Pro Reef salt from Turkey

[Duffer]

This is getting very interesting to say the least.I believe brs has said we can return but the cost for return shipping is going to be on us. I have no issues so far but I will not buy turkey blend ever again. I’ll switch salts before that happens.
I’m also thinking tropic Marin carefully worded statement is from their legal department.

 

[Billldg]

The whole thing is, WE ALL need to give Tropic Marin the benefit of the doubt. Please let them figure things out and correct things if needed. I am the first to point out things, AND YET, I am also understanding. Lets give Tropic Marin and @Lou Ekus a chance to make this right.

 

[Woodyman]

This is getting very interesting to say the least.I believe brs has said we can return but the cost for return shipping is going to be on us. I have no issues so far but I will not buy turkey blend ever again. I’ll switch salts before that happens.
I’m also thinking tropic Marin carefully worded statement is from their legal department.

These statements always come from legal, and you generally wait a few weeks for legal to publish the final version....

 

[IKD]

I have not mixed it yet. I still have a bit of HW Marine Reefer mix left.

Yes sorry, I meant what salt do you typically use (sounds like HW Marine Reef)

 

[Frogspon]

Is there going to be a program in place.. or is it a case of ....

 

[reefiniteasy]

Can someone explain this to me…

The side of the Turkish bucket says “Manufactured in Turkey under the authority of Tropic Marin AG.” Does this mean they are not manufacturing their own product as in like a copacker is doing it? What does “under the authority of” mean? I know the German bucket does not say this.

 

[IKD]

Can someone explain this to me…

The side of the Turkish bucket says “Manufactured in Turkey under the authority of Tropic Marin AG.” Does this mean they are not manufacturing their own product as in like a copacker is doing it? What does “under the authority of” mean? I know the German bucket does not say this.

This was Lou’s response on 1/3/22 regarding the Turkey facility

“I completely understand your concerns, and understand that I am concerned as well! Please do not confuse our manufacturing facility in Turkey with "outsourcing". This is not the case. Outsourcing is an agreement in which one company hires another company to be responsible for a planned or existing activity. Our team in Germany is completely responsible for the operation of the facility in Turkey. As I have said in other posts, the entire process, materials, quality control and monitoring is controlled by our team in Germany.”

 

[reefiniteasy]

This was Lou’s response on 1/3/22 regarding the Turkey facility

“I completely understand your concerns, and understand that I am concerned as well! Please do not confuse our manufacturing facility in Turkey with "outsourcing". This is not the case. Outsourcing is an agreement in which one company hires another company to be responsible for a planned or existing activity. Our team in Germany is completely responsible for the operation of the facility in Turkey. As I have said in other posts, the entire process, materials, quality control and monitoring is controlled by our team in Germany.”

Thank you! Leaves me with so many questions. Why doesn’t the bucket simply say manufactured in Turkey by Tropic Marin like the German bucket does? Anyway that was my only question. Thank you for pointing me towards that statement.

 

[poidog]

This was Lou’s response on 1/3/22 regarding the Turkey facility

“I completely understand your concerns, and understand that I am concerned as well! Please do not confuse our manufacturing facility in Turkey with "outsourcing". This is not the case. Outsourcing is an agreement in which one company hires another company to be responsible for a planned or existing activity. Our team in Germany is completely responsible for the operation of the facility in Turkey. As I have said in other posts, the entire process, materials, quality control and monitoring is controlled by our team in Germany.”

Lou still didn’t answer the question with that reply. It sounds like they found a manufacturer partner, aka co-packer/outsourcing a whatever you want to call it and the agreements put in place allowed TM to control some or all of the process.

From what I can tell, and I may be completely wrong, there are three entities of TM:
1) Tropic Marin - the science base of the company, marketing, sales, distribution
2) Dr Biener GmbH - which is either owned by TM as a subsidy or is an independent company that has been TMs exclusive manufacturer (I can’t read German to really dig through public records).
3) The mystery Turkish facility - outsourced, copacker, TM funded Turkish owned business?

The Turkish product says made under the authority or TM, not Dr Biener. So their long time exclusive manufacturer did not oversee the production in Turkey but it appears rather TM directly did.

Lots of questions around all of this that only TM can answer so I’m not going to go even further in speculation.

 

[FishyFishFish]

I have no idea but I assume Tropic Marin doesn’t own the factory in Turkey.

Think of contracting a company in China to produce a load of parts. You send them the plans, they do the work, and send you the parts back. Now consider that same arrangement, but you actually go there and monitor the production, conduct training and QC etc; it is significantly different. TM has said that they are responsible for the operations, but the statement quoted doesn’t say that they own it.

 

[SinCityRee4r]

I do not want to speculate but was there possible formula changes due to the supply chain issues of the pandemic and some replacement ingredients maybe were used in the mfg process of TMP? I know there was a stint when you could not get you hands on a bucket from either distribution location? Just having a thought here.

 

[areefer01]

I have not mixed it yet. I still have a bit of HW Marine Reefer mix left.

With the number of buckets you have I would honestly call TM. Sorry if you have already done that. I am not sure BRS will address as they are just the middle person. Doesn't hurt to try both though.

Good luck!

 

[ReefOnTheBayou]

@Lou Ekus I had a instant improvement with the addition of another salt. I'm literally watching daily improvements. I lost alot of livestock over this.

Would you please see about putting something into place that would allow us to exchange the turkey salt? I would prefer to get a refund for my salt and a voucher for the dead corals but I know that would never happen. The least yall can do is take back the salt that is not usable!

They must have some type of law or regulation in place to protect the consumer. We bought and used a salt that was suppose to meet a certain standard and for what ever reasons that standard was not reached and caused alot of issues for alot of people.

I know some still haven't came out publicly.

I'm going to sit this one out for awhile. I have alot of questions still and mixed feelings on this. I'm actually getting more and more upset seeing how far I let this go before questioning the salt. I'm upset for changing salts back then when everything was going good. I feel there is more to the story and hoping for a final statement after the 3rd party testing is completed.

Please don't let this go where it looks to be headed. Tropic Marin is better then that.

Stand by the customers and make the best out of a bad situation. The ball is in your court.

 

[GoVols]

@Lou Ekus

Why did TM Germany just not expand their German production facility?

 

[Ryan Avery]

@Lou Ekus

Why did TM Germany just not expand their German production facility?

To cut costs of course.

 

[FishyFishFish]

@Lou Ekus

Why did TM Germany just not expand their German production facility?

Yeah. They should have just gone out and bought a new manufacturing facility and had it built and installed overnight, inside their current facility!

Who knows other than TM, but it might not have been cost. Remember, everyone was moaning and threatening to switch salts as TM Pro was always out of stock. Maybe it was more expensive, but quicker, to get this alternative plant up and running, rather than having to wait for new infrastructure to be built in their German facility.

Or maybe it was cheaper and this was needed to calm those who were complaining that it was getting too expensive. Nobody knows other than TM and everyone throwing stones on these threads are just guessing.

To cut costs of course.

Is that a factual statement, or are you just making unfounded assumptions?

 

[Ryan Avery]

Nobody knows other than TM and everyone throwing stones on these threads are just guessing.

You just wrote three paragraphs of guessing lol

 

[FishyFishFish]

You just wrote three paragraphs of guessing lol

Nope. I wrote 3 paragraphs of possible alternatives to indicate that nobody other than TM knows their business details. Lol.

I find it interesting that the general consensus appears to that people now only want the German salt due to the high confidence in Germany, whilst simultaneously suggesting that this same German company has cut corners and lowered standards to cut costs.

 

[Brian_68]

If they have an issue with their mix they replace it for no cost including shipping with proof of purchase, plain and simple. There should be no debate. It is their fault, not the customers.

 

[Ryan Avery]

Nope. I wrote 3 paragraphs of possible alternatives to indicate that nobody other than TM knows their business details. Lol.

I find it interesting that the general consensus appears to that people now only want the German salt due to the high confidence in Germany, whilst simultaneously suggesting that this same German company has cut corners and lowered standards to cut costs.j

Nope. I wrote 3 paragraphs of possible alternatives to indicate that nobody other than TM knows their business details. Lol.

I find it interesting that the general consensus appears to that people now only want the German salt due to the high confidence in Germany, whilst simultaneously suggesting that this same German company has cut corners and lowered standards to cut costs.

Purely speculation here, but the Turkey buckets say they are made under the authority of TM, meaning it may be a co packer type situation, that’s why people may want the German salt only.