Price increase..Really

[DWill]

Yea I think we need some answers here. I think there are circumstances where companies need to drive up the price for things. But just dont understand the rationale here. I mean recently Inpurchased new windows and they told me the price has been increased due to covid. Again, im not a supply chain expert but maybe window sells went down? Not sure but all I know is demand for salt has risen if anything

Price probably did increase due to COVID… the word … not the virus.
everyone uses the excuse of COVID to gauge money. I have to day as much as I enjoy it, my frustration with reefing products and suppliers is very nearly eclipsing the enjoyment.

From high dollar not working properly and/or being cheaply and poorly made to price gouging just because you can, it’s starting to be a lot less fun.

 

[GlassMunky]

Haha price increases dont offend me at all....but suggesting that home hobbyists wont understand that shipping costs have went through the roof is a bit offensive lol. In fact in this thread multiple people pointed out the shipping costs before you even posted.

Of course some wont understand, and a segment really wont care the reason and are going to be mad in any case. However i would suggest your " home hobbyist" is on average much more capable of understanding than you give credit for.

Yea I’m gonna disagree with you there and say most Americans don’t know and don’t actually understand, and they don’t care to. It’s the American way to just want the lowest price regardless of where or who it comes from or why it’s as cheap as it is.
we kind of suck as a society, and are super entitled. So yea, a lot here won’t understand.
And honestly, if a tiny comment like that “offends you” maybe you shouldn’t be on the internet.

 

[GlassMunky]

Price probably did increase due to COVID… the word … not the virus.
everyone uses the excuse of COVID to gauge money. I have to day as much as I enjoy it, my frustration with reefing products and suppliers is very nearly eclipsing the enjoyment.

From high dollar not working properly and/or being cheaply and poorly made to price gouging just because you can, it’s starting to be a lot less fun.

My point proven right here....
“Just from the word covid”

 

[iMi]

Ans some wants everything to be domestically
Made, I can’t imagine how much people will whine.

Bingo. Anyone advocating for "return of manufacturing" to America needs to look at basic economic models to understand that it would be an economic disaster for us and other countries.

There are some areas where it does make sense as automation, which eliminates low skill labor will offset cost of freight and has other intangible benefits. That will, of course, not create jobs for those who need them.

Back to the salt. Where is it made? It's possible that shipping it here and processing it domestically could improve the cost. The question is what's the long-term situation? That's a big unknown right now.

 

[Brian_68]

Fortunately for me the price of a 200 gal box of Reef Crystals at my LFS is still $50 and has not increased in a long time. Not sure if they source raw compenents differently or if it is manufactured domestically but works for me.

 

[iMi]

Price probably did increase due to COVID… the word … not the virus.
everyone uses the excuse of COVID to gauge money. I have to day as much as I enjoy it, my frustration with reefing products and suppliers is very nearly eclipsing the enjoyment.

From high dollar not working properly and/or being cheaply and poorly made to price gouging just because you can, it’s starting to be a lot less fun.

I don't see much price gauging outside of the initial cost increases we've seen on certain items back when the pandemic started.

I happen to work in the import industry. We've seen astronomical cost increases in cardboard alone. Some vendors we've done business with for over ten years will not quote us prices valid for more than just a few days. Amazon has grown about 50% last year. That's Amazon alone. Online retail exploded and along with it the need for cardboard.

Cost of copper is up over 100%, steel is up at least 80% or more. Chinese New Year this year has been the longest I've ever seen. Travel restrictions meant people started leaving early and coming back later and that has driven labor prices upward considerably. Exchange rate has shifted in favor of the Yuan by at least 10% and therefore making our currency less effective. We've got some deals where the exchange rate along has wiped out nearly all of our profit margins. Tariffs have been largely absorbed by both retailers and manufacturers and that's about to run out. Expect steep price increases in many sectors.

So, yeah... like someone else said. Most Americans don't understand what's happening and simply see a price increase and blame the manufacturer hiding behind "covid." That's simply not true.

Thank the "previous guy" for a lot of these problems.

 

[mdb_talon]

Yea I’m gonna disagree with you there and say most Americans don’t know and don’t actually understand, and they don’t care to. It’s the American way to just want the lowest price regardless of where or who it comes from or why it’s as cheap as it is.
we kind of suck as a society, and are super entitled. So yea, a lot here won’t understand.
And honestly, if a tiny comment like that “offends you” maybe you shouldn’t be on the internet.

And yet many posts before his actually pointed out shipping costs. Clearly you are someone that likes to think of everyone else as an idiot and put yourself on a pedestal. Hopefully it makes you feel better about yourself.

 

[Duffer]

This will be something that the home hobbyist will most likely not understand. But I am going to try my best to be honest, candid and transparent in my response, as I always do.

This Tropic Marin MAP increase has NOTHING to do with the increase in demand that we have seen over the past year. The true and actual reason the MAP pricing is increasing is because, at the current time, there are increases in shipping costs from overseas of more than 200% in many cases. Tropic Marin has done a very good job of not passing increased shipping costs on to our customers up to now. However, it is just not possible for us to keep that up now that the increases are getting even larger. For that reason, all of our distributor customers are seeing shipping surcharges added onto their orders. We anticipate that they will, in turn, pass those shipping charges onto their customers, the retailers. We cannot expect retailers to have increased costs from their distributors without passing those costs on to their customers, the hobbyists. In order to support the retailers in our industry, we saw no other course to take other than to increase MAP so that the playing field would be equal for everyone.

This is not a good situation. And I totally agree that this is the worst possible time for this to happen. But NO ONE is making any more money with these MAP increases but the shipping companies. There is no alternative other than stopping shipping to the US altogether. I definitely don't want to do that.

I encourage you to look into the current international container shipping crisis. You will see that everything I am saying is 100% true. The increased supply that we have been talking about for the past year is finally starting to come over. We have not yet hit the middle of this year. But this shipping situation is a horrible crisis that is effecting all imports at the current time.

It is very easy to point fingers and complain. It is so easy to criticize, even when people are working their hardest to make things right. But if you have any concrete solutions to these costs and the current shipping crisis, I encourage you to contact me directly. I would love to know what can be done.

I'm sure I will have to give the information I have given in this post many times before this is over. But this is the real story and the real reason behind these increases. And I stand by everything I have said here. I hope, that when this pandemic is over, things will return to normal and we can stop dealing with these outrageous charges. But for now, we are backed into a corner if we are to continue in this market. My sincere hope is that telling the truth of the situation, that people will understand and continue to believe in the integrity of the Tropic Marin brand.

@Lou Ekus
Thanks Lou, i appreciate your response to my question. I fully understand your side and understand the vendors side as the plight we all are in due to the pandemic. Without question things are not the same, unfortunately it's the consumer that has to suffer. I'm pretty sure we in this hobby will be seeing price increases for other items . Just like other things in life i do have a choice on what i want to spend, and with this increase it has made me rethink towards another brand.

 

[JaimeAdams]

As someone who runs a LFS I have to tell you guys a 10% increase isn't just on this salt. Over the last few weeks I've gotten emails from several big aquarium companies increasing the price across their product line. There is nothing that they or any of us can do about increased raw material and freight costs.

 

[Fishingandreefing]

As someone who runs a LFS I have to tell you guys a 10% increase isn't just on this salt. Over the last few weeks I've gotten emails from several big aquarium companies increasing the price across their product line. There is nothing that they or any of us can do about increased raw material and freight costs.

Well that won’t do good to anyone one, the vendors or consumers. Just my parents rental properties, they rather not raise the rents as long as the tenants are paying.

 

[Malcontent]

Printing 40% of the money supply in the last year might be part of it as well.

 

[Lou Ekus]

@Lou Ekus
Thanks Lou, i appreciate your response to my question. I fully understand your side and understand the vendors side as the plight we all are in due to the pandemic. Without question things are not the same, unfortunately it's the consumer that has to suffer. I'm pretty sure we in this hobby will be seeing price increases for other items . Just like other things in life i do have a choice on what i want to spend, and with this increase it has made me rethink towards another brand.

@duffer
I'm very sorry, and I totally understand your position as well. We will suffer along with you with lost sales. We just don't have any choice and are forced to accept this current situation. The best we can do is be honest and try to bring as much transparency as we can to the decisions being made. I sincerely hope we can resolve this at some point soon. But only time will tell. I hope we can win your trust back some day.

 

[Oldreefer44]

After polling my fish, it turns out that by a 71% to 23% margin ( the libertarian caucus refused to participate) they demanded that I stick to TM products. I complained that it was too expensive but after they pointed out that it didn't seem to bother me to pay huge markups for my numerous Apple products I realized that I risked losing what little credibility I had left with them. So I thought about hiring Cyber Ninjas to stage a recount but found that they were busy in Arizona. So I quickly turned the tables on the Y

 

[Oldreefer44]

Yellow Tang and Put out a press release pointing out that due to decreased demand they would no longer have to worry about delayed water changes and home made All for Reef.

 

[rtparty]

I don't see much price gauging outside of the initial cost increases we've seen on certain items back when the pandemic started.

I happen to work in the import industry. We've seen astronomical cost increases in cardboard alone. Some vendors we've done business with for over ten years will not quote us prices valid for more than just a few days. Amazon has grown about 50% last year. That's Amazon alone. Online retail exploded and along with it the need for cardboard.

Cost of copper is up over 100%, steel is up at least 80% or more. Chinese New Year this year has been the longest I've ever seen. Travel restrictions meant people started leaving early and coming back later and that has driven labor prices upward considerably. Exchange rate has shifted in favor of the Yuan by at least 10% and therefore making our currency less effective. We've got some deals where the exchange rate along has wiped out nearly all of our profit margins. Tariffs have been largely absorbed by both retailers and manufacturers and that's about to run out. Expect steep price increases in many sectors.

So, yeah... like someone else said. Most Americans don't understand what's happening and simply see a price increase and blame the manufacturer hiding behind "covid." That's simply not true.

Thank the "previous guy" for a lot of these problems.

You were like 95% there. You were on the goal line running in the winning TD and dropped the ball too early.

It is best to leave politics out of this because it truly goes both ways.

In my industry (clothing, appareal, promotional items, etc.), we saw swarms of companies leave China over the tariffs. The price didn't increase (too crazy) on most items and quality improved greatly across the board. Now, many companies are returning to China, costs went up and quality is in the toilet once again. Meaning these companies are paying less to have it made but charging us more. I can't believe how poor some of the quality has become for reputable brands that tout their QC.

 

[iMi]

You were like 95% there. You were on the goal line running in the winning TD and dropped the ball too early.

It is best to leave politics out of this because it truly goes both ways.

In my industry (clothing, appareal, promotional items, etc.), we saw swarms of companies leave China over the tariffs. The price didn't increase (too crazy) on most items and quality improved greatly across the board. Now, many companies are returning to China, costs went up and quality is in the toilet once again. Meaning these companies are paying less to have it made but charging us more. I can't believe how poor some of the quality has become for reputable brands that tout their QC.

I see the opposite. Some of the products we've been looking at in India and Vietnam, for example, are significantly lower and often inconsistent in quality versus China. What I can tell you is that the pressure on quality comes from American consumers and retailers who serve them.

I cannot tell you how much pressure retailers put on manufacturers to reduce cost. It's almost absurd. Americans want cheap goods. No one expects to pay retail prices and everyone wants more for less. That's reality.

I am not trying to bring politics into this, but when a party or a person does something that has a direct impact on any given situation, good or bad, how do you not factor that into a discussion? It's relevant to the topic.

 

[Lowell Lemon]

@duffer
I'm very sorry, and I totally understand your position as well. We will suffer along with you with lost sales. We just don't have any choice and are forced to accept this current situation. The best we can do is be honest and try to bring as much transparency as we can to the decisions being made. I sincerely hope we can resolve this at some point soon. But only time will tell. I hope we can win your trust back some day.

Lou,
Perhaps it is time to end relationships with distribution and ship directly to the Retailers and skip the distribution costs. I know from experience this will lower your final cost to the consumer. Just a thought. Not sure how you distribute your products but large distributors like Central are not the most desirable channel for some products.

 

[LA Reef Addict]

It's actually very simple folks. Stop buying and see how quickly the price comes down. Its not magic salt for crying out loud. Lol. I have now decided to switch from all-for-reef back to esv bionic 2 part. Yes i get it, shipping cost have gone through the roof but its not like there arent other cheaper options out there. And if you think your reef tank will explode if you buy "cheaper" salt, then you need to rethink your reefing skills. Lol

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

I work in global logistics, importing/exporting. The pandemic has caused a major problem on the supply chain, and freight rates have tripled since last year. You can probably expect more increases coming along this year

 

[rtparty]

I see the opposite. Some of the products we've been looking at in India and Vietnam, for example, are significantly lower and often inconsistent in quality versus China. What I can tell you is that the pressure on quality comes from American consumers and retailers who serve them.

I cannot tell you how much pressure retailers put on manufacturers to reduce cost. It's almost absurd. Americans want cheap goods. No one expects to pay retail prices and everyone wants more for less. That's reality.

I am not trying to bring politics into this, but when a party or a person does something that has a direct impact on any given situation, good or bad, how do you not factor that into a discussion? It's relevant to the topic.

In that case, there is only one "guy/party" to blame for the current gas prices that are pushing these shipping rate increases. The current fuel surcharges that are being added to everything are not from the "previous guy" in any way. If "previous guy" was still in, gas prices wouldn't be anywhere near where they are.

And trust me, you don't need to tell me anything about American consumers and their demand for the lowest price at any cost. I see and deal with it daily. We are constatnly bombarded with "I WANT AN AMERICAN MADE (insert product here)!"....so we show them the American made items and magically that tone changes into "THESE PRICES ARE RIDICULOUS!"

My opinion with some of the super low quality Chinese stuff coming in is that they were first to open back up and therefore the only factories that could fulfill some of these orders. Sadly, we the consumer are paying for that in terms of quality right now