with limited variables.

 

[BoneXriffic]

I feel like there are a lot of unknown variables. Doesn't diluted bleach break down into salt/water? Doesn't light speed the process of chlorine breakdown? I feel like you have combined my two hobbies, pools and tanks. Good luck with your endeavors hope you find your solution... Pun intended.

The only way to weed out unknowns is to try it =)

And so far only substantial side effect is the seemingly gradual increase in salinity. I am readjusting my level and will keep track of it

 

[greenhorn reefer]

The only way to weed out unknowns is to try it =)

And so far only substantial side effect is the seemingly gradual increase in salinity. I am readjusting my level and will keep track of it

If you readjust the salinity, won't that further dilute your bleach? You should set up several containers, create a control, and observe just how much chlorine breaks down in no light, one with light. If it is anything like a pool, you would need free chlorine in order to kill algae and bacteria. I'm really pulling for you on this one, saving future sick fish is mighty admirable. Good luck!

 

[Darbna]

I sort of look at this as an initial experiment. If it proves successful, then it would be worthy of more detailed study done in a controlled environment with limited variables.

@Humblefish any way you can give me a dosage and what type of bleach to use. I have a pink spot goby, a wrasse, and purple yellow dottyback that are impossible to remove with out break down. Velvet still in the tank I am sure because I added 2 clowns and a powder blue that got it almost immediattly. Thankfully the clowns were easy to net at night, and the tang fell victim to a fish trap and are now in QT recovering nicely, but with the others there is no way to get them and I try daily. To quick for a net.

If you can give some bleach dosage on 120 gallon tank, 145 water column I am down to enlist in experiment as well.

 

[Humblefish]

If you can give some bleach dosage on 120 gallon tank, 145 water column I am down to enlist in experiment as well.

I would use the same dosage @BoneXriffic is currently using (below).

So what am I dosing? Well all bleach has a potencey. Liquid bleach ranges from 5 to 12 percent... so, much maths later we came to a dose rate of .003 divided by bleach percentage x how many gallons....to give you ml per gallon....so for 6 percent bleach, .003 divided by .06 x 100gallons gave me my dose....the math is...unimportant now however as....yep, still testing. 3 weeks straight of dosing now and no ill effects. 3ml of bleach twice a day.

 

[Humblefish]

So what am I dosing? Well all bleach has a potencey. Liquid bleach ranges from 5 to 12 percent... so, much maths later we came to a dose rate of .003 divided by bleach percentage x how many gallons....to give you ml per gallon....so for 6 percent bleach, .003 divided by .06 x 100gallons gave me my dose....the math is...unimportant now however as....yep, still testing. 3 weeks straight of dosing now and no ill effects. 3ml of bleach twice a day.

I have a question about this.

"we came to a dose rate of .003 divided by bleach percentage x how many gallons....to give you ml per gallon....so for 6 percent bleach, .003 divided by .06 x 100gallons gave me my dose"

.003 divided by .06 x 100gallons = 5ml / 2 = 2.5ml of bleach twice a day

 

[Darbna]

I have a question about this.

"we came to a dose rate of .003 divided by bleach percentage x how many gallons....to give you ml per gallon....so for 6 percent bleach, .003 divided by .06 x 100gallons gave me my dose"

.003 divided by .06 x 100gallons = 5ml / 2 = 2.5ml of bleach twice a day

Thats what Im sayin. I am no math major, but can understand basics. This stuff is way above my pay grade. If someone can tell what the ML is and how many times a day I can do that

 

[BoneXriffic]

I have a question about this.

"we came to a dose rate of .003 divided by bleach percentage x how many gallons....to give you ml per gallon....so for 6 percent bleach, .003 divided by .06 x 100gallons gave me my dose"

.003 divided by .06 x 100gallons = 5ml / 2 = 2.5ml of bleach twice a day

Mmm 5ml twice per day. Sorry for the typo. That dose doesnt get cut in half. Its full dose twice. However i tend to rabble on and not proof read myself. Correcting now

If you readjust the salinity, won't that further dilute your bleach? You should set up several containers, create a control, and observe just how much chlorine breaks down in no light, one with light. If it is anything like a pool, you would need free chlorine in order to kill algae and bacteria. I'm really pulling for you on this one, saving future sick fish is mighty admirable. Good luck!

Light isnt the big issue here. Not to mention we kind of want it to disapate relativley quick. I would be concerned with it staying in the water too long.

I think the protien skimmer aerating heck out of the water would disipate it
Also since we are using free chlorine it disipates much quicker than chloramines. Thisis why I am still trying to figure out if we are producing ANY chloramines by dosing bleach. As this takes much longer to break down. I guess this would depend on amonia levels in the tank vs how much chlorine.

 

[Humblefish]

Thats what Im sayin. I am no math major, but can understand basics. This stuff is way above my pay grade. If someone can tell what the ML is and how many times a day I can do that

OK so using the same dosing regimen as @BoneXriffic:

120 gallon tank = 6ml of bleach twice per day
145 gallon tank = 7.25ml of bleach twice per day

Good luck!

 

[BoneXriffic]

Thats what Im sayin. I am no math major, but can understand basics. This stuff is way above my pay grade. If someone can tell what the ML is and how many times a day I can do that

It is understood that this is a long shot and is far from proven I hope. As well as the risk involved?

 

[Valkyrie]

OK so using the same dosing regimen as @BoneXriffic:

120 gallon tank = 6ml of bleach twice per day
145 gallon tank = 7.25ml of bleach twice per day

Good luck!

So 1mL/20g q12hr? One step further .05mL/gal q12hr? No, I have no plan on trying this out, I'm just keeping notes.

 

[Humblefish]

So 1mL/20g q12hr? One step further .05mL/gal q12hr? No, I have no plan on trying this out, I'm just keeping notes.

I'll try (almost) anything in a QT with just 1 or 2 fish.

 

[MikeyB]

Any kind of update? Very intrigued by this

 

[BoneXriffic]

Sorry for the lack of updates! More time spent working than anywhere else latley. I am 2 weeks off of bleach treatment aprox. And as we already know dinos were killed and never to be seen again. Again thanks @twilliard . Guess what else. No white dots, no. . Short term....negative side effects. I fear however that i may have to give the hippo tang away when it grows as my plans for a 180 will be slowed [might be done in time to keep her]

So for the good news...
No dinos, no velvet...

I cannot prove this cured velvet, all i can prove is none of my fish, even suseptable ones, have shown any signs of the disease. So my hopes are high.

The bad and the ugly. Side effects noticed.
Increase in salinity, slow and easy to correct
Cyano. And GHA seem to thrive. Bleach has no affect and almost seems to fuel it. I am battling with peroxcide. Slow results. But results none the less
Believe it or not, my corals seems brighter and more colorful during bleach treatment. Also water clarity was amazing during this. Ok now, but man was it amazing on bleach.

I am a firm believer in the possiblity bleach could result in a reef safe cure for dinos, velvet and other forms. Once again. Possibility, far from proven. My local petco opens monday. In a few weeks time i will set up a qt and expect them to have some sick fish. Using the @Humblefish fw dip method to help sustain the fish long enough for bleach to do its job i hope to see results!

 

[spartanman22]

Your salinity is changing because your adding bleach which is essentially a salt. Remember you are adding bleach (NaOCl) NOT chlorine. Municipal wastewater facilities use chlorine (gaseous Cl2 injected into the waste stream). The facility I work at is probably one of the few facilities in the Chicagoland still using 2 ton cylinders as opposed to bleach or UV.

Common household bleach is anywhere from 8-12% sodium hypochlorite. It exists as Na+ and OCl- in solution. So you are basically dosing a dilute salt concentration. This is also why you'll have a better retention time in solution than if you were injecting Cl2 (which would evaporate pretty quickly). Some standards claim a reduction of 5% concentration per hour exposed to the atmosphere. UV light will degrade chlorine compounds pretty readily as well.

Commercial solutions will also have significant amounts of sodium chloride as the main byproduct of the reaction process used to form bleach. So again bleach will have an impact on salinity.

 

[twilliard]

This is some great information!
As time progresses we can cumulatively gather information using bleach. I have been slowed down heavily by schooling but I will always have time to push forward.

 

[BoneXriffic]

Your salinity is changing because your adding bleach which is essentially a salt. Remember you are adding bleach (NaOCl) NOT chlorine. Municipal wastewater facilities use chlorine (gaseous Cl2 injected into the waste stream). The facility I work at is probably one of the few facilities in the Chicagoland still using 2 ton cylinders as opposed to bleach or UV.

Common household bleach is anywhere from 8-12% sodium hypochlorite. It exists as Na+ and OCl- in solution. So you are basically dosing a dilute salt concentration. This is also why you'll have a better retention time in solution than if you were injecting Cl2 (which would evaporate pretty quickly). Some standards claim a reduction of 5% concentration per hour exposed to the atmosphere. UV light will degrade chlorine compounds pretty readily as well.

Commercial solutions will also have significant amounts of sodium chloride as the main byproduct of the reaction process used to form bleach. So again bleach will have an impact on salinity.

I work for water distribution. I have a great understanding of how it works...it was more so an oversight on salinity increasing. Im sure if i used 65percent hth it would increase salinity quicker.

Typically bleach is 5 to 12percent. Most often the cheapo poop is on the lower end. I used a 6.5percent i believe it was.

Also i believe the aeriation of the skimmer helps deplete the bleach quicker

 

[Breakthecycle2]

Following.

 

[Breakthecycle2]

Sorry if I missed it. Can't you get some spores in a test environment an dose the bleach do see if it will work? If you already did that, I apologize.