Pump Differences

Empress · Jul 12, 2017

I need help understanding the differences between submersible return pumps. My tank is 240 plus a 55 sump. It's 8 foot long. The pipe that runs out of the pump goes straight up towards the ceiling about 6 foot. Then the 2 returns run horizontally across the top of the tank another 7 foot or so. The sump is on the floor alongside the tank (not under the tank). I would like to have at least 4000 gph run thru the system. Right now I just have 2400 and I don't really think it's good enough so I'm looking to buy a bigger, better one. But I want one that will do the job right.

My questions are:

1. What kind of pump do I need that is designed to push water straight up? This is most important because I want this new pump to last a long time without stressing under pressure. Some pumps do better just pushing water horizontal; I need vertical (straight up).
2. What is the difference between a magnetic and electronic? Which is better?
3. What's the best pump (for what I need) that is cost efficient, durable, won't leak, and doesn't heat the water tooo too much.

Thanks guys,
Empress

RamsReef · Jul 13, 2017

0. You are going to have a hard time with one pump doing 4000 gph, if you have the room and want 4000 gph I would go with 2 x return pumps, that way you can also service one while one remains in service.
1. You only have 6 feet + 1 feet (Fittings) of head pressure, most pumps will do this no problem.
2. This is usually an AC vs DC pump. If you find an AC (Magnetic) pump at the rated flow and don't want to adjust it your fine. If you want to adjust it or run it derated (Below rated flow) then go DC (Electronic).
3. You want the magical pump, cheap and reliable, good luck. I would go with 1 x reeflo pump or 2 x Ecotech L1
http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/pumps-plumbing/external-pumps/reeflo.html
http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/ecotech-vectra-l1-dc.html

Empress · Jul 13, 2017

Thanks Ramasule for your advice. Do you think it's possible to run an External pump with my setup? My sump isn't drilled (and don't really want to go that route). Would I still be able to pull water from the sump if the pump is on the floor? Or maybe I can put it on a small table next to the sump? I've looked on youtube but can't really find anyone with an external pump without the drilled sump. What would you do?

RamsReef · Jul 13, 2017

I would stay at 2400 GPH for 240Gal tank and spend my money elsewhere.
Otherwise I would go with 2x Ecotech L1, each with their own outlet ballvalve / union, into either a Y or each to a single return.

Callok · Jul 13, 2017

That is a lot of flow for that size tank and sump. I have a similar setup, 300 gal, 60 gal sump, and I have one reef octopus Vario-6 which is rated at 1720 gph, and I am only running it 85%. Before that I had 2 AC pumps each @ 1650gph, and I felt there was way too much flow. I have 2-2" returns and they were gurgling constantly but I ran both since one was not quite enough, and they were not adjustable. Since changing to the single pump with less flow, I have not noticed a change in water quality, skimmer output or chaeto growth in the refugium.

If you really feel like you want that much flow, I would go with 2 pumps since if one fails, the other can still easily maintain your system until you get a replacement. The other issue is that much flow will produce heat from either a large single pump or 2 smaller ones. I run mine externally to minimize heat transfer.

The newer dc pumps offer controllable flow, built in feed timers, and soft start which can prolong impeller life, but their true lifespan is unknown since they are fairly new. My old Velocity T4, AC pumps ran for over 10 years before one of the bearings locked up.

revhtree · Jul 13, 2017

Bump for a good thread!

Empress · Jul 13, 2017

The reason I wanted more flow is because of head loss. The water has to flow about 14' before hitting the water in the DT.

I'm starting to wonder if there's something stuck in the pipes. Any ideas on how to clean pipes without having to take them all apart?

Callok- every thing you said makes perfect sense which reminds me that I USED to have more flow than what I needed. In fact I had to turn the control valve down. Gotta be something in the pipes or maybe I just need to clean out the pump. It's almost 2 years old.

RamsReef · Jul 13, 2017

You don't get head pressure from horizontal runs...

Vertical head pressure comes from gravity.
Some head pressure comes from fittings/valves..
Very little to none from the pipe itself (drag)

As I stated you only have 6 feet of head.

Empress · Jul 13, 2017

Only 2 90 degree elbows. I'll bet the pump just needs a real scrubbing that's all then it should run nice and smooth. I use kalk in my ato which sometimes calcifies on hard surfaces. Get out the toothbrushes and vinegar this weekend.

Thanks for helping me figure this out. My pump is fine after all. You guys saved me some bucks! [emoji886]

Callok · Jul 13, 2017

Empress said:
I'm starting to wonder if there's something stuck in the pipes. Any ideas on how to clean pipes without having to take them all apart?

Callok- every thing you said makes perfect sense which reminds me that I USED to have more flow than what I needed. In fact I had to turn the control valve down. Gotta be something in the pipes or maybe I just need to clean out the pump. It's almost 2 years old.

If you want to make sure there is nothing in the pipes, hook up a temporary return from the pump using flex hose. You can even hookup a garden hose. Most box store stock NPT to garden hose adapters. If the flow is significantly better than you have something in your return pipe. You can try and back-flush it by then hooking the hose to the tank return end of your plumbing, but it may get messy.

Good luck

Empress · Jul 14, 2017

I never thought of that! Awesome idea. If the flow isn't any better after a good scrubbing, I'll take the pump outside and hook it up to the garden house like you said. And water my garden at the same time (lol). If the water comes out of the hose at full blast then I will most likely have something stuck in the pipes (ugh). Back-flushing sounds like a nightmare with lights, screens and everything in my way. Hopefully I won't have to revert to that. But I will do what I must.

I love it here because I always get such excellent tips and advice from everybody. Thanks so much. Happy Reefin' and enjoy your weekend.

Empress >^..^<

biecacka · Jul 14, 2017

You can try the reeflo hammerhead for more flow, or get something like an Iwaki. The latter is pressure rated and will push up that 6ft like its nothing at all.

corey

Empress · Jul 14, 2017

Those I believe are external. I can only have submersible. Maybe some day I will upgrade my sump to have drilled holes. But thanks for the suggestion.