7/13/2023 Note: There is still some question in my mind about using any of the three copper products (Cupramine, Copper Power and Coppersafe) with an EXCESS of any reducing agents. These can include formalin, sodium thiosulfate, Prime or possibly even Amquel. Anything that can break the amine-copper bond can release more toxic ionic copper into the water. You will NOT see an increase in copper from your test kits as mentioned below, the free copper tests the same, it is just more toxic.
Jay Hemdal
First, a few disclaimers:
However, these are completely different forms of copper. Cupramine is "ionic copper" bound on amine, and an ammonia reducer has the potential to break that bound and reduce the Cupramine from the safe Cu2+ form to a very toxic Cu+ form. Coppersafe (and Copper Power) are both chelated coppers. A chelated copper solution is just a blend of two compounds. One is the copper sulfate granule, and the other is an ingredient that allows the copper granules to break down and stay in a liquid state. The ingredient that makes this happen is called a chelator, or sequestering agent.
After getting the green light/more confidence from a chemist about this, I began experimenting on fish by mixing Prime + Copper Power in a QT. I did this repeatedly on different batches of fish, got the copper level as high as 2.5 ppm, tested daily, dosed Prime daily and all the fish are still fine.
Not once did I see a spike in the Cu level after dosing Prime using the Hanna High Range Copper Colorimeter (HI702).
So, I feel it is safe to use & recommend mixing Prime with Copper Power to control ammonia on an as needed basis.
P.S. Prime can also be used with Chloroquine, General Cure and antibiotics. However, I would avoid dosing Prime in conjunction with liquid Prazipro due to the solubilizing agent it contains.
Jay Hemdal
First, a few disclaimers:
- This only applies to using Seachem Prime with Copper Power.
- I have not tested any other ammonia reducers with any other forms of copper. Seachem, for example, states right on their website that it is dangerous to mix any ammonia reducer with their Cupramine copper product.
- The manufacturer of Coppersafe (Fritz) has told me that it is safe to use with ammonia reducers as well, but I have not independently verified this.
However, these are completely different forms of copper. Cupramine is "ionic copper" bound on amine, and an ammonia reducer has the potential to break that bound and reduce the Cupramine from the safe Cu2+ form to a very toxic Cu+ form. Coppersafe (and Copper Power) are both chelated coppers. A chelated copper solution is just a blend of two compounds. One is the copper sulfate granule, and the other is an ingredient that allows the copper granules to break down and stay in a liquid state. The ingredient that makes this happen is called a chelator, or sequestering agent.After getting the green light/more confidence from a chemist about this, I began experimenting on fish by mixing Prime + Copper Power in a QT. I did this repeatedly on different batches of fish, got the copper level as high as 2.5 ppm, tested daily, dosed Prime daily and all the fish are still fine.
Not once did I see a spike in the Cu level after dosing Prime using the Hanna High Range Copper Colorimeter (HI702).So, I feel it is safe to use & recommend mixing Prime with Copper Power to control ammonia on an as needed basis.
P.S. Prime can also be used with Chloroquine, General Cure and antibiotics. However, I would avoid dosing Prime in conjunction with liquid Prazipro due to the solubilizing agent it contains.
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