Question: Big Sump ATO?

[Dylan Grech]

I have 2 fairly large sumps:

1. 80cm(l) x 50cm(w) x 40cm(h)
2. 90cm(l) x 50cm(w) x 40cm(h)

And they are connected together to work as one sump however this proving to be a challenge when it comes to evaporation...

Any ATO that I looked needs the water level to lower by atleast 1cm which for me would mean almost 10ltrs of water... ( (0.8 x 0.5 x 0.01) + (0.9 x 0.5 x 0.01) ). Is there anyway to deal with this?

Final note: Total water volume is ±900ltr

 

[Cherub]

if you are adding too much at once you could set up your ato on a timer to run 2-3 times a day for a short period top break it up. it also prevents overfilling if it got stuck for whatever reason.

 

[Cherub]

to, not top. fat fingered...

 

[bif24701]

I have 2 fairly large sumps:

1. 80cm(l) x 50cm(w) x 40cm(h)
2. 90cm(l) x 50cm(w) x 40cm(h)

And they are connected together to work as one sump however this proving to be a challenge when it comes to evaporation...

Any ATO that I looked needs the water level to lower by atleast 1cm which for me would mean almost 10ltrs of water... ( (0.8 x 0.5 x 0.01) + (0.9 x 0.5 x 0.01) ). Is there anyway to deal with this?

Final note: Total water volume is ±900ltr

You need to some how construct a smaller/lower section. House the return intake here and your ATO switches.

If you know your evaporation rate of your system and rate of doser a timed program can be very accurate for ATO is doser rate is constant.

 

[Dylan Grech]

if you are adding too much at once you could set up your ato on a timer to run 2-3 times a day for a short period top break it up. it also prevents overfilling if it got stuck for whatever reason.

As much as I like this it would be a bit more complex to build as I have an RODI supply rather than a container with pump combo therefore I would need a solenoid and I've seen way too many fail to trust one especially since the house is empty for 10hrs+ a day

 

[Cherub]

no worries, it was just an idea. I use an ATO with a maxijet and hose. I have it run for 30 seconds at a time twice a day. after those 30 seconds the pump power it cut off. It's just a regular digital timer you plug in, nothing fancy. cost 20 bucks or so at a home improvement store

 

[Dylan Grech]

You need to some how construct a smaller/lower section. House the return intake here and your ATO switches.

If you know your evaporation rate of your system and rate of doser a timed program can be very accurate for ATO is doser rate is constant.

This sounds like a great idea. The lower chamber would fluctuate a lot faster and the dosing pump would make sure that if the solenoid fails I'm only dripping water therefore if anything fails I would have plenty of time till anything floods. I think I might be able to even get this build for cheaper by using drip irrigation rather than a dosing pump.

 

[bif24701]

This sounds like a great idea. The lower chamber would fluctuate a lot faster and the dosing pump would make sure that if the solenoid fails I'm only dripping water therefore if anything fails I would have plenty of time till anything floods. I think I might be able to even get this build for cheaper by using drip irrigation rather than a dosing pump.

A BRS 50ml pump and timer is all you need.
Pump is constant even with level changes in ATO container.
No back siphon
Accurate
Dependable

 

[sebastiaan1985]

Think something is going wrong here...

I assume you have several baffles in your sump, putting a level sensor in on of the chambers (I use return chamber which is smallest in my case), the level would only drop 1 cm in that chamber. This would be far less than the 10L that was calculated.
So IMO no need for difficult calculations with dosing pumps or timers (which cannot account for different evaporation that occurs with changed outdoor temp and humidity), just add the level switch to your smallest chamber and you will be fine.

Based on your sump, with a width of 50cm, creating a chamber of 20cm and a change of waterlevel of 1cm would turn out to be 1L of water added each time.
My final chamber is about 10cm, so for you this would add up to be 0.5L of water each time the switch turns on the ATO.

 

[Ty Hamatake]

This sounds like a pretty cool setup, I'm sure a picture would help clarify some stuff! Have you explored the option of using a simple float valve? If I read one of your replies correctly, it is hooked up directly to your RO/DI. Does it have am auto-off feature or will it just remain on indefinitely? This may or may not work depending on your PSI.

 

[Dylan Grech]

A BRS 50ml pump and timer is all you need.
Pump is constant even with level changes in ATO container.
No back siphon
Accurate
Dependable

I don't have a container it's hooked straight to RODI

 

[Dylan Grech]

Think something is going wrong here...

I assume you have several baffles in your sump, putting a level sensor in on of the chambers (I use return chamber which is smallest in my case), the level would only drop 1 cm in that chamber. This would be far less than the 10L that was calculated.
So IMO no need for difficult calculations with dosing pumps or timers (which cannot account for different evaporation that occurs with changed outdoor temp and humidity), just add the level switch to your smallest chamber and you will be fine.

Based on your sump, with a width of 50cm, creating a chamber of 20cm and a change of waterlevel of 1cm would turn out to be 1L of water added each time.
My final chamber is about 10cm, so for you this would add up to be 0.5L of water each time the switch turns on the ATO.

Yes I do have several baffles however I have set it up in a way that the water level in the sump is constant throughout to make sure no chamber can ever overflow.

 

[Dylan Grech]

This sounds like a pretty cool setup, I'm sure a picture would help clarify some stuff! Have you explored the option of using a simple float valve? If I read one of your replies correctly, it is hooked up directly to your RO/DI. Does it have am auto-off feature or will it just remain on indefinitely? This may or may not work depending on your PSI.

I'll get you guys some pictures later today to clarify my setup a lot better

 

[Ty Hamatake]

I'll get you guys some pictures later today to clarify my setup a lot better

Ha ha, it may help.

 

[Dylan Grech]

So guys here are some pictures of my filtration system.

Note: This is not complete yet but you can have a good idea of where it's heading.

Tank View
Left Door: Overflow / Protein Skimmer (External) / Supply room
Left Door (Under Tank): Sump #1 (Drains, Mechanical Media, Bio Media, Reactor Zone, Probes)
Right Door (Under Tank): Bio Media, Heater. Refrugium, Return Pump
Right Door (Closed): Electrical Panel

Overflow Area
Left to right:
15mm grey pipe: RODI supply (I have a whole house RODI system)
40mm next to overflow: Return for new pump coming soon Jebao 15000
20mm with ball valve at the bottom: Connects to house sewage system for draining the sumps
50mm overflow + 63mm backup overflow
Another 32mm will be connected to this overflow box that will feed the external skimmer which is being installed this weekend.

Left Sump
First Chamber:
Thermal Probe (not visible)
Drains from overflow
Supply from pump to recalculate water in sump
Temporary mechanical media which will be replace by filter socks, bio media (crystal bio / marine pure)
Second Chamber:
Will be filled with all kinds of probes when I get the budget for them and some filter floss

Ontop of left sump
40mm Return line from pump and reactor (still needs to be fully plumbed)

Right Sump
First Chamber: Bio Media (Crystal Bio which will sink soon 1-2 weeks left) & heater
Second Chamber: Caulerpa refreugium (24/7 on grow light)
Third Chamber: Return pump & ATO sensor soon (Yes the eheim pump is temporary)
Note: The difference in pipe diameter from current pump to the new one coming hahahah


So to sum it all up the system is meant to have a one water level through out however I already drilled my last partition to get a low water level zone therefore my ATO problem is fixed but since you asked for pics I hope you find it interesting