Question about "stability"??

[Mattj815]

Hi All,

I had a question regarding stability. I guess both tank stability and parameters or water stability.

So my tank is about 2 years old now but it hit a rough patch late last year with me buying a new house and moving.

I certainly wasnt on top of it and things went downhill. A gha problem,lack of water changes etc.

This went on from about oct to this past jan. Sometime in Jan i I finally said I have to get this thing back in shape. And so far so good. My gha is almost completely gone. My parameters are good and getting better. Still a few things to tweak.

Most inhabitants are doing good. Fish are all healthy and look good. The few corals I have aside from a torch, which I just posted about, are looking good. Just added a rbta that seems to be doing well too.

My question is after a decline on a tank thats been running, how long is long enough to be considerd stable again? 2 weeks 2 months?

Obviously our tanks are never "stable" as they are always changing. And I probably shouldve asked this before I started adding stuff again. I did look into if certain params would hurt the anemone and most said it would be fine.

But I am really determined to get into sps and just wondering how long I should wait before trying?

 

[brandon429]

lol i thought he meant the bottled doser from seachem, stability, to help with gha issues after a recent tank decline.

 

[brandon429]

.

 

[sde1500]

So actually answering the question... I'd say give it a few more months, but there is no correct answer really. You are back on the right track, but the toughest time of year is coming, summer. People make plans, they travel, stay out side, look at the tank less. Keep the stability up to summer, and I'd say you can start looking at adding more delicate corals.

 

[Crustaceon]

I always figure a tank that will consume and reduce nitrates on its own if you stop feeding is a stable one from a filtration standpoint. Sometimes a tank move will throw the bacterial equilibrium out of whack and it will stop denitrifying for some time. IME, this takes a month or two. A stable tank from a chemical standpoint is one that has a steady and reasonable depletion of alkalinity, calcium and magnesium, indicative of natural calcification processes occurring.

 

[NS Mike D]

You added an rbta while pondering adding SPS. While there are inexpensive and easy to keep SPS, generally we think the opposite with SPS.

That being said, an anemone can do damage to corals in a flash. They might decide to go for a walk and sting everything in its path or might just flat out start to die and release its toxins in to the tank. Keep in mind that can grow extending their reach. So I'd would hold off adding SPS until I was sure the RBTA was set it its ways. I would be very upset if a nem moved and wiped out hundreds of money in frags. I had a bta wipe out a torch and hammer overnight. Wasn't a happy tank day for me.

You can start with easy sps like birds nest (although I had better success with acros but was oh for three with birdsnest, go figure) and graduate up the ladder over time.

 

[Mattj815]

lol i thought he meant the bottled doser from seachem, stability, to help with gha issues after a recent tank decline.

I was thankful for the reply but was confused as to how that was relevant to my question lol

 

[brandon429]

you can tell Im ready to rip clean some tanks!!

 

[Mattj815]

You added an rbta while pondering adding SPS. While there are inexpensive and easy to keep SPS, generally we think the opposite with SPS.

That being said, an anemone can do damage to corals in a flash. They might decide to go for a walk and sting everything in its path or might just flat out start to die and release its toxins in to the tank. Keep in mind that can grow extending their reach. So I'd would hold off adding SPS until I was sure the RBTA was set it its ways. I would be very upset if a nem moved and wiped out hundreds of money in frags. I had a bta wipe out a torch and hammer overnight. Wasn't a happy tank day for me.

You can start with easy sps like birds nest (although I had better success with acros but was oh for three with birdsnest, go figure) and graduate up the ladder over time.

I hear you on the possible destruction of other pieces. Ive always wanted a nem and am mostly into lps.

My interest in sps is new. I am going to start off small and "cheap". Im not good enough to add expensive coral to my tank. To date the rbta is the most expensive livestock I have purchased.

I have tried it in the past with a monti cap and a stylophora i think? Either way it didnt work out. I am determined to get my tank in check and keep it there. Finally settled into the new house, got my water station up so its become easier.

I have heard from others that theyve had better success with acros too.

 

[NS Mike D]

stability v maturity


Early on, looking at my logs, I'd say my tank was very stable. I recall testing was a predicable. But I couldn't keep sps. Then a few years go by, same stable parameters, and boom. SPS were not dying, even encrusting and growing.

I could be wrong, but I attribute it to tank maturity - ie. the microfauna that develop and forms an ecosystem with the corals and fish. I can't prove it, but I suspect the bacteria and other life in the water column are being used in on form or another by the corals.

of course all that microfauna helps stability as well


read up on @brandon429 stuff. A tank that is building up detritus is arguably becoming unstable and/or making for a losing battle with algae. His rip clean approach is basically a way to remove all that built up detritus from the sand bed and rock along with algae without compromising the microfauna. While it seems drastic, the evidences points to more stability.

 

[Mattj815]

stability v maturity


Early on, looking at my logs, I'd say my tank was very stable. I recall testing was a predicable. But I couldn't keep sps. Then a few years go by, same stable parameters, and boom. SPS were not dying, even encrusting and growing.

I could be wrong, but I attribute it to tank maturity - ie. the microfauna that develop and forms an ecosystem with the corals and fish. I can't prove it, but I suspect the bacteria and other life in the water column are being used in on form or another by the corals.

of course all that microfauna helps stability as well


read up on @brandon429 stuff. A tank that is building up detritus is arguably becoming unstable and/or making for a losing battle with algae. His rip clean approach is basically a way to remove all that built up detritus from the sand bed and rock along with algae without compromising the microfauna. While it seems drastic, the evidences points to more stability.

So is a tank still maturing as time goes on but care isnt exactly where it should be?

Ive always read that bacteria will ebb and flow based on bioload. So it may have been reduced when I only had 1 fish in there and few coral. But over the past 2 months I have added 3 more fish and a few frags etc. I have had no ammonia spike so I should assume that bacteria levels are close to where they should be? I also started micro dosing nopox while testing and have reduced no3 from about 20 to about 5 or less. I now use it sparingly based on what tests say. I dont know if thats the right way to use it but I didnt want to zero out my no3.

I dont know how to articulate what Im trying to ask but, if water parameters are good for 2 weeks is it the same as it being good for 2 months? I know there are other factors that come into play.

That probably wouldnt work for a tank that is brand new. But one that is 2 years? I have seen people have success with a lot of things that are supposed to wait for a mature tank( nems, sps) is that just a case of extremely good care?

 

[sde1500]

is that just a case of extremely good care?

Certainly possible, or a transfer from a previous matured tank. Your tank may be more mature, but you've made changes recently, cleaned up algae, added new creatures. That means it isn't stable. My tank now is at the 4 year mark, suffered bouts of neglect as well, and is just really feeling to be coming into a period where things are really mature and stable. It takes time.

 

[NS Mike D]

Bacteria is far more complex than juts the ammonia cycle. Microfauna is more than bacteria, it's also the worms, pods and other critters.

Add that we are infants when it comes to understanding the complex interactions that occur in a reef.

Keep in mind this. Everything you add in a tank affects the balance. Im a new tank there is only so much nitrifying bacteria. Add another fish and feed it and it adds ammonia. In a new tank the bacteria may not be sufficient to rapidly deal with that NH3, but it will cause the bacteria population to grow. The more ammonia the fish produce the larger the population the bacteria. The larger the population the faster it binds the NH3.

As a tank matures and populates with all sort of life, you can expect it to have more buffering capacity to handle outside influences. Much like how ALK is a pH buffer. High alk, the less affect acids will have on Ph = stability.

Then there is the concept of how these animals interact. The waste of one animal/plant/microbe is the life force of another. When animals spawn it's a boom to the fish and corals. bacterial are consumed by corals. All this is complex and part of a healthy tank that tanks times (as in years) to mature.

 

[Bob Lauson]

I think that stability is a tough question. My tank was up and running for 3 years and the SPS coral were thriving ...I was in the happy zone. My wife and I were out of town In Florida and were at the airport to fly back to MI. My email alert said the controller was disconnected. I checked the internet and we had an ice/snow storm and power was out. We were 10 hours from getting home. By the time I got home the aquarium was down to 60 deg F. In the morning I was able to get a generator in the morning. I lost a bunch of corals, had a Cyano outbreak followed by a mild Dino re-occurrence. It took about 8 months to get back to where I was “stable” and by that I mean happy. It is always about the journey and aquarium life ebbs and flows always. Quite frankly this forum helped me and continues to help me through it. I am not the most engaged on this site but the information and the people here are amazing.